Powder Measures

[graftyman]

So, I got the last piece I needed in the mail today to start reloading. I tumbled some 9mm once fired cases last night and tonight set out to do 20. 4 1/2 hours later I have 20. I'm thorough frustrated though.

I was blazing along at a good clip, I deprimed and resized about 100 cartridges of brass. I then primed 20 of them and was ready to go. I then belled each brass and I'm pretty proud of myself. All the practicing on dummy rounds was paying off, well other than the first primer going in sideways. Not sure how that happened.

So, I pull out the powder, the funnel, the Powder measure the Lyman 100 XP Digital Scale and the Lee Old school scale. For the life of me I could not get consistent powder measures to come out of the Lee Perfect Powder measure. I'd tweak the settings, get a charge that was on, then run it a few times to make sure the charge was right then try and measure out the powder. I would measure, check it on the digital scale and if it was within .1 grains I would then double check it on the Lee weight scale. By the time I got a measure consistent it would just change on me.

I thought it was the scales, but I calibrated them both. Not only with the calibration stuff that comes with it but the RCBS check weights I have.

After hours of messing with it I was finally able to get 20 loads that weighed in at 4.5 grains of 231 (Win brass, CCI 500 primer, Win 115 FMJ bullet and 4.5 gr Win 231 powder. OAL at 1.1555) for the 20 bullets. The measure without touching it would swing from 4.2 gr to 4.8 gr (even 4.9 a few times). That is too big of a swing considering that is the full scale from what the books say for safe powder ranges.

Other than the powder measure fiasco, I'm pretty happy with the outcome. I checked and doubled checked OAL , case width, Cross referenced 4 different places for the powder charge.

So, my question is, What is a reliable, decent reasonably priced powder measure that doesn't jump all over the place?

Here is a picture of my first kids.

 

[Gammon]

Get rid of the digital scale.

 

[RKG]

I have no experience with the Lee powder measure or with 231 powder, so I’m not saying that any of the following will cure your problem. Nonetheless, a couple of general tips on throwing powder charges.

One: after filling the hopper, throw 10-15 charges into the powder can. This will settle the powder in the hopper in a reasonably consistent way.

Two: Do not let the hopper get below 2/3 full before adding more powder.

Three: when throwing charges and moving the lever so as to expose the cavity to the hopper, do it with a sharp motion. When you move the lever to dump the charge into the case, do the same. This not only helps to fill the cavity in a consistent way and make sure that all of its contents dump into the case, but the vibration from whacking the adjuster against the frame helps to keep the column of powder in the hopper in a consistent settlement. It is important that the strokes be done the same way each time.

Four: most powder measures come with more than one cylinder, each having a different bore diameter for a different range of charge weights. Do not try to throw small pistol charges with a large bore cylinder (with the adjustment set very shallow); you’ll get more consistent results with a smaller bore diameter and deeper setting with the adjuster.

 

[BossHarley]

Another very important point is that the table/bench that the scale is on needs to be very stable. Any vibrations, movement by you in the room, air flow - will lead to movement of the scale.

I don't know about the Lyman digital scale, but unless it is very old I would tend to believe the scale - particularly if you are able to calibrate using weights etc.

 

[graftyman]

The table/bench is pretty solid it doesn't move. The scale is brand new.

RKG: the hopper was only about 1/4 full, I'll fill it up more and try it again. I was looking at pistol measures today and almost bought the RCBS one but they didn't ahve the measuring disks I needed. It's been there for a while too. 1988 catalog in the box

 

[drgrant]

I use an RCBS uniflow. It tends to throw charges pretty accurately once you get it honed in, at least for most powder types.

If you buy one just make sure that the nut that holds the piston thread thing in place is in TIGHT. You do not want this nut loosening up while dumping charges... I snugged it up once and it hasn't moved since.

-Mike

 

[center442]

Some excellent advice above. Check the following:

1) Did you run one or two full hoppers of powder through the Lee measure? Lee suggests that you do this to "lubricate" the measure and remove any static electricity.

2) WW 231 is a ball powder, IIRC, so it should meter consistently. Fill the measure to the top. Calibrate both scales. Set the measure to throw a random amount and throw 10 charges into the pan for your Lee balance scale. Record the weight. Now dump that same powder into the pan of your Lyman scale and weigh it. The weight should be virtually identical on both scales. If there is any significant difference then one of your scales is off.

3) When working the measure you need to be consistent. Your "throw" should be quick and snappy, not slow and soft. Make sure you're hitting the stop firmly on both the up and down swing.

4) Fill the measure up and add more when it gets down about 1/2 way. Make sure that the hopper is turned to the full open position, otherwise you'll get an inconsistent trickle of powder into the metering chamber.

I have three powder measures, one of which is a Lee. They are all amazingly consistent - if I'm consistent. If I throw a charge that doesn't "feel" right, especially with flake or "rod" powders, I dump it back in the hopper and do it again. Pay particular attention to #3 & #4 above.

You shouldn't be getting such wide variances with that powder and measure.

 

[RustyFN]

Some excellent advice above. Check the following:

1) Did you run one or two full hoppers of powder through the Lee measure? Lee suggests that you do this to "lubricate" the measure and remove any static electricity.

2) WW 231 is a ball powder, IIRC, so it should meter consistently. Fill the measure to the top. Calibrate both scales. Set the measure to throw a random amount and throw 10 charges into the pan for your Lee balance scale. Record the weight. Now dump that same powder into the pan of your Lyman scale and weigh it. The weight should be virtually identical on both scales. If there is any significant difference then one of your scales is off.

3) When working the measure you need to be consistent. Your "throw" should be quick and snappy, not slow and soft. Make sure you're hitting the stop firmly on both the up and down swing.

4) Fill the measure up and add more when it gets down about 1/2 way. Make sure that the hopper is turned to the full open position, otherwise you'll get an inconsistent trickle of powder into the metering chamber.

I have three powder measures, one of which is a Lee. They are all amazingly consistent - if I'm consistent. If I throw a charge that doesn't "feel" right, especially with flake or "rod" powders, I dump it back in the hopper and do it again. Pay particular attention to #3 & #4 above.

You shouldn't be getting such wide variances with that powder and measure.

Good advice there. I don't use the PPM I use the disk. From the people I know that use the PPM they say it settles in after you run a hopper or two through it. You can also run some powder graphite through it.
Rusty

 

[graftyman]

Update:

1. I have all my fingers and my gun is still in one piece after shooting my first 20 rounds. Actually everything went very well, all cycled, fired and where pretty much on target. I was very happy.

2. I just spent some time just running the measurer again and checking the charge on both scales. I think my biggest problem before was not having the powder hopper full. Tonight the measurer was dropping near perfect charges at 4.5 gr with little variances. I will still measure on both scales for a while before putting the powder into the case but atleast it is settling down.

My .40 crimp die just came in today. So after a batch of 9 I am going to load some .40 up to check out my new match grade .40 barrel for the G-32.

Thanks for all your suggestions, the consistent pull, plus the level of powder helped me out greatly.