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Possession vs Ownership
- Thread starter Zeke
- Start date
From the ATF @ https://www.atf.gov/firearms/qa/whom-may-unlicensed-person-transfer-firearms-under-gca
A person may loan or rent a firearm to a resident of any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes, if he or she or she does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. Another exception is provided for transfers of firearms to nonresidents to carry out a lawful bequest or acquisition by intestate succession. This exception would authorize the transfer of a firearm to a nonresident who inherits a firearm under the will of a decedent.
A person may transfer a firearm to a licensee in any State. However, a firearm other than a curio or relic may not be transferred interstate to a licensed collector.
[18 U.S.C 922(a)(5) and 922(d); 27 CFR 478.30, 478.32]
Last Reviewed September 23, 2016
A person may loan or rent a firearm to a resident of any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes, if he or she or she does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. Another exception is provided for transfers of firearms to nonresidents to carry out a lawful bequest or acquisition by intestate succession. This exception would authorize the transfer of a firearm to a nonresident who inherits a firearm under the will of a decedent.
A person may transfer a firearm to a licensee in any State. However, a firearm other than a curio or relic may not be transferred interstate to a licensed collector.
[18 U.S.C 922(a)(5) and 922(d); 27 CFR 478.30, 478.32]
Last Reviewed September 23, 2016
This is a facetious question. What makes you state that a new Glock is prohibited?
Glockster30
NES Member
You left out all assault-pistols. Sig MPX, HK SP-5K, AR variants, etc...
Those things do exist north of the wall.
"This is a facetious question. What makes you state that a new Glock is prohibited?"
To the keyboard nitpickers: sorry for my lack of expression. By prohibited I meant unable to walk into a dealer and buy new. Paying way more for a used non-collectible than new, retail cost just seems crazy to me.
To the keyboard nitpickers: sorry for my lack of expression. By prohibited I meant unable to walk into a dealer and buy new. Paying way more for a used non-collectible than new, retail cost just seems crazy to me.
fencer
NES Member
Hmm. I would recommend you wait for one of the members who are more well versed in the law than I am, like LenS or Dr. Grant or Rob Boudrie, to reply or send them a message.
I looked a little and couldn't find anything that put a time limit on how long you can "borrow" it. There is plenty about straw purchases and interstate sales, but nothing about lending. And how is any one going to know how long you have had it?
However, in Mass, I bet they would assume a firearm purchased by another person, in your possession, might be stolen. You would likely be charged, even if those charges are dropped. And depending on where the arrest was made, you may have suitability issues upon renewal.
Two scenarios here. You are stopped for something minor. They find firearm. It comes back to someone else. They charge you with possession of a stolen firearm. Your buddy confirms he lent it to you, and charges are dropped. But! Now when filling out renewal paper work you have to answer "Yes" to have you ever been arrested for a crime that carries a max sentence of 2.5 years or more. The question is arrested.. NOT convicted. Then you will have to explain the charge, and the licensing officer, who is probably not a moron, will know exactly what's up. Now it's up to him if you get to keep your permission slip.
Second scenario, you are forced to use your firearm to defend yourself or someone you love. They add the possession charge. But that is the least of your worries.
To me, I think it makes more sense to just spend the extra 200 bucks that the glock will cost you in Mass than risk all the BS. I would probably lose a lot more than 200 bucks if I got jammed up and had to get rid of a bunch of stuff. It's not a hunting rifle or shotgun that you are borrowing for a season. It is a carry gun
Again, I am not a lawyer and do not profess to be an expert like some others here. It is entirely possible that you would be guilty of a much more serious crime, but my half hearted search did not find anything.
I looked a little and couldn't find anything that put a time limit on how long you can "borrow" it. There is plenty about straw purchases and interstate sales, but nothing about lending. And how is any one going to know how long you have had it?
However, in Mass, I bet they would assume a firearm purchased by another person, in your possession, might be stolen. You would likely be charged, even if those charges are dropped. And depending on where the arrest was made, you may have suitability issues upon renewal.
Two scenarios here. You are stopped for something minor. They find firearm. It comes back to someone else. They charge you with possession of a stolen firearm. Your buddy confirms he lent it to you, and charges are dropped. But! Now when filling out renewal paper work you have to answer "Yes" to have you ever been arrested for a crime that carries a max sentence of 2.5 years or more. The question is arrested.. NOT convicted. Then you will have to explain the charge, and the licensing officer, who is probably not a moron, will know exactly what's up. Now it's up to him if you get to keep your permission slip.
Second scenario, you are forced to use your firearm to defend yourself or someone you love. They add the possession charge. But that is the least of your worries.
To me, I think it makes more sense to just spend the extra 200 bucks that the glock will cost you in Mass than risk all the BS. I would probably lose a lot more than 200 bucks if I got jammed up and had to get rid of a bunch of stuff. It's not a hunting rifle or shotgun that you are borrowing for a season. It is a carry gun
Again, I am not a lawyer and do not profess to be an expert like some others here. It is entirely possible that you would be guilty of a much more serious crime, but my half hearted search did not find anything.
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Unless there is an incident (lost firearm found and turned; need for a MAJOR fishing expedition) where they do an ATF forward trace (mfgr -> dealer -> purchaser -> interview purchaser regarding private resale, etc.), the only thing that happens when LE "runs a gun" is that is either comes back with an NCIC "hit" as a stolen gun or does not.
VERY few states have affirmative registration where a gun must "come back to a person" and those generally have other laws that would make the loan unlawful. For example, in NY one's pistol permit lists the SN of all handguns you may possess, and it is not even legal to take possession of a friends gun when he is being loaded into an ambulance after a heart attack unless you had the foresight to list the gun on your permit in addition to his.
The safest way to get a Glock is via FFL (yeah, I know - tough) or bequest. Games like "borrowing" a gun "forever" fall into the PSGWSP category.
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Varmint
NES Member
I was NOT trying to pick nits. Words have meaning and there is no such thing as a "prohibited Glock". Many people think that there is some sort of ban where none exists. I am merely trying to clear that up. No slight implied or directed your way.
Cheers.
An item that you don't actually legally own can be in your possession. Whether or not it SHOULD be, and is legal, is a different question.
EddieZoom
NES Member
