Pistol Caliber Carbine and Urban SHTF

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What are your thoughts on PCCs for SHTF in an urban environment?

I'm thinking of scenarios such as political civil unrest, FSA riots if the EBT system goes down, etc. where order would be restored but not for days or weeks--something like the LA riots. In an environment where buildings are clustered in close quarters, would one be better served with a PCC like a sub2000 with compatible pistol mags, as opposed to an AR or AK platform rifle?
 

LuvDog

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Not necessarily for SHTF, but one of the reasons I built by 9mm SBR was for close quarters situations.

mine takes Glock mags... which are plentiful.
 

Jason m

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Cant go wrong with a decent 12G pump with a 18+ barrel and a extended tube for a few extra shells. A semi auto carbine is a great second, light recoil easy to follow up with shots, plus easy to load.
Just I like simple things like pump shotguns and buck shot even #4 bird shot, lots of bad stuff coming out at one pull of the trigger VS a single pistol bullet.

Jason.
 

SKumar

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The Sub2k's folding ability is the winning feature when you're on-the-go in SHTF. Recoil, build quality, sights, all pale in comparison to the compactness of the kel tec. To be on the run and have a rifle stashed on you is priceless.
 

seanc

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Really kind of depends on ranges.. a lot to be said for AR withd collapsing stock for far away. Or a'short 870 mos 500 for close... or a ps90 or a mares leg/ lever gun I'm 357or 44....
 

xjma99

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Really kind of depends on ranges.. a lot to be said for AR withd collapsing stock for far away. Or a'short 870 mos 500 for close... or a ps90 or a mares leg/ lever gun I'm 357or 44....

....or an SBR with a can....and night vision.
 

tuna

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My go to is a Savage 520, breaks down to two 20" sections. Not as quick as the Sub2000, but good.
PCCs have an advantage over the shotgun in many situations, no just don't have one yet, and 12ga is always "good enough".
 

Koolmoose

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Prior to the defeat of the Felonious Pantsuit l was worried about the potential ban of all semi autos, especially in MA. I added a Henry lever action and a Ruger bolt action rifle, both in 357 mag, to the arsenal. I really like my 357 revolvers and see them as very useful in SHTF situations​. Plus, I thought (potentially incorrect) that they wouldn't be coming after traditional Fudd guns right away. I saw these guns as insurance against efforts to to​ take away all semi autos. My thinking at the time was that even a vastly empowered, democratally controlled gov't wouldn't dare to take away FUDD guns. Good insurance!
 

drgrant

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What are your thoughts on PCCs for SHTF in an urban environment?

I'm thinking of scenarios such as political civil unrest, FSA riots if the EBT system goes down, etc. where order would be restored but not for days or weeks--something like the LA riots. In an environment where buildings are clustered in close quarters, would one be better served with a PCC like a sub2000 with compatible pistol mags, as opposed to an AR or AK platform rifle?

If you have a choice I would always pick an AR or AK. On the other hand a PCC is a lot better than nothing to have as a secondary weapon to arm friends, etc... or as a backup.

-Mike
 
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They are plentiful, cheap, little recoil, and they are super fun to plink with. keltec, hi point, beretta storm, ruger Police carbine, or marlin camp carbine
All nice zombie guns!
 

enbloc

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I've got 2 sub2k's and they are fun. But I wouldn't trust them in a real shtf situation. They are just not that robust.
Folder AK all the way... and a G19
 
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Sub 2K is cheap and reliable enough where I would just stick it in the car and forget it. Having a few pre-ban happy sticks doesn't hurt either (even though they probably cost more than the gun does now).
 
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The advantage of a PCC over an equivalently sized rifle-caliber SBR or carbine is twofold:

1) lighter weight (both firearm and ammo)
2) common magazines and ammo with your sidearm (this isn't always the case but is common enough that you can make it happen)

What do you lose?

Lethality and penetration. Rifle rounds are going to do more damage due to higher velocity, and they'll easily penetrate the sort of hard cover you'd see in such environments: car doors, telephone poles, refrigerator doors, soft body armor, whatever. The PS90 has a few legal ammo types available that can come close to rifle performance but they're really expensive.

In a situation where your life depends on it I would err on the side of lethality and penetration and go with a rifle-caliber SBR, carbine, or a bullpup shotgun like the KSG. I think PCCs are better suited for hiking/camping when you may want a concealed "long" gun available but as lightweight as possible.
 

TomMontana

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In SHTF situation, I'm assuming you won't be held accountable for your shots and anything goes. And other people might be shooting back at you. Then it would make sense to have a capable rifle to end any fight quickly. Red dot on a 14.5" carbine or SBR. I like my AR9s, but they're not something I would bet my life on. And if someone was shooting rifle rounds at you, that Sub2000 is pretty much dominated.
 

E.Stoner

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If shit went sideways I would want to go rifle caliber and mucho 30 round mags primary with pistol as a secondary.
I have a Tavor and a G19 ready in a go bag in my apt in the city to get me where I am going in SHTF/WROL. Which is not where I live and that's where my guns are and then I am switching to a lightweight AR carbine.
 

MachineHead

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....or an SBR with a can....and night vision.

SBR with a can sounds like a good deal.

The Sub2K fits perfectly in the laptop pocket of a backpack and mags are readily available.

Has anyone heard of those MechTech uppers for Glocks? It's an upper receiver that attaches to a Glock frame.
What do you guys think?
 
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Prior to the defeat of the Felonious Pantsuit l was worried about the potential ban of all semi autos, especially in MA. I added a Henry lever action and a Ruger bolt action rifle, both in 357 mag, to the arsenal. I really like my 357 revolvers and see them as very useful in SHTF situations​. Plus, I thought (potentially incorrect) that they wouldn't be coming after traditional Fudd guns right away. I saw these guns as insurance against efforts to to​ take away all semi autos. My thinking at the time was that even a vastly empowered, democratally controlled gov't wouldn't dare to take away FUDD guns. Good insurance!

I'm not going to lie, I hate you right now lol. I have wanted an M77/357 for years but just couldn't justify spending $800 on one.
 

P-14

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Add California takedown pins to your AR SBR. Problem solved.

p_100003690_1.jpg


http://www.brownells.com/rifle-part...akedown-pin-set-sku100003690-26741-52029.aspx
 
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