Penalties for not filing an FA10

[vellnueve]

I'm one of those guys that managed to get the FA10 that has no instructions, and I'm in the following situation -

I bought two pistols in from a private owner in Florida (where there is NO requirement for registration or a bill of sale). I want to be a law-abiding citizen, and fill out and submit an FA10 for each. However, the guy in Florida is not subject to Mass Law -

So - what do I do? partially fill out the form with my info and the weapon info and check "registration"?

If you, as an MA resident, didn't go through an MA dealer, as appears to be the case, you are now a felon.

 

[Beeffajitas]

What about guns with no serial number (i.e. pre-Fed Firearms Safety Act)? I'm not sure what good it does anyone to register "an old shotgun", for example.

 

[vellnueve]

You're still required to report transfers of said firearm.

 

[jdubois]

I'm not sure what good it does anyone to register "an old shotgun", for example.

What good does it do to fill out an FA-10 for any gun? Absolutely none. But you follow the law and fill out the form anyway...

 

[one-eyed Jack]

If the ATF does a trace for whatever reason, say a gun found at a crime scene, someones ass might be on the line. ATF starts with the mfr. or importer, to the distributer, to the dealer, to the first retail buyer. etc. I doubt thet they would even consider looking at FA 10's. Jack.

 

[MXD]

Scenario 2. A while back, I was given a revolver by a friend of mine who has a valid LTC-A. I filled out an FA-10 from him to me. I later sold it to Cabelas in ME. I was told I didn't need to do anything because they were an FFL so I got my cash and left. Is this true? If so, how does the state of MA know this is not in my name/possesion anymore?

Scenario 2. My mothers friend's husband is about to pass away and he has an old dbl barrel SG without a serial number and an old lever action rifle. He does not have even an FID card. He asked if I could take them out of his house and told me I could have them. What do I do in this case?

 

[drgrant]

Scenario 2. A while back, I was given a revolver by a friend of mine who has a valid LTC-A. I filled out an FA-10 from him to me. I later sold it to Cabelas in ME. I was told I didn't need to do anything because they were an FFL so I got my cash and left. Is this true? If so, how does the state of MA know this is not in my name/possesion anymore?

For the 9 billionth time, yes. There is no requirement (or even a means) to "unregister" a gun from the CHSB database. The state doesn't know, and likely doesn't care. Not your problem. Don't worry about it and move on with your life.

Scenario 2. My mothers friend's husband is about to pass away and he has an old dbl barrel SG without a serial number and an old lever action rifle. He does not have even an FID card. He asked if I could take them out of his house and told me I could have them. What do I do in this case?

The "fully cover your ass" method is to have it transferred through an FFL to you, at least as long as the owner is still alive. After that the rules change a bit, but inheritance or disposition from an executor/trix is a whole different ballgame.

-Mike

 

[Kevlar]

Scenario 2. A while back, I was given a revolver by a friend of mine who has a valid LTC-A. I filled out an FA-10 from him to me. I later sold it to Cabelas in ME. I was told I didn't need to do anything because they were an FFL so I got my cash and left. Is this true?

Yes. No FA-10 required.

If so, how does the state of MA know this is not in my name/possesion anymore?

They don't/won't know. It's in the system forever. BTW, even if you did file a FA-10, it would not be removed from the system.

Scenario 2. My mothers friend's husband is about to pass away and he has an old dbl barrel SG without a serial number and an old lever action rifle. He does not have even an FID card. He asked if I could take them out of his house and told me I could have them. What do I do in this case?

He can either leave them to you in his will, or you can take him and the guns to a FFL to complete the transfer. Just make sure you, as the licensed individual, transports them to the FFL.

ETA: I see mike beat me to it.

 

[George D]

What about guns with no serial number (i.e. pre-Fed Firearms Safety Act)? I'm not sure what good it does anyone to register "an old shotgun", for example.

It doesn't do anyone any good, but you still have to do it. I registered an old Savage 12 ga that predated serial numbers.

 

[M1911]

The "good" it does is to keep my old, fat backside out of jail.

 

[bostonasphalt2]

First off, as has been said before, you do not 'register' guns in this state. You register transfers and acquisitions. There are plenty of guns in MA which have no registration paper trail and are perfectly legal.

Anything giving a government entity the serial number, LTC number and address of me and my gun is close enough to registration for hopefully anyone's liking! SUre the transfer is "registered" but the exact gun is also identified well enough to be essentially registered. As for the guns that come into state before a person is licensed and have no paper trail, well that is lucky for them IMHO.

 

[usnma]

I just got my resident LTC A: No Restrictions and as such will be carrying when I visit family in Mass. I am a Mass. resident but do not live in Mass. I understand from a previous post that guns bought out of state and kept out of state do not require a FA-10 to be filed. Would I need to file an FA-10 for my handguns since they will be spending some time in Mass? I am not sure since I have a resident LTC, but dont physically live there and probably only spend a few days a month at most in Mass.

 

[Kevlar]

I just got my resident LTC A: No Restrictions and as such will be carrying when I visit family in Mass. I am a Mass. resident but do not live in Mass. I understand from a previous post that guns bought out of state and kept out of state do not require a FA-10 to be filed. Would I need to file an FA-10 for my handguns since they will be spending some time in Mass? I am not sure since I have a resident LTC, but dont physically live there and probably only spend a few days a month at most in Mass.

Yes. As a MA resident you are required to file a FA-10 within seven days of the firearms introduction into the state.

 

[TTRAHAN]

I did not suggest that the use of FA10s are optional. I do advocate not keeping all of one's eggs in one basket, though. Many MA residents keep guns out of state. My boss lives in NH and he does the same thing. He keeps a hunting rifle at his sister's place in upstate NY. Other MA residents do the same thing to avoid the hassles of transporting them around. If you purchase a rifle/shotgun in NH or another state and keep it there, you will not have to worry about confiscation when the local PD shows up at the door with a "not suitable" letter from the CLEO or, worse yet, a 209A RO. If you want the government to have a complete list of everything that you own and to keep the whole collection in your residence, by all means do so. If you find yourself on the receiving end of a confiscation action, you will lose them all in one fell swoop. I am sure that the Dowd extortion warehouse will be happy to store them for you.

This seams to get a little crazy because what if you wanted to hold a firearm IN MA. from a lic owner but from out of state. The gun is legal but not yours however if it is in you possession (home) then you should file the fa10 for the time it is their. What if it stays in this state all the time waiting for your friend to be hear and carry during his visit. It is mostly in a ma. residences possession but it is not legally a Ma.residences gun so do you have to fa10 it or not. then what if you were given permission to use it when friend was in his/her home state are you in possession of an unregistered gun and braking the law[sad2]? I am trying real hard to understand all this crazy stuff but so much dam gray and everyone has a different opinion on what should be very strait forward law.

 

[Titan]

Relax. They will only confiscate what they can find. Let them be suspicious. You have the right to remain silent. Refuse to answer their questions and keep your mouth shut! Such a scenario is the reason why I am a firm believer in not keeping all of one's eggs in one basket. If you have a large collection, without fail keep some of them (especially family heirlooms or other guns with great sentimental value) out of state. This way, you will not lose them all in a single confiscation action.

You would serve yourself best by not posting further on this. The more you attempt to clarify, I think the more you create potential future problems for yourself.

The way I read this post and your others, you would keep two separate gun collections and be prepared to lie to a judge or other authority who might ask if all of your guns had been collected under a seizure order.

I can't help but believe you're declaring your intent to violate the law in certain circumstances, and suggesting the same to others.

Sometimes silence is golden!

 

[drgrant]

You would serve yourself best by not posting further on this. The more you attempt to clarify, I think the more you create potential future problems for yourself.

The way I read this post and your others, you would keep two separate gun collections and be prepared to lie to a judge or other authority who might ask if all of your guns had been collected under a seizure order.

I can't help but believe you're declaring your intent to violate the law in certain circumstances, and suggesting the same to others.

Sometimes silence is golden!

Depending on the context of the seizure what he is saying may not be illegal. In the case of a DV RO, however, what he is suggesting is legally perilous- since if you are deemed to have access to any firearms, even incidentally, you can be bagged under FIP/Lautenberg, and get hit with a lifetime disabling federal felony conviction. Hiding stuff from administrative action (say losing a license for non statutory reasons, or a renewal failure due to a bad CLEO) is one thing but a DV RO is a whole other ballgame... The former is smart, the latter is definitely not.

Posting your "plan" here for public viewing is obviously not a wise idea either- but then again, this is the same poster that goes around telling everyone how much better an FID is because it's shall issue....

-Mike

 

[drgrant]

This seams to get a little crazy because what if you wanted to hold a firearm IN MA. from a lic owner but from out of state. The gun is legal but not yours however if it is in you possession (home) then you should file the fa10 for the time it is their. What if it stays in this state all the time waiting for your friend to be hear and carry during his visit. It is mostly in a ma. residences possession but it is not legally a Ma.residences gun so do you have to fa10 it or not. then what if you were given permission to use it when friend was in his/her home state are you in possession of an unregistered gun and braking the law[sad2]? I am trying real hard to understand all this crazy stuff but so much dam gray and everyone has a different opinion on what should be very strait forward law.

With all due respect, you're trying too hard.

There is no compulsory registration in MA. (EG, there is no such thing as a charge for having an "unregistered" gun... ) You don't have to do anything as borrowing a gun is not a transfer. No FA-10 filing is required in such an instance. (I believe cross-x and others have covered this on more than one occasion).

-Mike

 

[TTRAHAN]

THANKS GUYS

Trust me the absolute last thing I want to be is in violating of any law in ma. I truly don't think I have the ***** to brake the law and speak about it publicly!!. I do appreciate the info regarding borrowing as this is an attempt to make positive I am within the law not without it!! I would love to repeal a few of them but unfortunately the best I can do is send a few letters and support GOAL and NRA the remainder is out of my controlee so I want to make positive I am understanding everything about the foolish registration in ma. I am however interested in having the ability to use all of the guns I want regardless of weather or not the AG thinks I should have them and if I can enjoy a gun by borrowing it from a friends from out of state and it is legal, than if the opportunity if offered I will. I have not been in this game long but from what I gather it is not legal to keep records regarding registration if you are the fed so y should it be legal for local nut bags to do it. It really burns my ass that the ones making the laws are always the 1st to brake them. *** SCOTT BROWN SWORN IN TODAY AT 5:00 WOHOOOO***

 

[LAWMAN3]

Here's my dilemma:

I recently did a FTF transfer of a handgun. Both of us have valid LTC-As. I filled out the buyer portion of the FA10 and gave the seller the form to fill the rest seller portion out. I forgot to take my carbon copy of the completed FA10. I know it is the seller's responsibility to submit the completed FA10 to the CHSB. After parting ways with the seller, I realized I hadn't signed the form as the buyer. The rest of the buyer information was completed in its entirety. The seller told me that he would mail me the entire FA10 packet with all information filled out, and all I would have to do is sign the form and mail it to the CHSB. The FA10 never arrived in the mail and it has been more than 7 days. I have tried contacting the seller, but have had no luck.

Regarding the gun, the seller told me that the firearm was purchased from someone else a few years ago, but is now looking to sell it to fund another project. According to the CHSB, the firearm is registered to someone other than person transferring it to me. Is it possible the person he purchased it from never sent in a FA10 from that transfer? Could the CHSB have lost the transfer paperwork for the person transferring the gun to me? If I can't contact the seller, what do I do? I plan on calling the CHSB later today.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Kicker96FS]

Do your part as per the law and you should be good to go. What the seller did or didn't do with they guy he bought it from is not your problem. (unless it was stolen)

 

[LAWMAN3]

So since I filled out the buyer part of the FA10, I have no legal obligation to do anything else as the buyer? And no, the gun is not stolen.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Yippee-ki-yay]

I know this thread has been dead for a while, but rather than start a new one I figured I'd just go from here. I inherited two guns when my grandfather when he passed, a Ruger 10/22 and an unknown brand of shotgun. Neither were listed in his will. I have not reported them because I was not made aware that this was necessary. What steps should I take going forward?

 

[labago]

I know this thread has been dead for a while, but rather than start a new one I figured I'd just go from here. I inherited two guns when my grandfather when he passed, a Ruger 10/22 and an unknown brand of shotgun. Neither were listed in his will. I have not reported them because I was not made aware that this was necessary. What steps should I take going forward?

If for some strange reason you have not gotten the answer to this in 8 years, you can rest easy as it doesn't matter anymore because of the statute of limitations. So long as the features of those guns are legal in MA

 

[RonBow]

If for some strange reason you have not gotten the answer to this in 8 years, you can rest easy as it doesn't matter anymore because of the statute of limitations. So long as the features of those guns are legal in MA

It does seem that the law is very specific about the action of "obtaining" and "receiving", but is completely silent about "possessing" or even "creating" unregistered firearms (so long as you have a license to possess firearms).
https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartI/TitleXX/Chapter140/Section128B

I have seen people online apply this registration law to the completion of 80% lowers, but I fail to see how it is required by the letter of the law. Even the Feds don't require you to serialize the lower unless you transfer it. Does anybody have a solid precedent or citation for having to report a completed lower?

 

[JNewell]

So... if I read this correctly... over time I buy ten guns here in MA. The transfer is legally registered and the CHSB has them in the system.

I need some cash so I sell them to an FFL. There is no record of the transfer to the FFL. The FFL sells them to someone out of state, so the CHSB has absolutely no record of future ownership of these firearms. Their records indicate that I still own them.

Did I miss anything, or is this possible. Under this scenario, should the police show up at my door with an order to collect my firearms, I may no longer be in possession of them. Yet the CHSB's records will show that I have ten of them, making LE very suspicious at the least?

This could be a frightening situation for an owner.

Thanks,

Rich

Keep your receipts, as advised, but FWIW the incoming transfer to the FFL will be recorded in the dealer's bound book.

 

[JNewell]

I'm guessing you were a legal resident in florida when this transaction occurred? Otherwise you just violated federal law. (Fed law bars direct handgun sales between
two individuals that are residents of a different state. )

In any event, if you later brought the guns back into MA, you just fill out an FA-10 with "register" checked off and the relevant info.

-Mike

Following up on this, if he was a FL resident at the time and legally acquired the handgun under FL law, then moves to MA, the FA-10 registration is optional. I realize you weren't suggesting that registration was required, but it bears clarification because the wording on the MIRCS gun transaction portal describing the registration option does not make that clear at all:

• Use this option if 1) you are a Massachusetts resident and you obtained a firearm, rifle, shotgun or machine gun from out of state 2) you recently moved to Massachusetts and you wish to record ownership of a firearm, rifle, shotgun or machine gun or 3) you possess a firearm, rifle, shotgun or machine gun and there is no record of the weapon on file with the Firearms Records Bureau.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Following up on this, if he was a FL resident at the time and legally acquired the handgun under FL law, then moves to MA, the FA-10 registration is optional. I realize you weren't suggesting that registration was required, but it bears clarification because the wording on the MIRCS gun transaction portal describing the registration option does not make that clear at all:

• Use this option if 1) you are a Massachusetts resident and you obtained a firearm, rifle, shotgun or machine gun from out of state 2) you recently moved to Massachusetts and you wish to record ownership of a firearm, rifle, shotgun or machine gun or 3) you possess a firearm, rifle, shotgun or machine gun and there is no record of the weapon on file with the Firearms Records Bureau.

Sadly, that was done intentionally when Jason Guida had that website created. I did take him to task on that and some other parts of that website.

 

[namedpipes]

It does seem that the law is very specific about the action of "obtaining" and "receiving", but is completely silent about "possessing" or even "creating" unregistered firearms (so long as you have a license to possess firearms).
https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/PartI/TitleXX/Chapter140/Section128B

I have seen people online apply this registration law to the completion of 80% lowers, but I fail to see how it is required by the letter of the law. Even the Feds don't require you to serialize the lower unless you transfer it. Does anybody have a solid precedent or citation for having to report a completed lower?

The "Feds" do NOT require you to serialize a firearm EVEN if you transfer it.

ONLY manufacturers, importers are required to serialize firearms. And Kalifornians that personally build firearms, because Kalifornia. (There could be other states where it is required but that's the one I happen to know of)

 

[Miater]

Does anyone know where if this fine applies to loaned guns? For example a friend who is a licensed gun owner borrows a firearm of mine, I obviously won’t be transferring it to them during that time. Would they have any issues?

 

[namedpipes]

Does anyone know where if this fine applies to loaned guns? For example a friend who is a licensed gun owner borrows a firearm of mine, I obviously won’t be transferring it to them during that time. Would they have any issues?

No. (although if they go and rob a liquor store with it, YOU might be in some trouble)