NY SCOTUS case and NJ licensing?

[Texasgrillchef]

Preface: This question is asked under 3 expectations. 1. That NewYork looses the SCOTUS case currently pending with SCOTUS As their law being held as unconstitutional. 2. That the opinion issued rules that we can bear arms outside of our home as a constitutional right, and that the ONLY reason needed to obtain a LTC/CHL/CCL, or permit is our right to bear arms outside the home for the purpose of self defense. I fully realize that how SCOTUS writes and issues their opinion on this case can make a huge difference on how the laws are written for the 8 states that are currently ”May Issue”. (NY, NJ, MA, RI, DE, MD, CA, HI, NYC). I do understand each states laws on “May Issue” is written differently then NY’s which is the main one being looked at. However, their is a case pending for Cert with SCOTUS against NJ as well as HI too. I am also not a lawyer, by any means, but I have worked with several 2A lawyers and I work with several state and federal legislatures representatives and senators on pro-gun laws.

Lets look at the various issues with obtaining a NJ PCH

Using NJ’s own Application instruction sheet to apply for a PCH. The only one that I believe will be changed by the SCOTUS opinion is #5 to submit in writing a justifiable need to obtain and receive the PCH.

I don’t believe that the opinion will have any bearing on the need to provide references. Which I have always thought is stupid in the first place, even for employment purposes. Who is their right mind would ever list a reference for anything that wouldn't be saying nothing but the best things about them!

As far as instruction goes, firearms safety classes, tests, and/or qualification requirements at the range. Based on my preface, or even the “Question” SCOTUS is considering, their opinion won’t have any significant bearing on this issue.

So based ONLY on m preface stated above. Do you see the outcome of the SCOTUS case cause if any other changes in how NJ issues Handgun permits?

 

[Mason609]

If NY losses, I would imagine that NJ and the other states will continue as is, unless the SCOTUS opinion is specific enough to where it effectively voids the "need" portion of the application universally.

Even then, I can see these states not changing anything until/unless they are hit with the same lawsuits.

 

[fishgutzy]

No matter how SCOTUS writes the opinion, even if it broadly bans demonstrating need, no other state will change anything. They already rule as if the US constitution doesn't apply. They will force taxpayers to to fight more case in court while the states force taxpayers to fund the beast as well.
Elimination of "demonstration of need" will be replaced by training and psychological screening test (done by a state certified anti-gun shrink) in an effort to raise permit costs to well over $5000. In San Francisco it is already over $1K and they deny nearly all applications after spending that money.

 

[Texasgrillchef]

If NY losses, I would imagine that NJ and the other states will continue as is, unless the SCOTUS opinion is specific enough to where it effectively voids the "need" portion of the application universally.

Even then, I can see these states not changing anything until/unless they are hit with the same lawsuits.

Yes it will of course it will take additional lawsuits. Most of the time the changes are not automatic. Especially for the 8 states in question. Luckily though two of the states already have pending cases waiting for cert from SCOTUS, NJ and HI.

I am not to worried about someone not filing additional cases. The district court judges, as well as the appellate courts dont do to bad on enforcing SCOTUS mandates, unless of course they can find a loophole somewhere.

which is mentioned by the poster who posted right after you.

 

[Texasgrillchef]

No matter how SCOTUS writes the opinion, even if it broadly bans demonstrating need, no other state will change anything. They already rule as if the US constitution doesn't apply. They will force taxpayers to to fight more case in court while the states force taxpayers to fund the beast as well.
Elimination of "demonstration of need" will be replaced by training and psychological screening test (done by a state certified anti-gun shrink) in an effort to raise permit costs to well over $5000. In San Francisco it is already over $1K and they deny nearly all applications after spending that money.

That is very true. They could instigate higher fees, as well as various psychological screening tests, as well as more training requirements. While there might not be much of a challenge with training requirements, I see challenges popping up with higher fees as well as psychological screening tests.

The other issue I see coming up is again depending on how they write the opinion, i see challenges coming up with reciprocity, and fen the issuance or non-issuance of Non-resident licenses.

Delaware Is one of those strange states, where if your a resident your more worse off then a non-resident. Delaware, recognizes 4 of my 10 LTC’s, yet I i know someone who lives in Delaware that has had issues getting a permit.

Obviously this is pure speculation on everyones part right now. We won’t know anything certain until SCOTUS rules and issues their opinion.

Unless SCOTUS rules in favor of the State of New York, we all should in some degree be better off then we are now.

 

[fishgutzy]

That is very true. They could instigate higher fees, as well as various psychological screening tests, as well as more training requirements. While there might not be much of a challenge with training requirements, I see challenges popping up with higher fees as well as psychological screening tests.

The other issue I see coming up is again depending on how they write the opinion, i see challenges coming up with reciprocity, and fen the issuance or non-issuance of Non-resident licenses.

Delaware Is one of those strange states, where if your a resident your more worse off then a non-resident. Delaware, recognizes 4 of my 10 LTC’s, yet I i know someone who lives in Delaware that has had issues getting a permit.

Obviously this is pure speculation on everyones part right now. We won’t know anything certain until SCOTUS rules and issues their opinion.

Unless SCOTUS rules in favor of the State of New York, we all should in some degree be better off then we are now.

Even MA. It is far easier for a non-resident to get a permit than any redlight town in MA.

 

[Texasgrillchef]

Even MA. It is far easier for a non-resident to get a permit than any redlight town in MA.

What’s funny, is I am officially a Maryland Certified a firearms Insturctor and can teach and certify potential Maryland CCL applicants. Yet they will not issue me a non-resident CCL.

I am hoping this will change with the SCOTUS case.

 

[Texasgrillchef]

As we all know now…. Bruen lost… NJ accepted loss and now no longer requires good cause any more…

So to all the Nay sayers from before… pigs are flying, and hell is getting cold!