NSSF filed vs AGO!

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I'd say the historical record's not totally clear on that point... The American Shooting Sports Council was the plaintiff in the lawsuit. It was an alternative industry group to NSSF that included Glock and S&W. The NSSF "absorbed" the ASSC in 1999 under murky circumstances, and failed to pursue the lawsuit, leading to its dismissal in April of 2000.

It's not clear if ASSC just dissolved and the member manufacturers joined NSSF, or if it was actually acquired by NSSF in a formal manner. But most media sources do describe it as the NSSF "absorbing" ASSC. And if that's the case, and NSSF failed to carry on the ASSC's lawsuit, it's on them.
Thanks for that info. I was unaware of this alternate rationale. When one company absorbs another, I'm sure that lots of stuff falls thru the cracks (in any industry)!
 

Boston4567

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Thanks for that info. I was unaware of this alternate rationale. When one company absorbs another, I'm sure that lots of stuff falls thru the cracks (in any industry)!
Yup, especially given the circumstances around it...

Bob Ricker - Wikipedia

Basically the ASSC's executive director met with the Clintons in 1999, and seemed to be involved in the same sort of industry capitulation that S&W was involved in at the time. It wasn't well-received. Within a few months of the meeting, he was fired and the ASSC was being absorbed by the NSSF. Under those circumstances, I can't imagine the transition was smooth.
 

Reptile

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AG Says Controversial Enforcement Notice Doesn't Apply to the Types of Rifles Gun Shops Sued Over

AG says controversial enforcement notice doesn't apply to the types of rifles gun shops sued over
Would you like a Tavor with your Schnauzer???
YES!!! Tavors now confirmed legal!!! (They have been sold for a long time but now you wont have to worry)
"The IWI Tavor is one the seven groups of weapons the AG’s July 18 motion argues was always clearly legal under its enforcement notice."

How about building your own .22 AR out of a brand new lower???
Go for it!!!
The other weapons the AG has deemed legal to sell are the the Kel-Tec RFB, the FN PS90, the Kel-Tec Sub 2000 and the Berretta CX4 Storm.

The AG noted that two other weapons the plaintiffs sued over – the Smith & Wesson M&P 15-22 and other .22 caliber rimfire AR-15 style rifles, and the Springfield Armory M1A – were already explicitly deemed legal by the AG in a follow-up notice released before the lawsuit was filed.



For those who are selling unobtainium:

The notice does not apply to individual gun owners who transfer banned weapons bought before the July 20, 2016 notice date.

Is this all good news or bad news???
The above information is clearly listed on the AG Enforcement Notice FAQ:

Frequently Asked Questions about the Assault Weapons Ban Enforcement Notice

You can even buy this...

Noveske Space Invader (with a pinned stock)
16" Gen 4 Noveske9 Rifle

This lawsuit has done nothing other than confirm the AG's Enforcement Letter FAQ.

Wake me up when somebody sues the AG for reinterpreting the Massachusetts Assault Weapons Ban.
Until then, pre ban AR15 lowers with documentation are worth their weight in gold.
 
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Reptile

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We need a test case.

A dealer needs to sell some new AR's.

The AG wont even be able to charge them because her edict is not based on any law.

IF the dealer does get charged, they need to demand what law they are being charged under.

All this grand standing by the NSSF is getting us nowhere.

They should have been selling new AR's the whole time.

NSSF case wasted 3 years and tons of money for nothing.
 

Reptile

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It always comes down to needing people with cajones.
If a dealer took an Maura, he would become legendary.
One man, taking on a powerful tyrannical government to keep decent red blooded Americans free.
He would a patriot in modern times.

Perhaps the most famous patriot at the time was George Washington who led the Continental Army and later became the first President of the United States. Other famous patriots included Paul Revere, Samuel Adams, Ethan Allen, Patrick Henry, and Ben Franklin.

Look at what happened to Target Sports USA. An unknown ammo dealer took on Maura and now they have achieved patriot status and get all the business from Massachusetts.

b10dc46575fde6c64ed82b6f64229459.jpg

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GdDNcyHV6U
 

Enzo

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If a dealer took an Maura, he would become legendary.
One man, taking on a powerful tyrannical government to keep decent red blooded Americans free.
He would a patriot in modern times.

Perhaps the most famous patriot at the time was George Washington who led the Continental Army and later became the first President of the United States. Other famous patriots included Paul Revere, Samuel Adams, Ethan Allen, Patrick Henry, and Ben Franklin.

Look at what happened to Target Sports USA. An unknown ammo dealer took on Maura and now they have achieved patriot status and get all the business from Massachusetts.

View attachment 295135

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4GdDNcyHV6U
I nominate Alicia at Pullman Arms !!!
 

Reptile

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I nominate Alicia at Pullman Arms !!!
She would be a rockstar!!!

Reality show?

2nd Amendment spokeswoman?

Alicia could be the next Dana Loesch, only much better.

Massachusetts needs less commies and more patriots!

You go Girl!!!
 

42!

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If a dealer took an Maura, he would become legendary.
One man, taking on a powerful tyrannical government to keep decent red blooded Americans free.
He would a patriot in modern times.

Perhaps the most famous patriot at the time was George Washington who led the Continental Army and later became the first President of the United States. Other famous patriots included Paul Revere, Samuel Adams, Ethan Allen, Patrick Henry, and Ben Franklin.

Look at what happened to Target Sports USA. An unknown ammo dealer took on Maura and now they have achieved patriot status and get all the business from Massachusetts.
So get your FFL and do it!
It's easy to talk big when it's not your freedom, money, life that will be taken away, even if you win years later.
As for that ammo dealer, risk was much lower with them being outside of MA, beyond easy reach of the MA AG.
 

Reptile

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If she is so confident in her enforcement notice, why is she fighting it tooth and nail? Is it to avoid discovery?
Is that what this is about?

NSSF wanted to see the communications between Maura and the cops local to the dealers in question.

She knew the NSSF was on to her crookery so she had to put the kibosh on the whole can of worms.

This is nothing less than tyranny.
 
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AG Says Controversial Enforcement Notice Doesn't Apply to the Types of Rifles Gun Shops Sued Over

AG says controversial enforcement notice doesn't apply to the types of rifles gun shops sued over
I have to give some respect to the Worcester Telegram for this article. It is well written and contains a clear explanation of the most recent developments in the case. It would be a decent article by any standard, but compared to the usual reporting on gun cases in Massachusetts, it is excellent.
 

Mr. Brownstone

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So if you are an FFL07 in MA, you can manufacture a single feature (pistol grip) semi automatic AR-15, and as long as it is manufactured with a CMMG(or similar) 22lr bolt carrier group, there isn’t anything she can do about it.

This is based off of her latest statement “the Smith & Wesson M&P 15-22 and other .22 caliber rimfire AR-15 style rifles, and the Springfield Armory M1A – were already explicitly deemed legal by the AG in a follow-up notice released before the lawsuit was filed.

Her statement in the enforcement notice that says “a weapon that is manufactured as an Assault Weapon cannot be made legal by alterations that allow it to discharge .17 or .22 caliber ammunition.”

Well, if an AR is originally built with a .22lr bolt carrier group in it, then according to her, it’s legal and therefore not manufactured as an assault weapon. It has not been altered, it has been made that way.

Now, if some bad seed buys one and converts it into a 5.56 by swapping out bolt groups, that is in them...
 

Reptile

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So if you are an FFL07 in MA, you can manufacture a single feature (pistol grip) semi automatic AR-15, and as long as it is manufactured with a CMMG(or similar) 22lr bolt carrier group, there isn’t anything she can do about it.

This is based off of her latest statement “the Smith & Wesson M&P 15-22 and other .22 caliber rimfire AR-15 style rifles, and the Springfield Armory M1A – were already explicitly deemed legal by the AG in a follow-up notice released before the lawsuit was filed.

Her statement in the enforcement notice that says “a weapon that is manufactured as an Assault Weapon cannot be made legal by alterations that allow it to discharge .17 or .22 caliber ammunition.”

Well, if an AR is originally built with a .22lr bolt carrier group in it, then according to her, it’s legal and therefore not manufactured as an assault weapon. It has not been altered, it has been made that way.

Now, if some bad seed buys one and converts it into a 5.56 by swapping out bolt groups, that is in them...
I don't think you need to be a FFL 07 to make a .22 AR. Anybody can assemble their own rifle from a lower.

Just buy a new AR15 stripped lower and build it up into a .22. Get a AR15 upper and put in the CMMG .22 bolt.

Once assembled to fire a round - by having the upper and lower attached, you need to FA10 it.

Seems clear to me that a AR15 in .22 is legal to make.
 

Boston4567

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In MA. superior court. ? [rofl]
If you're grounded, you don't ask your friends' parents to un-ground you. Because they don't have the authority.

That is what's happening here. Maura's BS is an ultra vires state law violation and federal courts do not have the legal authority to adjudicate those claims.
 

Mr. Brownstone

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I don't think you need to be a FFL 07 to make a .22 AR. Anybody can assemble their own rifle from a lower.

Just buy a new AR15 stripped lower and build it up into a .22. Get a AR15 upper and put in the CMMG .22 bolt.

Once assembled to fire a round - by having the upper and lower attached, you need to FA10 it.

Seems clear to me that a AR15 in .22 is legal to make.
If I needed one, it is one way I might do it. I am one of the folks who planned ahead.

The issue* as I see it, is the availability of post 7/20 lowers in MA for those who didn’t. This “fix” could solve that.

My other idea gets you around the AWB completely. Build a 5.56 version, soup to nuts. 5 feature death machine. Skip the gas block and gas tube. You now have a bolt action not subject to AWB.

ETA*. Its not the real issue, I know. But any way to punch holes in the enforcement notice is a good thing, as I see it. Like the pinned mag ARs.
 
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Can anyone give a summary of the state if this right now? Trying to make sense of everything after some good news for Tavors and real confirmation on transfering 'pre-healeys'. How is it moving forward (if it is)
 
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The notice does not apply to individual gun owners who transfer banned weapons bought before the July 20, 2016 notice date.
Sure it does.

Had a buddy lose his ltc and turned his guns into a ffl- I had to ship his AR lower out of state because I couldn't get it transferred to me.

But imo the real work around here is the mgi hydra stripped lower. It has interchangeable mag wells, so as a lower it doesn't meet any AG bullshit and even the magwell isnt interchangeable because it doesnt have one' when it does it cannot be removed and placed on a normal ar lower.
 

Whiskeywon

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No but ar10s should be, can't be a copy of an ar15 if the design pre-dates the ar15. [smile]
I've been saying this since it happened. Doesn't get mentioned enough to be honest. And as far as commonality, hell, AR-10s don't even have full parts interchangeability with each other.
Not that any of this matters anyways in the grand scheme of things with all the games being played.
 

Dennis in MA

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I don't think you need to be a FFL 07 to make a .22 AR. Anybody can assemble their own rifle from a lower.

Just buy a new AR15 stripped lower and build it up into a .22. Get a AR15 upper and put in the CMMG .22 bolt.

Once assembled to fire a round - by having the upper and lower attached, you need to FA10 it.

Seems clear to me that a AR15 in .22 is legal to make.
While I love the creativeness, I'd prefer just to be free. What a dink this woman is. A true dink. "Let's ban these guns that have this specific look about them." Ugh.
 

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So an AR-15 lower is illegal but an AR-15 lower sold with a 22LR upper attached to it is legal. Makes sense to me.
 

Reptile

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Sure it does.

Had a buddy lose his ltc and turned his guns into a ffl- I had to ship his AR lower out of state because I couldn't get it transferred to me.

But imo the real work around here is the mgi hydra stripped lower. It has interchangeable mag wells, so as a lower it doesn't meet any AG bullshit and even the magwell isnt interchangeable because it doesnt have one' when it does it cannot be removed and placed on a normal ar lower.
The decision not to transfer the AR lower (which was pre Healey) was on the FFL.

Pre Healey lowers and rifles have been declared legal to transfer per the AG FAQ and as detailed in that news report.

Maybe now FFL's will not be scared to do such transfers. Providing of course there is proof when the lower or rifle was in the state.
 
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The decision not to transfer the AR lower (which was pre Healey) was on the FFL.

Pre Healey lowers and rifles have been declared legal to transfer per the AG FAQ and as detailed in that news report.

Maybe now FFL's will not be scared to do such transfers. Providing of course there is proof when the lower or rifle was in the state.
I called about a dozen shops in my area- the lower was pre Healey but post 94, nobody would touch it. General rule of thumb as I've understood it and has been reinforced to me is post ban AR's are ftf only.
 
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