Not shutdown. Wayne is a POS who uses the NRA as his piggyback, paying for his $5,000 suits and a lot of other things. He’s been in power for 30 years and he’s loaded up the NRA with his cronies and they plunder the funds too.
Wayne should FOAD.
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NRA - campaign for Allen West to replace LaPierre
- Thread starter drgelinas
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Not shutdown. Wayne is a POS who uses the NRA as his piggyback, paying for his $5,000 suits and a lot of other things. He’s been in power for 30 years and he’s loaded up the NRA with his cronies and they plunder the funds too.
Wayne should FOAD.
kerryman71
NES Member
I agree about members either not being aware, or not caring. Then you probably have a lot of long time members who think it's blasphemy to badmouth Lapierre and some of the leadership, most likely the ones at the annual meeting who boo anyone who speaks out against them, then make the motion to move on.
Regardless of anyone's feelings of the NRA, they have the numbers membership wise and probably some clout in DC and elsewhere. Dismantling the NRA would be a win for the anti gun crowd. Restructuring the NRA from the top down would be a win for us.
kerryman71
NES Member
With a Kohl's 30% off coupon.
Asaltweapon
NES Member
That’s the problem!!! Look at any company or organization. Hell!!! Just look at your own town.
3 Member Board Of Selectmen changes to 7. Then a Town Manager is needed that leads the way to a Mayor.
Fcuk that noise!!
Dennis in MA
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I'd rather have moar Wayne and less influence by my enemies. And I used to be the voice of compromise here. LOL
I was thinking about this on the drive around this afternoon. (Thinking of another situation - a successful environmentalist that is now an enviro-nazi who pisses a lot of people off with her stupid actions.)
Patton
MacArthur
Every success ends up going overboard. As I said earlier - he's been in power for at least 25 years. Time to move on JUST because of that. You either die the hero or live long enough to be the villain or whatever that quote is.
AHM
NES Member
From the Patriot Post:
NRA Fratricidal Fire Hits Second Amendment Hard
The NRA needs a new and dynamic leader to "restore, reform and reclaim the NRA for what it was intended to be."
patriotpost.us
Mesatchornug
NES Member
I'm not convinced Wayne isn't our enemy. Not because of things the media tells us, but by investigating his own successes.
Which are what, exactly?
In his time in the position, we've seen everything from the 94AWB to Trump's bumpstock ban. We have red flag laws increasingly around the country, meanwhile the NRA tried to cock block con carry and several cases that have increased our access to our rights as gun owners.
If he were being effective as a lobbyist, I couldn't care less about his suits or how much he's paid. But he's not, he hasn't been, and the ship is listing as a result.
Where has Wayne been on the HPA? Why didn't he press Trump's supermajority repeal the NFA or at least the Hughes amendment? What has he achieved since becoming EVP in 1991?
Dennis in MA
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Maybe. Or maybe we've got a logical bias. What if the NRA listed the 3944033 different laws and regulations they helped defeat in the last 30 years? Naturally, we'd look at it and say, "Well, that one wasn't going anywhere" and "they just gave that money" and "well we just have the NRA's word they made that go away." Our premise is that hte NRA didn't fix EVERY gun law that went against us, so no one can prove to us that they did their job. We are a conclusion looking to cherry pick the data to prove our point.
Again - powerful people in the gun world -those that are fighting for YOUR rights - they respect and support Wayne. That alone gives me pause. And I STILL think he should step down if for no other reason than being in power for far far far too long is a bad thing.
I'm not sure that hte NRA was ever set up to be a total right-wing arm of gun owners as we wish them to be today. Historically, they've been there to educate and support. I wonder if it was US who shifted, not the NRA. Not to say they SHOULDN'T fight for our rights vehemently. But it was a different battle in 94. Remember, Reagan, Ford and Carter (giggle) were in support of AWB94. Hell, a pile of Republicans voted for the thing. (And strangely, a pile of Democrats voted against it. - It was a very bipartisan bit of legislation. And the Dems lost their shirts in the next election because of it.) But I'm not sure I can "blame" the NRA for it's passing.
Again - powerful people in the gun world -those that are fighting for YOUR rights - they respect and support Wayne. That alone gives me pause. And I STILL think he should step down if for no other reason than being in power for far far far too long is a bad thing.
I'm not sure that hte NRA was ever set up to be a total right-wing arm of gun owners as we wish them to be today. Historically, they've been there to educate and support. I wonder if it was US who shifted, not the NRA. Not to say they SHOULDN'T fight for our rights vehemently. But it was a different battle in 94. Remember, Reagan, Ford and Carter (giggle) were in support of AWB94. Hell, a pile of Republicans voted for the thing. (And strangely, a pile of Democrats voted against it. - It was a very bipartisan bit of legislation. And the Dems lost their shirts in the next election because of it.) But I'm not sure I can "blame" the NRA for it's passing.
AHM
NES Member
Who are we supposed to believe -
our lying eyes,
or geometric logic?
View this under Conquest's Second Law of Politics:
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I quite the NRA three years ago because I could no longer support Lapierre's corrupt regime there. I will re-join when someone who is both honest and committed to the NRA's original mission. Allen West would qualify.
You all know Pournelle's Iron Law of Organizations?
"In any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people:
First, there will be those who are devoted to the goals of the organization. Examples are dedicated classroom teachers in an educational bureaucracy, many of the engineers and launch technicians and scientists at NASA, even some agricultural scientists and advisors in the former Soviet Union collective farming administration.
Secondly, there will be those dedicated to the organization itself. Examples are many of the administrators in the education system, many professors of education, many teachers union officials, much of the NASA headquarters staff, etc.
The Iron Law states that in every case the second group will gain and keep control of the organization. It will write the rules, and control promotions within the organization."
FB's First Corollary states that "Soon after the second group gains control, the organization's real purpose will become to create personal wealth and power for the members of the controlling group. This purpose will not be explicit, but will remain hidden behind the stated goals of the organization."
You all know Pournelle's Iron Law of Organizations?
"In any bureaucratic organization there will be two kinds of people:
First, there will be those who are devoted to the goals of the organization. Examples are dedicated classroom teachers in an educational bureaucracy, many of the engineers and launch technicians and scientists at NASA, even some agricultural scientists and advisors in the former Soviet Union collective farming administration.
Secondly, there will be those dedicated to the organization itself. Examples are many of the administrators in the education system, many professors of education, many teachers union officials, much of the NASA headquarters staff, etc.
The Iron Law states that in every case the second group will gain and keep control of the organization. It will write the rules, and control promotions within the organization."
FB's First Corollary states that "Soon after the second group gains control, the organization's real purpose will become to create personal wealth and power for the members of the controlling group. This purpose will not be explicit, but will remain hidden behind the stated goals of the organization."
Mesatchornug
NES Member
I agree, perfect shouldn't be the enemy of good. Can they name any major successes in the last 10 years? Do they outweigh all the bad they've done for us? Did Wayne get us anything under Trump?
I can respect their opinions and disagree. I have a friend who designs firearms for one of the big names - he's of the opinion the NRA should be dissolved. I tend to disagree with him, too.
You're right, they were created as an educational org. And they still do an ok job of that, though most of the new material they've generated lately seems to be rehashing others' work. Nonetheless, their history is replete with good things in education.
It's worth remembering, of course, that the initial sales pitch for starting the NRA was to teach marksmanship to Americans. The premise being that this would generate a pipeline of skilled folks ready to serve in our military and to help freedmen have the tools to protect themselves.
Fast forward 100 yerars, we saw the Cincinnati Revolution in '76. Enough of the membership felt that the org was faltering; that by positioning itself as serving sportsmen and hunters, it had taken too soft a stance. After this event, the organization was redirected towards taking a hard line position in protection of rights. 50 years later, it seems that - despite the "cold dead hands" and "most important election ever" rhetoric - they're drifting back towards that hunter/sportsman's rights org.
Is the NRA definitionally a hard-nosed rights group? No. Is it in their history? Absolutely. Is it reasonable that the membership are murmuring for another reset? Sure - this is what democracy looks like.
Was the passage of the AWB the failure of the NRA alone? Of course not. I'll grant that was kind of a cheap shot on my part. And I'll be the first to admit that they pump money to GOAL on the back end, to help with efforts here. They deserve credit where it's due.
They also deserve to draw fire where it's due. The NRA told Trump to ban bumpstocks. They've been on the side of Red Flag Laws. They worked to block CC in NH. They poopooed Heller until it was clear he was going to win.
Meanwhile, what have they done about the new PMF updates from Biden's "AFT"? What are they doing about the pistol brace junk? Where were they on the HPA? Have I missed all the help they're giving for the CC movement that has now passed in half the states of the Union?
The only reason Florida still doesn't have constitutional carry is Wayne and company blew it up and they fought it hard behind the scenes in New Hampshire.
He supported Red Flag laws before he opposed them as well.
Wayne isn't on our side , he's on Wayne's side.
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