Man whose rifle exploded files lawsuit

dwarven1

dwarven1

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http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,650212273,00.html

Man whose rifle exploded files lawsuit

Attorney expresses concern for others using same model
By Sara Israelsen
Deseret Morning News
PROVO — A Duchesne man whose rifle exploded on a hunting trip and sent shrapnel into his face is suing the gun company for negligence.
Jesse Tatman is suing the company that makes the rifle, Savage Arms, as well as The Sports Authority — formerly Gart Sports — for liability, breach of warranties and negligence.
Tatman bought the rifle in January 2003 and hunted in the 2003 season during which the 300 Remington Ultra Magnum worked flawlessly, according to a lawsuit filed in 4th District Court on Oct. 20.
However, during a deer hunting trip in Daggett County on Oct. 22, 2004, when he aimed at a deer and pulled the trigger, "the gun exploded and disintegrated into dozens of pieces, sending debris as far as fifty feet away, and into (Tatman's) face," according to the lawsuit.
Tatman's nose was bleeding and he had several pieces of "gun stock lodged in his face," according to the suit.
"Our primary concern is the safety of others using the same gun," said Derek Coulter, Tatman's Salt Lake-based attorney.
The amount of money Tatman wants from the companies is undisclosed.
The gun company said a claim like this is rare.
"All of our rifles are tested in the factory before they are shipped to ensure that this sort of thing does not happen," said Steve Alger, marketing services manager for Massachusetts-based Savage Arms.
The company sells more than 100,000 guns annually that are tested before going to stores.
"Whatever has happened, I'm sure that something (happened) between the time it left the factory and the accident ... and I'm sure those facts will come out as the case goes forward," Alger said.
Managers at The Sports Authority in Orem couldn't comment on specifics, but department manager Bryan Hart said he saw the rifle when the man brought it back in pieces.
"I've never seen a gun blow up like that," Hart said. "It blew me away."
Bob Lee works in the gun department for The Sports Authority and said if a gun explodes it could be because the shooter used incorrect ammunition.
However, Coulter said his client was using factory ammunition, not "reloaded" ammunition.
If an individual "reloads" or makes their own bullets, they often stuff in too much powder, making the bullet too hot and too pressurized. Then, when the bullet is shot out of the gun, it can cause an explosion.

E-mail: [email protected]
 
I wonder if the barrel was plugged (debris) I had a rem 870 KB years ago it was factory loaded ammo that caused the problem. (primer too high and it slamfired.)
 
Tatman bought the rifle in January 2003 and hunted in the 2003 season during which the 300 Remington Ultra Magnum worked flawlessly, according to a lawsuit filed in 4th District Court on Oct. 20.
However, during a deer hunting trip in Daggett County on Oct. 22, 2004, when he aimed at a deer and pulled the trigger, "the gun exploded and disintegrated into dozens of pieces, sending debris as far as fifty feet away, and into (Tatman's) face," according to the lawsuit.
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The gun previously worked as advertised. What changed to cause it to explode? It is "possible" that there was a metallugical fault, but it is more likely that the barrel may have been obstructed. Hopefully the trial will direct a close examination of the rifle to see if any evidence exists one way or the other.
 
which way are we going here?

1.Gun malfunction
2.The hunter stuck the barrel to the ground and clogged it with dirt
3.Friend played a joke and obstructed the barrel
4.Guy cleaned his gun and left a cleaning patch in the barrel
5.The guy cleaned the gun and put it back together incorrecly


any more?

I think the guy did something that cause the firearm to malfuntion. I just don't know what he did or forgot to do.
 
dwarven1 said:
http://deseretnews.com/dn/view/0,1249,650212273,00.html

Man whose rifle exploded files lawsuit

If an individual "reloads" or makes their own bullets, they often stuff in too much powder, making the bullet too hot and too pressurized. Then, when the bullet is shot out of the gun, it can cause an explosion.

E-mail: [email protected]
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Where can I get some of these home made "hot" bullets with too much powder stuffed into them? I've heard that this is "often" done. [rolleyes]
 
I have read that the Bolt Head Retaining Pin can shear if you try and force the bolt handle down on a cartridge that is a little too big. If that happens I don't think the bolt will lock. It is part number 7.

ynfczj


B
 
If an individual "reloads" or makes their own bullets, they often stuff in too much powder, making the bullet too hot and too pressurized. Then, when the bullet is shot out of the gun, it can cause an explosion.
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Nice statement...
 
I had a shotgun split on me once. I think I had a light reload and a wad stayed in the barrel (like after you get married) Most accidents like this are. I didn't try to sue anyone, though. Most accidents like this are due to operator negligence, whether they realize it or not.
 
Speaking of cretinous reporters, anyone see the drivel in the Sun Chronicle about the "bullet tips" found at Dighton-Rehoboth High? I particularly liked the term "empty bullets.".....
 
my guess will be that during the trial, they will find that the guy had something jammed in the barrel, made hi own "hot" reloads or simply didn't put the thing back together properly after the last time he cleaned it.

BUT because that would mean it was the morons fault and NOT the gun makers fault... it will never make it in the papers.
 
...when the bullet is shot out of the gun, it can cause an explosion...
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She so crazy !
loco.gif


Exploding bullets !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Everybody run and hide !
behindsofa.gif
What am I saying ? I want some !
madgrin.gif
 
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matt1956 said:
... didn't put the thing back together properly after the last time he cleaned it.

BUT because that would mean it was the morons fault and NOT the gun makers fault... it will never make it in the papers.
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Unless they can convince a jury that the gun maker is at fault because it was too easy to put it back together wrong, or that they didn't warn the user sufficiently as to the results of putting it back together wrong.
 
Scrivener said:
Speaking of cretinous reporters, anyone see the drivel in the Sun Chronicle about the "bullet tips" found at Dighton-Rehoboth High? I particularly liked the term "empty bullets.".....
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Yep. Now, every high school kid that wants a day off is scouring the local range for duds or empty cases to sprinkle around the school.
 
daceman63 said:
which way are we going here?

1.Gun malfunction
2.The hunter stuck the barrel to the ground and clogged it with dirt
3.Friend played a joke and obstructed the barrel
4.Guy cleaned his gun and left a cleaning patch in the barrel
5.The guy cleaned the gun and put it back together incorrecly


any more?

I think the guy did something that cause the firearm to malfuntion. I just don't know what he did or forgot to do.
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Mfg could have produced a very highly loaded round. I'm sure this is rare but it could have happened.

Shooter DID reload his own incorrectly and is lying about it.

I doubt your number 4 would have caused it.
 
Pilgrim said:
Mfg could have produced a very highly loaded round. I'm sure this is rare but it could have happened.

Shooter DID reload his own incorrectly and is lying about it.

I doubt your number 4 would have caused it.
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Experts will be able to tell why it happened or will they only be able to specualte on why it might have happened?

I was reaching with number 4....lol
 
The only way to get enough evidence to prove any wrongdoing on
the part of Savage is if the guy throwing the lawsuit sends the rifle out
to someone like HP White and they say there's a metallurgical
fault. I doubt that will be discovered, though. The ammo would
be a lot more challenging... depends on how much of the brass is
left, etc.

I've never heard of this occurring with a Savage product before,
though. Awhile back Beretta/Tikka had some HUGE metallurgical
issues in some of their rifles. They never copped to the
faults publicly (eg, as in a public recall) but they did replace rifles no
questions asked.

The sue-er kinda sounds like a douche, though. (Suing the place
that sold the rifle? wtf? [rolleyes] ) I'd be more interested
in finding out the "why" before anything else, before pointing the
finger. Sounds like he had some cajoling from an ambulance
chaser.


-Mike
 
derek said:
Damn I missed that one. [thinking]
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I'm tempted to make some wise-ass critical statement about MA, but I wouldn't be surprised if the knee-jerk over reaction could happen just about anywhere...[rolleyes]

Discovery of partial bullets at D-R leads to lockdown

BY STEPHEN PETERSON SUN CHRONICLE STAFF
Tuesday, December 5, 2006 12:17 AM EST


REHOBOTH - Partial bullets were discovered Monday in Dighton-Rehoboth Regional High School, sparking a lockdown, but a follow-up search by state police with a dog failed to find anything else suspicious.

Three bullet tips were found in a hallway by a teacher during the school day, school and police officials said.

"As soon as the teacher found the bullets, they called us and we put the school in lockdown," and contacted state police, Dighton Patrolman William Perry said Monday night.

A lockdown is when school doors are all locked - including doors to classrooms, to keep students and staff safe, and authorities can search the building.

The dog was used to smell for ammunition and gunpowder residue.

"They didn't really find anything," Perry said. "They basically are still working on it."

As for the bullet tips, they were .45 caliber, possibly from older, military-issued ammunition, officials said.

Perry said "at one time, they were full bullets. You can see where someone pried the bullet tip from the casing, maybe for gun powder. We are not sure."

The tips were connected to part of the bullet casings, he added.

Dighton police were involved as the school is located in Dighton.

School officials sent a letter home to parents advising them of what happened and urging them to check any gun cabinents and other such areas.

"Once the police determined it was safe to resume normal activity we did so," Principal Gail Van Buren wrote in the letter. "If anyone were in danger, we would have acted accordingly."

Van Buren reminded parents the school department has a no-tolerance policy toward possession of weapons, pyrotechnics, and ammunition on school grounds, as spelled out in the student handbook.

"The police strongly advise all households that possess any munitions to please check on their security," Van Buren added. "With hunting season upon us and the security of our school and your children our utmost priority, please inventory your munitions and weapons, if you may have them in your households, and inform the police of anything else we may need to know. You can also encourage your students to come foward with any information they may have."

Rehoboth police and state police out of the Dartmouth barracks had no new information Monday night.

In the wake of the five school shootings nationwide over the past year, the regional school board in late October approved costs for cameras and door buzzer systems to the front and rear entrances at the middle school.

The high school has a buzzer system.

"In a perfect world with lots of school funding, we would have cameras at the high school, but we feel what we have now is sufficient," school committee Vice Chairwoman Paula Money said Monday night, adding she spoke with Superintendent Francis Connor, who she said told her "everything is fine."

Connor said in October administration and staff members met with police chiefs from both Dighton and Rehoboth. He said the chiefs would make suggestions for increasing safety at the entrances of all three schools.

At King Philip Regional High School in Wrentham in early November, a handgun with no ammunition was determined by police to have been brought into the school by a student. The 15-year-old boy from Plainville was sent to a Rhode Island juvenile facility and the gun was found by police. The student is being charged with the crime, police say.

Mansfield school officials told parents last week there are plans in December to have scaled-down lockdowns at the elementary and middle schools, and in January to have a full lockdown drill at the high school where police will search for an intruder.

A lockdown drill is also scheduled to be carried out Wednesday at the old Wood School in Plainville.
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http://www.thesunchronicle.com/articles/2006/12/05/news/news2.txt
 
Another possibility is that the shooter loaded a 300 Winchester Magnum where a 300 Remington Ultra Mag cartridge was supposed to go.

So much unsupported brass and excessive headspace woudl have certainly cause the case to rupture, though it is highly likely that the chamber would have held its integrity and the gas dispersed out the side vent holes and the bolt lug raceways.

Savage have a great design to handle escaping gas from a ruptured case. One of the best, in fact.
 
As for the bullet tips, they were .45 caliber, possibly from older, military-issued ammunition, officials said.

Perry said "at one time, they were full bullets. You can see where someone pried the bullet tip from the casing, maybe for gun powder. We are not sure."

The tips were connected to part of the bullet casings, he added.
Click to expand...

This little block here is utterly amazing!!!!

Bullet Tips, possibly military issued... (Trying to make them sound as dangerous as possible)

"at one time, they were full bullets" (I've yet to see a half bullet and I've been around guns for a while...)

The tips were connected to part of the bullet casings (Casings? I wonder what the casings were stuffed with? Venison and pork fat? Sounds yummy...)

Simply amazing...
 
derek said:
This little block here is utterly amazing!!!!

"at one time, they were full bullets" (I've yet to see a half bullet and I've been around guns for a while...)

Simply amazing...
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"Half bullets" would be police/journalist forensic speak for full wadcutters.

Semi wadcutters would be half-full half bullets. [smile]
 
My favorite quote was here:
"With hunting season upon us and the security of our school and your children our utmost priority, please inventory your munitions and weapons, if you may have them in your households, and inform the police of anything else we may need to know. You can also encourage your students to come foward with any information they may have."
Click to expand...
Dear sir - you do NOT need to know what's in my gun cabinet. It's none of your damned business.
 
"In a perfect world with lots of school funding, we would have cameras at the high school, but we feel what we have now is sufficient," school committee Vice Chairwoman Paula Money said Monday night
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No, dingbat, in a perfect world you wouldn't need cameras at all.
 
EddieCoyle said:
Unless they can convince a jury that the gun maker is at fault because it was too easy to put it back together wrong, or that they didn't warn the user sufficiently as to the results of putting it back together wrong.
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Unfortunately, I'm sure that the morons that actually get on this jury will surely find that it is the evil gun and the evil gun manufacture that is at fault.

After all... we are supposed to make every freaking thing absolutly idiot proof so that there is no possible way that any harm could ever come from using anything..

Also look for Reily to ban all Savage firearms before he leaves... or maybe Martha will make that her first act [rolleyes]
 
matt1956 said:
Unfortunately, I'm sure that the morons that actually get on this jury will surely find that it is the evil gun and the evil gun manufacture that is at fault.
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+1 I had the pleasure of Bailiff duty in the Marines for a few weeks. There were a couple of times I was sure I could convince the jury that the Sun rotated around the Earth had I been given the chance... [thinking]
 
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