Magazine Blocks to reduce capacity. Are they legal in MA?

One would *think* that if you did such a thing as to 'permanently' cripple your own magazines by gluing in a block, etc., that you were most certainly adhering to the 'spirit' of the law. You'd really have to have other charges (and other things to worry about) vs this possible add-on charge that you would almost certainly plead away. If gang bangers are walking the streets after committing heinous crimes with actual large-cap stick magazines, you *should* be good to go with a epoxied-in mag blockage if your gun use is otherwise legal.

But hey, Massachusetts, so, ya know, 'think' and 'should' do not necessarily apply.
 
The P30 I bought from a MA dealer about a decade ago came with 1 ten rounder and 1 fifteen rounder factory pin/welded to 10. Guess it was around the time they were running short on cripple mags and had to convert some.
 
Badger Mountain Supply sells "magazine repair kits" and claims they are legal in all the commie states to own, *as long as you don't assemble them back to fully functioning standard capacity mags*. Their entire business strategy is to buy mags in bulk, take em apart and ship them disassembled but complete - follower, spring, body, base and sell it to you for 1.5-3x the price. What you do with it is up to you "wink wink". Which is why they also highly recommend you buy some quick super glue and ten round limiters just in case your local SWAT is on their way and you need to "demonstrate compliance". lol....

My question is - how is that legal? Wouldn't having all the components of a standard capacity mag constitute constructive intent? Just like having a completed lower and a 10.5 inch upper without the uncle feds stamp blessing is a no-no?
 
Bought Sig M11 from gunbroker with high cap mags and FFL "modified" mags with 10rd blocks.
Good on them. A lot of FFLs just keep the standard caps to sell later and give you a gun with nothing if you're in a restrictive state.
 
Read upthread - there's no case law on this. Someone decided that epoxy is good enough - no one knows if that's overkill or not enough. Go figure.

Five or six years ago I read the MA and NY laws in a fair amount of detail. This was done because I was heading to upstate NY and I was trying to decided what equipment I was bring and what I was not. I could find no mention in MA law on blockers or modification of existing magazines to reduce the capacity. In NY there was provision written in the law stating if the modification to reduce the capacity was permanent then it was legal. I did not did look around further trying to see or find what the definition of permanent was.

If you go to some of the places that sell mag blocks they will include small envelopes of epoxy and instruct you to use it. These sites do not quote any laws or statues but instead imply if you use it you are good to go. Others will tell you that if you need tools to remove the block or restore capacity you are good to go. Once again no proof offered on the accuracy of this.

I have mag blocks installed on some magazines. I chose to epoxy the mag blocks. I also chose to never have any replacement parts that can be used restore the magazine actually stored with the magazine. I looked at the potential situations with LEO and decided if I made it is as hard as possible to restore the capacity of the magazine to stock on the side of the road and I made sure to never have any parts on me that could be used to restore the capacity I was good to go. At the end of the day it is all about what level of risk you feel comfortable with.

I feel the greater issue is with "pre-ban" magazines. Unless there are date codes it is not easy to prove a magazine is pre-ban. I have some 30rd. AR magazines that were my Dad's. He got them in the early 70s. No date codes on them. The only thing that could potentially allow me to prove pre-ban is they were made in USA which is kind of rare these days. I have some pre-ban P226 magazines made in Germany in the late 80s, early 90s. Once again, hard to prove on the side of the road. Sure you can tell the cop they quit making them in Gemany before the ban or the zig zag seam on the back of the magazine means pre-ban but they don't have to believe you. Once again the LEO on the side of the road is more likely to take you in and let someone else sort it out.
 
Wondering - has there been a documented arrest in MA for someone carrying a Glock with a 30 year old U-Notch and the cop saw the 'high cap' that only LEO can have the privilege of carrying? Cuffed, booked, processed and time wasted. Ever happen?
 
Badger Mountain Supply sells "magazine repair kits" and claims they are legal in all the commie states to own, *as long as you don't assemble them back to fully functioning standard capacity mags*. Their entire business strategy is to buy mags in bulk, take em apart and ship them disassembled but complete - follower, spring, body, base and sell it to you for 1.5-3x the price. What you do with it is up to you "wink wink". Which is why they also highly recommend you buy some quick super glue and ten round limiters just in case your local SWAT is on their way and you need to "demonstrate compliance". lol....

My question is - how is that legal? Wouldn't having all the components of a standard capacity mag constitute constructive intent? Just like having a completed lower and a 10.5 inch upper without the uncle feds stamp blessing is a no-no?
This is hilariously stupid. If someone intends to have an illegal post-ban "high cap" mag, I'm sure plenty of businesses will ship them here without knowing (or caring about) silly MA laws. Why on earth someone would pay "1.5-3x the price" for them is beyond me.

Like I said, everything in this state comes down to risk tolerance. Some people choose to air on the side of extreme caution, like the guy who was trying to register a registered gun a few weeks ago; others just do what seems reasonably sufficient to follow the law; some probably don't care either way, I don't know. Everyone just needs to put on big boy pants and decide for themselves, quite frankly, and remember to never talk to the police.
 
Badger Mountain Supply sells "magazine repair kits" and claims they are legal in all the commie states to own, *as long as you don't assemble them back to fully functioning standard capacity mags*. Their entire business strategy is to buy mags in bulk, take em apart and ship them disassembled but complete - follower, spring, body, base and sell it to you for 1.5-3x the price. What you do with it is up to you "wink wink". Which is why they also highly recommend you buy some quick super glue and ten round limiters just in case your local SWAT is on their way and you need to "demonstrate compliance". lol....

My question is - how is that legal? Wouldn't having all the components of a standard capacity mag constitute constructive intent? Just like having a completed lower and a 10.5 inch upper without the uncle feds stamp blessing is a no-no?

Untested in mass but imo a hard sell on a conviction. Honestly the people buying these things aren't shitting their pants, ill just leave it at that.
 
The blocking solution has to survive the determination and tools on hand of whatever cop is inspecting your stuff. Pray he isn't a douche with a sawzall.
Read upthread.
Whatever cop is inspecting your stuff has to survive whatever blocking solution you used.
He should pray he isn't a douche with a ball peen hammer.

Wouldn't having all the components of a standard capacity mag constitute constructive intent possession?
(FTFY?)

I feel the greater issue is with "pre-ban" magazines. Unless there are date codes it is not easy to prove a magazine is pre-ban.
Why would someone want to "prove a magazine is pre-ban"?
In the American legal system, who has that job?
 
Read upthread.
Whatever cop is inspecting your stuff has to survive whatever blocking solution you used.
He should pray he isn't a douche with a ball peen hammer.


(FTFY?)


Why would someone want to "prove a magazine is pre-ban"?
In the American legal system, who has that job?
Can't help but imagine some type of Looney Tunes explosion.

wile-e-coyote-blown-up-300x330.jpg
 
I still see nothing in MA law that says or implies in any way that a "blocked" post-ban hi-cap magazine is good to go. Other states which explicitly permit it, yes. Massachusetts, nyet! [thinking] It's all a bunch of wishful thinking in my opinion. Still waiting for the first test case. [mg]
 
I still see nothing in MA law that says or implies in any way that a "blocked" post-ban hi-cap magazine is good to go. Other states which explicitly permit it, yes. Massachusetts, nyet! [thinking] It's all a bunch of wishful thinking in my opinion. Still waiting for the first test case. [mg]

Protip: that's not how laws work, Beatrice
 
FYI I know someone who was stopped in Boston at gunpoint because of a "man with gun" call - not sure if be was printing, wind blew his jacket open, etc. Cops disarmed him and unloaded his magazine. He was not arrested and was eventually let go. Point being, it's possible for cops to be inspecting your mags without it being any sort of add-on offense.
Carrying anything > 10 rounds other than a 100% legit without any "definition games" is very ill advised. If you are involved in a dynamic encounter, no matter how justified, the system will be looking for something to get you on and will be willing and able to expend the resources to do so. If you are super clean on the gun, mags and action expect the system to get video from any surveillance cameras present to see if they can get you for double parking.
 
I still see nothing in MA law that says or implies in any way that a "blocked" post-ban hi-cap magazine is good to go. Other states which explicitly permit it, yes. Massachusetts, nyet! [thinking] It's all a bunch of wishful thinking in my opinion. Still waiting for the first test case. [mg]

Username checks out
 
Protip: that's not how laws work, Beatrice
Well, you can't blame a guy for assuming that in the Mass legal system,
absence of evidence is evidence of absence.

If some court holds that a large cap feeding device body
that's downrated with a "block" is still a large cap feeding device;
well, there's your answer that gluing some plastic into a mag is not a cure for warts.

Barley-corn, barley-corn, injun-meal shorts,
Spunk-water, spunk-water, swaller these warts

On the other hand, if decades go by and no one ever gets jacked up on that,
it's nature's way of telling you that by and large courts aren't that desperate...
 
On the other hand, if decades go by and no one ever gets jacked up on that,
it's nature's way of telling you that by and large courts aren't that desperate...
The problem is that there are a lots and lots of provisions of MA gun law that don't get used by Maura et al to zing folks on a daily basis. Hell, some probably don't even get used on a yearly basis. It doesn't mean that they can be wished away. They can certainly be ignored (and probably are by many), but they do still exist.

The way that MA law was written to ban hi-caps but then allow one exception for pre-ban hi-caps does not give me a whole lot of confidence in NES wishful thinking that a personally modified post-ban hi-cap is also somehow exempt from the law. Just my opinion. I am not a lawyer.

Consider that criminals don't care and most good folks are not having their magazines examined by the police very often. Therefore, I am not surprised that a test case regarding personally modified post-ban magazines has not emerged. I wish one would, but no luck so far. It would be great if a test case ruled that personally modified post-bans are entirely legal. It would be even better if the MA hi-cap ban were thrown out altogether.
 
If proving the age of a preban mag is difficult then i would think when it comes to neutered mags claiming ' I bought it that way' isn't going to do much good either. In my opinion the mag either takes 10 rounds or less or it takes more. That being said I think there should be zero gray area with a carry gun.
 
Why would someone want to "prove a magazine is pre-ban"?
In the American legal system, who has that job?

Yep, you are correct. However as much as you may find it repulsive if I can unquestionably demonstrate on the side of the road the magazine is a pre-ban it just might prevent me from being cuffed and stuffed and taken away. I know the burden of proof is on them but if I get busted and charged that causes me a lot of grief and whole lot of dig deep in my pocket for lots of $$ to walk away a free man when a simple manufacturer's date code might have prevented all of it.
 
Yep, you are correct. However as much as you may find it repulsive if I can unquestionably demonstrate on the side of the road the magazine is a pre-ban it just might prevent me from being cuffed and stuffed and taken away. I know the burden of proof is on them but if I get busted and charged that causes me a lot of grief and whole lot of dig deep in my pocket for lots of $$ to walk away a free man when a simple manufacturer's date code might have prevented all of it.

lol except 999/1000 times it’s not “happening on the side of the road”.
 
Yep, you are correct. However as much as you may find it repulsive if I can unquestionably demonstrate on the side of the road the magazine is a pre-ban it just might prevent me from being cuffed and stuffed and taken away. I know the burden of proof is on them but if I get busted and charged that causes me a lot of grief and whole lot of dig deep in my pocket for lots of $$ to walk away a free man when a simple manufacturer's date code might have prevented all of it.
Traffic cops are just as likely to have memorized Avogadro's Number
as the grandfathering date for pre-ban mags.
 
Carrying anything > 10 rounds other than a 100% legit without any "definition games" is very ill advised. If you are involved in a dynamic encounter, no matter how justified, the system will be looking for something to get you on and will be willing and able to expend the resources to do so. If you are super clean on the gun, mags and action expect the system to get video from any surveillance cameras present to see if they can get you for double parking.
Never underestimate how bad someone wants to make a name for themselves or get a promotion.

Example - that kid being prosecuted for throwing an empty plastic bottle that didnt hit anyone.

I am not saying to sh*t your pants, all I am saying is be prepared for someone to see this as the perfect opportunity to be on the news. Your life gets ruined? - that is secondary and not of importance.
 
Yep, you are correct. However as much as you may find it repulsive if I can unquestionably demonstrate on the side of the road the magazine is a pre-ban it just might prevent me from being cuffed and stuffed and taken away. I know the burden of proof is on them but if I get busted and charged that causes me a lot of grief and whole lot of dig deep in my pocket for lots of $$ to walk away a free man when a simple manufacturer's date code might have prevented all of it.
WRONG.

The worse thing you can do is talk the cops. STFU and let a lawyer do the talking.

I am trying to picture this in my head - guy is being searched (already a bad situation) when the cops find a loaded mag. The guy and the cop are sitting there talking about a date stamp on the mag like civilized people. [rofl]
 
Maybe this has already been mentioned. I purchased Sig P320SC when they were released. I purchased a P320 full size exchange kit at the Sig Pro Shop in Epping. It was a ban state compliant 10 round kit. Included were 17 round mags without dimples. When I took them apart, there was a block double-side taped to the floor plate. Full size mags purchased at a later date were dimpled 17 round mags.
 
The worse thing you can do is talk the cops. STFU and let a lawyer do the talking.

I am trying to picture this in my head - guy is being searched (already a bad situation) when the cops find a loaded mag. The guy and the cop are sitting there talking about a date stamp on the mag like civilized people. [rofl]
604rso.jpg
 
No matter how many times you say this, there is always someone here that posts how they will talk to the cops and talk themselves out of getting arrested.

I said this in like 17 other threads ... I dated a MA prosecutor for a while. One thing she told me was that those that STFU and refused to talk were extremely hard to convict.
 
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