So, given that MA doesn't seem to recognize just the receiver/frame alone as a firearm, does that mean that if I have a gun disassembled on a bench for cleaning, that I don't have to lock it up until I reassemble it?
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MA Storage Laws - Disassembled gun?
- Thread starter Emoto
- Start date
NO!
I asked this very question of Chief Ron Glidden . . . the frame must have a lock on it if unattended or be in some sort of locked case/closet!
Insane? YES!!
So, if I strip down a C&R full of cosmoline, and want to leave it soaking in solvent in my garage, I must have a lock on the trigger/action if I want to walk away from the gun (disassembled parts)!
Regrettably we are dealing with morons when we get stuck with laws written by people who are 150% clueless what they are doing.
I asked this very question of Chief Ron Glidden . . . the frame must have a lock on it if unattended or be in some sort of locked case/closet!
Insane? YES!!
So, if I strip down a C&R full of cosmoline, and want to leave it soaking in solvent in my garage, I must have a lock on the trigger/action if I want to walk away from the gun (disassembled parts)!
Regrettably we are dealing with morons when we get stuck with laws written by people who are 150% clueless what they are doing.
The laws were written without any reference to common sense and will be likewise enforced.
If the gun is not under your direct control it must be secured.
Otherwise, you and your lawyer might get a chance to discuss the interpretation of the law with the judge. That would be expensive and inconvienient.
If the gun is not under your direct control it must be secured.
Otherwise, you and your lawyer might get a chance to discuss the interpretation of the law with the judge. That would be expensive and inconvienient.
![[hmmm]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/009.gif "Hmm [hmmm]")
To clarify, in Massachusetts, if a handgun is in a vehicle, it must be securely stored once it is no longer in the "direct control" of a properly licensed person. If we are speaking about guns in buildings, they must be securely stored once they are on longer in the "control" of a licensed person.
Small distinction, but I think there is slightly more latitude for when a gun in a building must be securely stored.
Darius
Small distinction, but I think there is slightly more latitude for when a gun in a building must be securely stored.
Darius
FYI, I bought some el-cheapo trigger locks that consist of two pieces of plastic with a screw between them that uses a spanner wrench (actually looks like a quarter with two small tips coming out of it). These are specifically for "securing" the trigger while soaking in solvent to clean the old guns. They cost something like $0.50 each. If you used a "real lock", the solvent could destroy the mechanism making it very difficult to get off the gun later.
Not that I'm aware of. I think that such a case is more likely to arise in a vehicle situation rather than at home.
A shotgun doesn't lose its essential character as a shotgun just because it's missing a firing pin.
![[smile]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/001.gif "Smile [smile]")
While I don't believe that it involved a shotgun, there actually is case law to support this. Two unfortunate things about this sort of question are that the laws have no rational basis, making it impossible to use reason to decide, and there is extremely little case law on which to rely. The result is that you can either act in a ridiculously over-cautious manner, or risk paying for the privilege of creating the case law.
For example, there's really no legal basis for Ron Glidden's reported opinion that a disassembled gun must have a lock on the frame. Since the gun could easily be reassembled into firing condition, it does require a lock, but there's nothing in Massachusetts law that makes the frame special in any way. OTOH, some police may know federal law, and use it's focus on the frame/receiver to fill in the blanks in Massachusetts law, while others will simply look at the part/s that mot clearly look like a gun, and conclude that there has to be a lock on it/them. As a result, having a lock on a slide, bolt or hammer that prevents their operation would meet the requirements of the law, and (most likely) prevent an arrest for unsafe storage, while removing those same parts from the gun, installing the same locks on them, then storing them in a bank vault would open you up to a chance of arrest and conviction. It's not reasonable, but it is Massachusetts.
![[rolleyes]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/042.gif "Roll Eyes [rolleyes]")
Ken
Yes, my discussion with Ron Glidden included the example of dropping the trigger group out of an M1. Even separating the barrel/receiver assembly from the trigger group did NOT make the lock requirement go away!
Just do it . . . it's easier and cheaper than paying an attorney to defend your actions.
Just do it . . . it's easier and cheaper than paying an attorney to defend your actions.
Okay, I'll bite. If you disassemble yer M-1 Garand, and widely separate the pieces, which portion requires the lock?
my vote goes for:
The piece that includes the receiver would be most likely to be recognised as a gun, despite some obscure interpretation of MGL that would technically exempt a bare receiver.
However, if you field strip a FAL, I wouldn't bet anything of value that a non "gunnie" would correctly distinguish between the upper and lower receiver.
![[thinking]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/010.gif "Thinking [thinking]")
I hope I'm not too off topic asking this here but I've always wondered about gun stores that have racks of firearms unlocked. How are they in compliance with MA storage of firearms? I would assume that they're not in direct control.
Direct control isn't the issue. "Control" is. They've got that covered.
OK, so taking the example of a gun shop with a bunch of rifles standing in racks in the area of the store where customers can walk around, if that is under control, then is having an unsecured firearm in my livingroom leaning up against the wall while my non-licensed girlfriend is in the room with me also OK?
I'm so freakin' confused.......
Yeah... ditto. All the rifles sitting in the open in gun stores doesn't seem like control to me... but what ever. This state sucks is the only answer that makes any sense lately.
my vote goes for:
The piece that includes the receiver would be most likely to be recognised as a gun, despite some obscure interpretation of MGL that would technically exempt a bare receiver.
However, if you field strip a FAL, I wouldn't bet anything of value that a non "gunnie" would correctly distinguish between the upper and lower receiver.
It was a bit of a trick question. The only practical way I know of to lock an assembled M-1 Garand (other than in a securely locked container) is to place a trigger lock on (drum roll....) the trigger and trigger guard.
However when you disassemble the major components, placing a lock on the trigger housing group doesn't make much sense. But in keeping with the theme of this thread, the receiver is the serial-numbered part and hence the piece which should be locked and that would require a cable lock or a padlock with a hasp (?) long enough to fit around the receiver walls.
Sure, so long as you remain close enough to keep that firearm under your control, or, if you are going out of range, properly secure it, or be willing to assume the risk of violating state law.
Negative.
"M.G.L. c. 140, § 131L makes it unlawful to store or keep any firearm, rifle or shotgun including, but not limited to, large capacity weapons, or machine gun in any place unless such weapon is secured in a locked container or equipped with a tamper-resistant mechanical lock or other safety device, properly engaged so as to render such weapon inoperable by any person other than the owner or other lawfully authorized."
- read complete text at http://www.mass.gov/?pageID=eopster...p_firearms_msp_firearms_c140_s131l&csid=Eeops
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Hey, I made damn sure I was a good little Mass. Subject tonight while cleaning my SKS:
![[laugh2]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/014.gif "Laugh at above [laugh2]")
![[rofl]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/013.gif "ROFL [rofl]")
![[laugh]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/012.gif "Laugh [laugh]")
![[rofl2]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/035.gif "ROFL2 [rofl2]")
I suggest you take on this mission and report back to us in 1 year as to all the changes you've accomplished!
