MA magazine limit/AWB

[DK12]

With all these other states overturning mag limits, and AWBs due to the supreme court ruling, do you folks think this will be addressed in the near future? Any mention from GOAL or other groups?

Edit: I was tired while posting I am aware this post was massively misleading just want to get a MA specific discussion going on these topics to hear people's opinions.

 

[kalash]

What states have overturned mag limits or AWB recently?

 

[sjohnston0311]

I haven't heard of any specifics, but I figured the usual groups were probably waiting to see how similar lawsuits played out elsewhere (CA, MD) so they can use those cases as leverage.

With that said, the lizard people in the MA government are going to fight that tooth and nail.

 

[Lowbird]

Only story was that the LAPD was no longer going to enforce the CA mag ban. So not an overturn in itself.

 

[TJ4]

Only story was that the LAPD was no longer going to enforce the CA mag ban. So not an overturn in itself.

Lol, I saw that. Yeah, I’ll trust that any pd won’t suddenly change their mind with new leadership or when threatened by a leftist pol who controls their budget, or just to selectively enforce it When they’re sick of you.

 

[gerrycaruso]

The peope who run Ma don't want you to have guns. Logic, statistics and laws mean nothing to them. They'll fight you forever no matter what the rest of the country does. Move away if you can.

 

[Sparky123]

The peope who run Ma don't want you to have guns. Logic, statistics and laws mean nothing to them. They'll fight you forever no matter what the rest of the country does. Move away if you can.

You took the words right out of my mouth.

 

[P51MA]

With all these other states overturning mag limits, and AWBs due to the supreme court ruling, do you folks think this will be addressed in the near future? Any mention from GOAL or other groups?

The mag limits and AWBs still need to play out in other states.

If they get overturned in another state outside the 1st circuit, that doesn’t change things in MA.

However, if they get overturned elsewhere, and then MA upholds them, that would put 2 federal circuits in disagreement which usually forces SCOTUS to take the case up.

So at best there’s probably a few years before we have any hope here, but there is hope.

 

[Mark from MA]

Mag limits in this state are dependent on which cop stops you.

I have a retired Chief of Police friend who thinks if you have a class A you can have any mag you want, pre or post ban, and in his day would never charge anyone with an LTC-A with possession of any post ban mag.

I know others on town police who think there is no such thing as a pre ban mag and glocks are illegal.

Mag ban overturns in other states mean nothing until there is a clear law stated that everyone can understand. Until then there is always a risk of being charged and having to pay lawyers fees for nothing.

 

[greencobra]

but there is hope.

you must be new to the game...i hope i'm wrong but i foresee no change in existing awb or mag limit laws in massachusetts. maybe i'm a whipped dog but i've heard all the rhetoric, donated for countless years and marched around the state house until my feet hurt and we are not any better off for it. it's been chip. chip, chip away at our rights a little at a time. vermont is falling, so is maine. mass, ct. and ri are gone. nh, the place everyone thinks is the land of freedom is ready to topple soon. remember, for every massachusetts resident moving north for the gun issue, 50 other mass liberals are heading north to escape taxes and the cost of living. and new yorkers also. pretty soon the balance is going to swing. look how much texas is changing with the influx of liberals escaping taxes in their home states, particularly california. i've said it before, those escapees, whether heading to new hampshire or texas, bring the politics with them.

 

[Dennis in MA]

The peope who run Ma don't want you to have guns. Logic, statistics and laws mean nothing to them. They'll fight you forever no matter what the rest of the country does. Move away if you can.

No sir! You couldn't DRAG me away! I'll just stay and fight. Imagine if the OG G-dub and Teej and Jadams took off for Elba or something. "We'll be more free there. Sounds like a plan."


I saw an interesting clip of the AWB hearings yesterday or the day before. Whitlock (I think) asked if anyone on the other side would contend that this was NOT about banning weapons in common use. Nadler comes right out, "Oh we are TOTALLY banning common use weapons with this bill. That's the point." Whitlock is STUNNED. It was pretty funny. Sets up a lot of "oh, wait. Yeah, that's what we want. A ban on that."

He also brought up Brown v. Board of Ed which was so eloquent. And pointed out it was the Dems that were against THAT as well. LOL

I think 3 SC decisions in a row where they mention "COMMON USE" means a death knell for AWB's and mag bans in the very near future.

 

[TLB]

you must be new to the game...i hope i'm wrong but i foresee no change in existing awb or mag limit laws in massachusetts. maybe i'm a whipped dog but i've heard all the rhetoric, donated for countless years and marched around the state house until my feet hurt and we are not any better off for it. it's been chip. chip, chip away at our rights a little at a time. vermont is falling, so is maine. mass, ct. and ri are gone. nh, the place everyone thinks is the land of freedom is ready to topple soon. remember, for every massachusetts resident moving north for the gun issue, 50 other mass liberals are heading north to escape taxes and the cost of living. and new yorkers also. pretty soon the balance is going to swing. look how much texas is changing with the influx of liberals escaping taxes in their home states, particularly california. i've said it before, those escapees, whether heading to new hampshire or texas, bring the politics with them.

Nothing will happen at the MA level. If/when it happens, it will be the federal courts/SCOTUS that will bring down the AWB/mag limits...

 

[ReluctantDecoy]

I'm actually worried if MA would ever repeal mag limits, as I'd end up spending like a grand on just magazines.

 

[P51MA]

you must be new to the game...i hope i'm wrong but i foresee no change in existing awb or mag limit laws in massachusetts. maybe i'm a whipped dog but i've heard all the rhetoric, donated for countless years and marched around the state house until my feet hurt and we are not any better off for it. it's been chip. chip, chip away at our rights a little at a time. vermont is falling, so is maine. mass, ct. and ri are gone. nh, the place everyone thinks is the land of freedom is ready to topple soon. remember, for every massachusetts resident moving north for the gun issue, 50 other mass liberals are heading north to escape taxes and the cost of living. and new yorkers also. pretty soon the balance is going to swing. look how much texas is changing with the influx of liberals escaping taxes in their home states, particularly california. i've said it before, those escapees, whether heading to new hampshire or texas, bring the politics with them.

Absolutely nothing good will happen coming from MA government.

But Bruen has firmly set in motion a lot of things that MA can’t stop. Take a good read of the language.

Now, I don’t totally discount the possibility of court packing or, heck, the US just disintegrating or suspending the constitution in the next fake state of emergency (we are on the wrong side of the fence in that event), but barring something like that it is only a matter of how long it takes.

 

[KMM696]

I'm actually worried if MA would ever repeal mag limits, as I'd end up spending like a grand on just magazines.

Look at it this way - if the mag limits are repealed, that's you buying 50 mags for a grand instead of 10.

 

[pastera]

Nothing will happen at the MA level. If/when it happens, it will be the federal courts/SCOTUS that will bring down the AWB/mag limits...

Supreme Court Sends Key Gun Control Cases Back to Lower Courts for Reconsideration Under Bruen - The Truth About Guns

&#9664Previous Post Next Post▶ As expected, this morning the Supreme Court disposed of a number of cases challenging gun control laws that it had been holding pending the ruling in New York Rifle & Pistol Association v. Bruen. The language in the Bruen ruling now provides clear guidance to lower...

www.thetruthaboutguns.com

Young v. Hawaii — Challenges Hawaii’s ban on open carry as infringing citizens’ Second Amendment right to bear firearms outside the home.

Bianchi v. Frosh — Challenges Maryland’s “assault weapons” ban under Heller’s common use language.

ANJRPC v. Grewal — Challenges New Jersey’s “high capacity” magazine ban for violating the Second Amendment, the takings clause of the Fifth Amendment, and the equal protection clause of the Fourteenth Amendment.

Duncan v. Bonta — Challenges California’s “high capacity” magazine ban as violating the Second and Fifth Amendments as well as the two-step interest-balancing process explicitly repudiated in the Bruen ruling.

Magazine capacity is well represented
Maryland's reaction could be interesting
4th said they can't override the en banc in Kolbe which decided that 2A didn't cover "weapons of war" and if it did then only intermediate scrutiny applied.
Cert petition is simply:
"Whether the Constitution allows the government to prohibit law-abiding, responsible citizens from protecting themselves, their families, and their homes with a type of 'Arms' that are in common use for lawful purposes?"

That it was given cert after the original case in Kolbe was denied in 2017 shows that SCOTUS is strongly favoring striking down AWBs

The 4th will strike down the Maryland AWB which creates a split with the 9th (among others)
The magazine capacity bans will fall in Cali and NJ so we will have a split to go with here

AWBs and magazine limits will fall but it's going to take two to three years unless one of the circuits jumps a shark and forces SCOTUS' hand.

 

[ReluctantDecoy]

Look at it this way - if the mag limits are repealed, that's you buying 50 mags for a grand instead of 10.

Good point. Or like 2.5 Glock Square notches on Gunbroker.

 

[knucklehead]

I think it was last week or so that Gun's & Gadgets (YouTube) was looking for people for lawsuits in MA (Im not sure AWB or Mags). I don't know who he was working with FPC, GOA etc

 

[pastera]

It will likely be cheaper and faster to let the other cases play out before filing here but getting everything setup to file asap once the others fall is smart

 

[Lowbird]

I think it was last week or so that Gun's & Gadgets (YouTube) was looking for people for lawsuits in MA (Im not sure AWB or Mags). I don't know who he was working with FPC, GOA etc

FPC

 

[greencobra]

But Bruen has firmly set in motion a lot of things that MA can’t stop.

so besides having to issue an ltc for the reason of cc for self defense, and in mass, now it will be an unrestricted ltc, please enlighten me on what i missed. i'd be grateful for the education. i also think you can still be denied an ltc in mass if the licensing authority deems you "unsuitable", whatever that means. i guess being a felon, that jumps into mind first.

 

[greencobra]

Nothing will happen at the MA level. If/when it happens, it will be the federal courts/SCOTUS that will bring down the AWB/mag limits...

yeah, i agree. but i don't think scotus will touch that type of state level regulation just cause it has nothing to do with the constitutional right of self defense. the argument would have to be made by some world class litigator for the state laws to be struck down. people can argue the point all day long but i dunno. i'd like things to go back to the way they were but i don't see it happening.

 

[pastera]

i also think you can still be denied an ltc in mass if the licensing authority deems you "unsuitable", whatever that means. i guess being a felon, that jumps into mind first.

Yes the unsuitable part still exists but that is susceptible to judicial review and Bruen places a high burden of evidence on the court to uphold the denial.
None of this has worked it's way to stable case law as of yet but pretty much anything short of actions or statements declaring the intent to cause harm shouldn't bar someone as unsuitable.

 

[Reptile]

The cost of hiring a lawyer to defend you on a pre ban mag charge will cost you $5,000.00.

I could imagine myself paying $5,000 just to have hi cap mags.

Therefore, if the law changes and I lose the value of all my pre bans - it will be like losing $5,000.

To me that is worth it to have freedom.

In the mean time, I'll keep buying pre bans because the law may never change.

 

[pastera]

yeah, i agree. but i don't think scotus will touch that type of state level regulation just cause it has nothing to do with the constitutional right of self defense. the argument would have to be made by some world class litigator for the state laws to be struck down. people can argue the point all day long but i dunno. i'd like things to go back to the way they were but i don't see it happening.

Concur - the Mass supreme Court is very unlikely to take a case where they will need to apply Bruen but it isn't impossible (Ramirez v Commonwealth)

 

[greencobra]

Yes the unsuitable part still exists but that is susceptible to judicial review and Bruen places a high burden of evidence on the court to uphold the denial.
None of this has worked it's way to stable case law as of yet but pretty much anything short of actions or statements declaring the intent to cause harm shouldn't bar someone as unsuitable.

yep. the ag's memo said wanting a ltc for concealed carry self defense is not a reason for denial. but i'm sure it'll be the same old shit, dui's, felonies...same ball of wax we have now. the firearms attorneys are salivating with the work this is gonna bring.

 

[pastera]

Most of what would now be considered unsuitable under Bruen is already covered by federal prohibition.
Things like the town's angry drunk whose frequent interactions with the law never rise to prohibition would be a place for suitability on a case by case basis as decided by a court.

 

[greencobra]

what i do see, and again i'm hoping, is "the list" goes away. i'm thinking that it limits lower income potential gun owners from buying a wider selection because of price point. i think we can agree it would be easier to trash that damn list than to re-write it looking at price. we all know low price = killy, which translates to unsafe at all costs to our illustrious law makers. kinda like the thing that goes up on the end.

 

[P51MA]

so besides having to issue an ltc for the reason of cc for self defense, and in mass, now it will be an unrestricted ltc, please enlighten me on what i missed. i'd be grateful for the education. i also think you can still be denied an ltc in mass if the licensing authority deems you "unsuitable", whatever that means. i guess being a felon, that jumps into mind first.

The most important parts of the decision are not the mandatory shall-issue, although that is very nice.

The most important part is that they struck down intermediate scrutiny and “interest balancing” in regards to the 2a, requiring courts to use a strict text and history approach in regards to the second amendment going forward.

Interest balancing is the basis that has been used for AWBs for example, where the state can say “we will allow firearms ownership, but we need to restrict certain scary ones, and we can do this because it balances 2a rights with public safety”.

Suitability is also effectively gone, despite whatever language they still have. It no longer has any teeth, and they will have trouble using it for anything besides prohibited persons. In fact, prohibited persons status itself may be challenged under strict scrutiny.

 

[pastera]

what i do see, and again i'm hoping, is "the list" goes away. i'm thinking that it limits lower income potential gun owners from buying a wider selection because of price point. i think we can agree it would be easier to trash that damn list than to re-write it looking at price. we all know low price = killy, which translates to unsafe at all costs to our illustrious law makers. kinda like the thing that goes up on the end.

In common use, end of conversation.

But it's likely much easier to get the interstate restrictions struck down which will have the same effect but help more people.