M1 Garand Loads

[eo1bart]

Just got this message by email from CMP

" Dear CMP Family,
The CMP advises to not use .30/06 ammunition in M1 Garands, 1903s, and 1903A3s that is loaded beyond 50,000 CUP and has a bullet weight more than 172gr. These rifles are at least 70 years old and were not designed for max loads and super heavy bullets. Always wear hearing and eye protection when firing an M1 Garand, 1903 and/or 1903A3 rifle."

Sounds like someone got bit by a hot load

 

[76Too]

Common sense rules apply.

I DID notice that they don’t mention the M1917 though...probably not much of a concern in THAT over-engineered action.

 

[mac1911]

Unless your still running XTC or going out past 600 yards theres not much reason to shoot anything over 168gn at max loads.
Also unless hunting whos running 200/220 grain full house hunting rounds through a M1 or 1903/a3?

 

[jpm]

Since the M72 match ammo is 173gr they sent out a clarification email after that to say "more than 172-174gr"

The 1917 is such a tank you could probably double charge the load and it would still smile and say 'thank you sir may I have another!'

 

[FPrice]

I wonder if anything in particular sparked this warning?

I am by no means an M1 Garand expert but I've known that since my first M1.

 

[jpm]

I was thinking the same thing. Something obviously happened that prompted this urgent email to everyone.

 

[Mountain]

Of course my Garand loads are moderate and well within the limitations CMP states. I tend to use 155's more often in the 1/12 barrel but it is just as accurate with 168's as far as I can determine. I use the same loads but only neck size for my 1903. There are groups of old hens who like to cackle and say Varget is NFG for .30-06 and 168's or heavier but I have multiple targets that disagree with their opinion, plus I know others getting excellent results. You can get pretty good velocity with Varget even with loads for 175's and still stay below 50,000 CUP at max recommended load.

.30-06
BULLET WEIGHT 175 GR. SIE HPBT

	Starting Load		Maximum Loads
	Manufacturer	Powder		Bullet Diam.	C.O.L		Grs.	Vel. (ft/s)	Pressure		Grs.	Vel. (ft/s)	Pressure
	Hodgdon	H4350	BUY NOW	0.308"	3.300"		55.0	2,661	42,100 CUP		59.0	2,842	48,700 CUP
	Hodgdon	H4831	BUY NOW	0.308"	3.300"		57.0	2,535	38,300 CUP		61.5C	2,719	44,400 CUP
	Hodgdon	H4895	BUY NOW	0.308"	3.300"		43.8	2,584	44,100 CUP		46.7	2,700	49,000 CUP
	Hodgdon	Varget	BUY NOW	0.308"	3.300"		45.0	2,551	41,700 CUP		48.0	2,694	49,000 CUP

Surprised CMP made the cut-off below 175 grain bullets. There are many who use 175's for vintage sniper competition. I use 155's for the OCSA 200 yard version, but at Camp Ethan Allen I use 175's for 600 yards. That valley gets some weird crosswinds and you will often see 3 wind flags all pointing different directions. Haven't shot H4350 for a while and may try that with 175 TMK's. Crap, I hope I have a decent amount of 175's...

 

[jpm]

I suspect people were buying whatever was on the shelf and shooting it thru CMP garands and breaking them. I've seen a lot of 180gr hunting ammo recently that came and went fast.

 

[Mountain]

I suspect people were buying whatever was on the shelf and shooting it thru CMP garands and breaking them. I've seen a lot of 180gr hunting ammo recently that came and went fast.

Given the current situation, I'd say that's more likely now than ever.

 

[mac1911]

The slower powder in the heavier bullet ammo is what causes issues with the M1

when I get a chance I will do a few comparisons on Quck loads
Slower powders you can have less chamber pressure and more port pressure
Heres some ikd school loads

View: https://www.scribd.com/document/40852596/Reloading-for-the-M1-Rifle-J-Clarke

 

[Mountain]

The slower powder in the heavier bullet ammo is what causes issues with the M1

when I get a chance I will do a few comparisons on Quck loads
Slower powders you can have less chamber pressure and more port pressure
Heres some ikd school loads

View: https://www.scribd.com/document/40852596/Reloading-for-the-M1-Rifle-J-Clarke

Lots of good stuff in that article. The author does recommend 180's, however.

 

[mac1911]

Lots of good stuff in that article. The author does recommend 180's, however.

Thats from 1986 iirc they might have still been poking out to 1000 yards?
I only know a handful of long range shooters and they all say the heaviest bullet to buck the wind?
Anyway other than the lack of ammo I still always wonder why anyone would want to shoot anything heavy and full house out of a M1 ?
Especially if your just shooting at 200 yards.
I might mess around with the next M1 from the CMP and find the absolute lightest accurate load I can get with full function.
My cast load testing I could get my M1 with a tight gas system and old spring to cycle on 36 grains of H4895. Maybe a slower powder to get some more psi at the gas port ?

i know a old timer that said he ran 220 gn soft points at matches that did not hand out ammo , he said the V targets whete what he shot at with the garand.
He also said during his time of match shooting you could go to perry head over to the Springdield Armory Trailer and they would check and fix your rifle for “free”
Also had parts dirt cheap , so they could flirt with “hot” loads

I think this announcement from cmp was not well thought out , much like their rules.
They should have came out and just said ammo loaded to M1 or M2 ball specs or less. Either way im ready I have several cast loads that I can use , I think they run about 28-35,000 psi
I see things changing for the worse.
Either they will go back to providing ammo at the matches or somehow make it factory ammo only?

 

[Mountain]

I agree that the announcement follows their rules 'logic' as in too little. I don't think selling enough ammo is possible and they will have a revolt if they go to factory only. That would push me into high power and chasing leg points instead of Games events. Guess I could always put ammo in factory boxes until they wear out.

 

[mac1911]

I agree that the announcement follows their rules 'logic' as in too little. I don't think selling enough ammo is possible and they will have a revolt if they go to factory only. That would push me into high power and chasing leg points instead of Games events. Guess I could always put ammo in factory boxes until they wear out.

Nah , just the deep pocket players will play