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he's actually trying to save the OP's "friend" from a world of hurt too it seems. since he can't tell if it's a felony or not he could issue the license and have 0 liability but if it DID turn out to be a felony the OP's "friend" would go try to buy a gun and commit a shiny new felony.
Once again, I completely agree...I just thought everyone on here hated anyone with a badge or a uniform (I don't, because I wear a uniform myself)...figured I'd get some sympathy help from a cop hater [laugh]
 
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Yeah the Hitler / Waffen SS stuff seemed over the top. Chief can't issue to a PP, and he is unable to determine if they are a PP, and said that he will issue if records are provided showing that the conviction doesn't make him a PP. Seems pretty straightforward to me...
Lay off, dude...I get it...maybe it was over the top...sad attempt at humor. This site gets more and more ridiculous every time I sign on. Ask me why I'm not green.

- - - Updated - - -

Did the officer look with both hands and a flashlight?
LoL...

- - - Updated - - -

Just to complicate matters, in 1987 "two hundred and fifty dollars" was substituted for "one hundred dollars", so if the windshield cost $101 to replace in 1985, he may be screwed.

If he orders a CORI, is says right on it whether it's a Misdemeanor or Felony
Valuable information...thank you.
 

Fixxah

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Wow...nothing like passing judgement on a guy who smashed some *******s windshield 30 years ago.

...

I guess you never did anything stupid as a kid?

For the record...he's the most loyal friend i've ever had, and I'd take a bullet for him just as fast as i'd take one for any of my brothers/sisters in arms...RAH?
Most of us were not idiots. As in, we didn't get caught.
 
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If you knew the whole story, you'd die laughing. Ol' Abe is a GIANT among men...no kidding. I won't tell the story here to keep him safe from more NESexuals from using him as a punching bag, but i'll just say the other guy had it coming.
 

42!

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I want to know the town so I can put it on my "I'd rather live here list" . I'm fighting my own denial and I've got no convictions and no mental health problems. Got to love a system that doesn't follow it's own rules.

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With a name like Abe Lincoln no wonder he was denied.
You would think with a name like honest Abe the chief would take his word for it and issue the license.


Question for the group. Could the chief have notified the applicant that they could not find info on the old conviction and for him to get it from the court and drop it off instead of denying him?
 
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Tough crowd here...anyway, I'm just trying to help the guy out. I anonomized (if that's a word) the letter best I could so you could have the full story here and i could get the best advice. There's nothing nefarious going on here...what's the big deal?
Just trying to help... chiefs have looked online before and denied people for what they found there. Not that I agree with such denials, but denials based on suitability rather than a statutory disqualifier seem to be a lot harder to fight.
 

Billsail

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You would think with a name like honest Abe the chief would take his word for it and issue the license.


Question for the group. Could the chief have notified the applicant that they could not find info on the old conviction and for him to get it from the court and drop it off instead of denying him?
That's what he was told.
 
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M1911

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Ok...so, will hiring a lawyer do anything...ie, will the lawyer possibly be able to find this record that somehow a chief of police can't/won't find?
You've already been told the solution. Your buddy needs to go to the court where his case was heard and get a copy of his file. Yes, he could hire a lawyer to do that, but that would be stupid, because the lawyer would just go to the court and get a copy.
 

drgrant

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You've already been told the solution. Your buddy needs to go to the court where his case was heard and get a copy of his file. Yes, he could hire a lawyer to do that, but that would be stupid, because the lawyer would just go to the court and get a copy.
Or to put it in blunt terms, him doing the legwork himself will save him anywhere from $300-$900 probably. No point in paying for billable hours research you can easily do yourself.

-Mike
 

ochmude

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Mr. Lincoln smashed the windshield out of a car in the 1980's...he said he doesn't think the amount was over $250. I just don't understand how they don't know if he is a felon or not. Isn't that something that should beon his record if he is?
I've run a few thousand records checks over the past couple years through both state and federal databases, and you'd be surprised how incomplete most records are. The vast majority of criminal charges I come across don't specify if they were misdemeanor or felony charges and don't list a disposition (dismissed, not guilty, guilty, etc.). Legal proceedings don't migrate well from paper to electronic systems because, well, government.
 
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The District Court is unlikely to have this old record sitting in the basement. More than likely you will need to fill out a request at the Clerk's office to have the record retrieved from the Trial Court archives. Last time I went through this we received the record in about two weeks. As others have repeatedly stated, you don't need an attorney for this phase. Also, neither the CORI nor the docket sheet shows if the conviction is a felony or misdemeanor. They will both however provide the chapter and section number of the statute that the conviction is based upon.
 

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I was an NCIC/NLETS operator in New Hampshire, and MA records were the most screwed up of any state short of NY.

NY spews forth EVERYthing, including every false hit on soundalike names. Page after page, most of it unrelated to the person you're checking.

MA spews forth every record of arrest and charge, but gives ZIP for disposition, severity of offense, etc. Every hit from MA required a phone call to the entering agency, and then to the court, and not even then could we find the final disposition.
 

ochmude

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I was an NCIC/NLETS operator in New Hampshire, and MA records were the most screwed up of any state short of NY.

NY spews forth EVERYthing, including every false hit on soundalike names. Page after page, most of it unrelated to the person you're checking.

MA spews forth every record of arrest and charge, but gives ZIP for disposition, severity of offense, etc. Every hit from MA required a phone call to the entering agency, and then to the court, and not even then could we find the final disposition.
Truth. I'm really curious what algorithm is used by NCIC for soundalikes. "Hernandez-Garcia, Jose" doesn't sound like "Mitchell, Jennifer" to me, especially with a different DOB.
 

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Probably not advisable to post the letter word for word on the Internet.
He didn't, he changed the names to protect the innocent. [rofl]


Just to complicate matters, in 1987 "two hundred and fifty dollars" was substituted for "one hundred dollars", so if the windshield cost $101 to replace in 1985, he may be screwed.

If he orders a CORI, is says right on it whether it's a Misdemeanor or Felony
Only if they were correctly entered in the computer system, an iffy proposition in MA.


You would think with a name like honest Abe the chief would take his word for it and issue the license.


Question for the group. Could the chief have notified the applicant that they could not find info on the old conviction and for him to get it from the court and drop it off instead of denying him?
Yes, it would be better to not deny but request that info from the applicant and shelve his application in the meantime.
 
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....Question for the group. Could the chief have notified the applicant that they could not find info on the old conviction and for him to get it from the court and drop it off instead of denying him?
This is the burden shifting problem. The applicant is being forced to prove that he's entitle to exercise a right when the government should be the one to prove that someone isn't entitle to exercise a right.

I've run a few thousand records checks over the past couple years through both state and federal databases, and you'd be surprised how incomplete most records are. The vast majority of criminal charges I come across don't specify if they were misdemeanor or felony charges and don't list a disposition (dismissed, not guilty, guilty, etc.). Legal proceedings don't migrate well from paper to electronic systems because, well, government.
I can't speak for other states, but it appears that dependencies between court records and probation records are very common in Massachusetts.
 

M1911

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Tough crowd here...anyway, I'm just trying to help the guy out. I anonomized (if that's a word) the letter best I could so you could have the full story here and i could get the best advice. There's nothing nefarious going on here...what's the big deal?
Not all that long ago, a fellow who was upset with delays in getting his LTC posted about it here. The licensing officer from that town saw his post, and used it as a reason to deny him an LTC.

The guy was able to lawyer up and get his LTC, but you can see why we suggest being careful about posting such information here. Law enforcement officers and the attorney general's office do find out about things posted on NES.
 
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Dakar... If he was actually denied (seems so from the wording from the chief), please remind him he has to list it on his next application (and any out of state applications/renewals as well) and all future renewals and be prepared to explain Why he was denied, if it turns out he isn't a felon.
 
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Not all that long ago, a fellow who was upset with delays in getting his LTC posted about it here. The licensing officer from that town saw his post, and used it as a reason to deny him an LTC.

The guy was able to lawyer up and get his LTC, but you can see why we suggest being careful about posting such information here. Law enforcement officers and the attorney general's office do find out about things posted on NES.
i see your point, but I did this on my own recognizance...he has nothing to do with my posting here.
 
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This is the burden shifting problem. The applicant is being forced to prove that he's entitle to exercise a right when the government should be the one to prove that someone isn't entitle to exercise a right.
While I agree with you, if my choices are being denied, or being given a chance to prove that an issue from my past was not a disqualifier before a decision is made, I will take that chance every time. As mentioned above regardless of the outcome, this guy now has to disclose a denial from now on. That sucks.
 

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neither the CORI nor the docket sheet shows if the conviction is a felony or misdemeanor. They will both however provide the chapter and section number of the statute that the conviction is based upon.
It seems pretty obvious you've never seen a CORI.

Offense Type: FELONY/MISDEMEANOR

And there is NO indication of the chapter or section.

Your information is WRONG. Please stop it!!!


cori.jpg

BTW, This guy didn't get a LTC
 

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But if the chief sees it, recognizes who you are talking about, and gets pissed off, then he may suffer the consequences.
That guy was "over the top" in his postings, reading a bit like a Rambo-wannabee. This is a straight out "this is what happened, this is what he was told, what do I do" thread. Very different.

Folks here are too paranoid with "delete the thread" and yet advice in breaking the laws is spouted all the time, not deleted and further encouraged.
 
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He needs to pick up his docket from the court (s) and get a lawyer. He's obviously too dense to apply on his own.
I had a similar issue with a felony charge (dismissed) from the 80's. Back before the dawn of the computer. No record existed anywhere. Even the courthouse had moved.

I talked to the chief, explained the circumstances (beat up a cops kid at the bus stop. He was the neighborhood bully and started it.) and got my LTC

Edit: oh no! Delete this thread! I'm calling s lawyer!


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CTpatriot

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wow, in the balance of things, what has he done in the last twenty years. sounds like he paid the price for something a long time ago that did not pysically hurt anybody, hopefully.
 

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wow, in the balance of things, what has he done in the last twenty years. sounds like he paid the price for something a long time ago that did not pysically hurt anybody, hopefully.
there is a difference between Law, and Justice.

Statutorily denied means just that, present conditions notwithstanding.
 
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