LTC-A Target Restricted in car transport

[BostonFocus]

Hey Everyone,

I have a LTC-A restricted and I usually leave my firearm unloaded, in a locked container, under my drivers side seat. Is this allowed because I'm usually not in transport to the range?

James

 

[invaliduser]

That is ok as long as you don't have a sedan that has "lockable trunk"
Stuff like hatchbacks, SUVs, pickups don't have a separated locking trunk

 

[MisterHappy]

You have a kind of gray area, here.

Your LTC is restricted, so, you are restricted, as the issuing authority defines it.

Your method of keeping the gun is acceptable for storage, and for transport, but, it's possible that were you to be pulled over waaaayyyy off course (i.e. not anywhere between your residence, and the range) you could be jammed up. Though even I, the coiner of the term "Massprudence" think it unlikely.

IANAL YMMV XYZPDQ and all that.

 

[jasons]

What's the restriction?

 

[swatgig]

In theory, you should be good. But since this is Massachusetts, all bets are off.

Your handgun is properly secured for "storage" purposes and for "transport" purposes. That won't stop some police from claiming you are carrying in violation of your restriction.

See http://www.comm2a.org/index.php/55-projects/182-plouffe where Mr. Plouffe was properly transporting a shotgun that was unnecessarily locked with trigger lock. The chief pulled his FID and seized his guns.

 

[LuvDog]

Who's to say what range the OP is driving too? He could be headed to a range anywhere.

 

[m00nraker]

Stuff like hatchbacks, SUVs, pickups don't have a separated locking trunk

I have a toolbox on my pickup truck that is lockable so it throw my unlocked bags in there and lock it. I know that doesn't solve the OPs issue but I think that's sufficient enough to be a "locked container"


Sent from my iPhone 5c using Tapatalk

 

[Knuckle Dragger]

That is ok as long as you don't have a sedan that has "lockable trunk"

^What??????

You have a kind of gray area, here.

^Not really.

What's the restriction?

^Irrelevant.

131c 'Carrying of firearms in a vehicle' review:

Section 131C. (a) No person carrying a loaded firearm under a Class A license issued under section 131 or 131F shall carry the same in a vehicle unless such firearm while carried therein is under the direct control of such person.. ....

(b) No person carrying a firearm under a Class B license issued under section 131 or 131F shall possess the same in a vehicle unless such weapon is unloaded and contained within the locked trunk of such vehicle or in a locked case or other secure container.

What's interesting here is that subsection (a) makes no mention of restrictions. However since carrying in a vehicle usually involves the vehicle being on a public way, I would assume that one needs an unrestricted LTC to carry a loaded firearm in one's vehicle and that it must be under one's direct control. One might argue (probably without success) that subsection (a) authorizes any LTC/A holder to carry a loaded firearm (handgun) in their vehicle.

Subsection (b) only addresses holders of the LTC/B. That kind of leaves a gap with regard to the restricted LTC/A. Most knowledgeable BFS instructors treat a restricted LTC/A like an LTC/B for the purposes of carrying in vehicle.

In theory, you should be good. But since this is Massachusetts, all bets are off.

Some truth here, as we've seen some police try to conflate 'carrying in a vehicle' and 'storage'. The bottom line is that the OP's locked case, regardless of where it is in the car, is sufficient for complying with both 131c and 131l. Neither 131c nor 131l make any mention of where one is going to or from, what their intention are or anything else.

Finally, note that 131c makes no mention of transporting a gun under an FID card or transporting non-large capacity rifles or shotguns. However, I suspect most LEOs don't appreciate this nuance.

 

[AM13]

Is a lockable glove box considered a secure container?

 

[K7500]

Screw em. Don't comply

 

[MisterHappy]

Is a lockable glove box considered a secure container?

No.

 

[J Foley Esq]

No.

I would be inclined to agree with you. Help me out with the underlying basis. Thanks.

 

[RWG]

LTC CLASS A restricted- Means the owner cannot carry the firearm at all times. As stated the firearm is unloaded and locked in a box under his seat. All LTC people should take GOAL class for Mass Laws

 

[BostonVI]

LTC CLASS A restricted- Means the owner cannot carry the firearm at all times. As stated the firearm is unloaded and locked in a box under his seat. All LTC people should take GOAL class for Mass Laws

Actually each PD has their own definition of what their LTC restrictions mean. Without a written definition from the issuing PD no one knows the specifics of the restriction. It's not something you can learn in a class, other than the fact that restrictions exist in the first place.

 

[NickyBangBang]

Who's to say what range the OP is driving too? He could be headed to a range anywhere.

Yup

 

[Len-2A Training]

Actually each PD has their own definition of what their LTC restrictions mean. Without a written definition from the issuing PD no one knows the specifics of the restriction. It's not something you can learn in a class, other than the fact that restrictions exist in the first place.

Spot on! 351 Issuing Authorities = 351 sets of rules . . . some may be the same, others will be different. And the officer stopping you in East Overshoe some weekend evening has NO WAY to easily determine what YOUR chief/LO means by the restriction printed on your LTC!!! That is what I teach in my MA Gun Law Seminar and if anyone else is teaching anything different, they are doing you a disservice!

 

[J Foley Esq]

Spot on! 351 Issuing Authorities = 351 sets of rules . . . some may be the same, others will be different. And the officer stopping you in East Overshoe some weekend evening has NO WAY to easily determine what YOUR chief/LO means by the restriction printed on your LTC!!! That is what I teach in my MA Gun Law Seminar and if anyone else is teaching anything different, they are doing you a disservice!

So true. I had a case where a police prosecutor asserted that all towns had same meaning on restrictions and client should have known exactly what that restriction meant. Magistrate was not impressed with that point of view.

 

[Deftone5]

At the risk of being slightly off topic but not wanting to repeat a similar thread, I have a Hunting & Target LTC A. I walk to work each day and as I have children, I prefer to do work on my firearms (cleaning, triggers, etc.) at my office after hours (I own the business)...am I violating my restrictions by having a firearm unloaded and in a locked container in my backpack as I walk about...not in schools or federal buildings of course. I am always nervous having a 357 Mag Revolver in my backpack with. Trigger lock and sometimes rounds separated from the firearm.

Thanks in advance!

 

[Hush]

I am always nervous having a 357 Mag Revolver in my backpack with. Trigger lock and sometimes rounds separated from the firearm.

That would make me nervous too. Makes a good weight if you have to swing the backpack real hard and hit someone with it.

 

[RichLec]

At the risk of being slightly off topic but not wanting to repeat a similar thread, I have a Hunting & Target LTC A. I walk to work each day and as I have children, I prefer to do work on my firearms (cleaning, triggers, etc.) at my office after hours (I own the business)...am I violating my restrictions by having a firearm unloaded and in a locked container in my backpack as I walk about...not in schools or federal buildings of course. I am always nervous having a 357 Mag Revolver in my backpack with. Trigger lock and sometimes rounds separated from the firearm. Thanks in advance!

I personally think you are ok with doing this. But mass laws are not based on common sense so who knows. Maybe one of the mass law experts will chime in on this for you..

Sent from my phone please excuse any errors within my post