Logan airport and guns in the trunk

SMagee

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interesting, i didn't know they were doing random vehicle checks at Logan

They do it about 2-5 times per month, and they do it well. First sign it's coming, Statey with a dog, right behind him are 3-4 D.O.t. Explorers, black/blue unmarked trucks/suvs (for that ominous look), then 3-5 State Police cruisers. People pulled over looking terrified.
 

skyhawk

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The last time (first time [grin]) I flew with a handgun in checked
baggage, it was in one of the $30 black metal locked case with
the cable looped through the handle bar inside the suitcase. Ammo
was in original packaging in a plastic ziplock bag.

It was first thing in the morning and TSA didn't even want to look
at the gun (I had key ready to unlock it). Northwest discreetly
found a card (got some weird looks but only from NWA staff and TSA)
and filled it out then good to go!

FWIW it wasn't inspected on the way home either.
 
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I've had the gun inspected several times to verify unloaded. One moron working for Airtran actually snatched it out of the case and looked at it herself. She had no idea how to check if it was unloaded. I made a complaint and got a free flight for the trouble.
 
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I find it funny that the state police troop at Logan is, get this: F Troop. [rofl]


Where Indian fights
Are colorful sights
And nobody takes a lickin'
Where pale face
And red skin
Both turn chicken


Yeah, I'm old enough to remember watching that show and I still know many of the words to the theme song. The only thing that would make this even more interesting is if the real commander at F Troop is also named Captain Parmenter!!!!![rofl]
 
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They do it about 2-5 times per month, and they do it well. First sign it's coming, Statey with a dog, right behind him are 3-4 D.O.t. Explorers, black/blue unmarked trucks/suvs (for that ominous look), then 3-5 State Police cruisers. People pulled over looking terrified.



And the funny thing is, they don't search the shuttle busses.
 
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There seems to be an active conversation in the Forum as to the CMRs for Logan Airport and Guns. The previous CMRs (740CMR 21) concerning airport security and guns have indeed been repealed, but have been given new life at 740 CMR 30 (especially sections 1-5).

The Mass. Trial Court Law Libraries would indeed be happy to provide you with these documents. They can be reached at "http://www.lawlib.state.ma.us/libraries/services/docdelivery.html " and the service is free.
 

terraformer

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There seems to be an active conversation in the Forum as to the CMRs for Logan Airport and Guns. The previous CMRs (740CMR 21) concerning airport security and guns have indeed been repealed, but have been given new life at 740 CMR 30 (especially sections 1-5).

The Mass. Trial Court Law Libraries would indeed be happy to provide you with these documents. They can be reached at "http://www.lawlib.state.ma.us/libraries/services/docdelivery.html " and the service is free.

Thanks. I will post them when I get them.
 

terraformer

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CMR galore

The first 5 are in word docs. The whole 740-30 is in the zip file.
Have at it.
 

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From 740 CMR 30.04:

No person except federal or state law enforcement officers, United States Postal Service, United States Customs and Border Patrol, Air Carrier employees approved by the TSA, members of the Armed Forces of the United States and Massachusetts National Guard on official duty and licensed armored truck service guards with the prior approval of the Authority, who are authorized and validly licensed to carry Firearms, ammunition and explosives in Massachusetts, shall carry loaded or otherwise operational Firearms or explosives on the Airport.

I'm curious what the "loaded or otherwise operational" part covers.

So the final question is what does "on the airport" mean? From the definitions in section 21.01, it includes everything:

Airport - shall mean the land and developments owned, controlled, operated and maintained by the Authority at both Logan International Airport in East Boston, and L.G. Hanscom Field in Bedford, Massachusetts, unless otherwise specified, consisting of runways, taxiways, hangars, control towers, ramps, aprons, wharves, bulkheads, buildings, structures, roads, streets, parking and storage areas, improvements, utilities, facilities, or other real property, necessary or convenient, or desirable, for the landing, takeoff, accommodation and servicing of vehicles or aircraft of all types.

But the definition of "Airport" in section 30 is:

Airport - shall mean an airport owned or operated by the Authority.

which is absurdly unhelpful.

But my final conclusion, unless someone makes a convincing counterargument, is that you can't carry anywhere on the grounds, including the roads that you need to pick someone up. You can, according to my reading, pull over before you get to the airport to unload and lock up your gun. What a hassle though.
 
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You can, according to my reading, pull over before you get to the airport to unload and lock up your gun.

Not according to the next section:

30.05: Firearms, Ammunition, Explosives, and Hoax Devices

Except as provided in 740 CMR 30.04, no person shall possess, transport or carry a Firearm, ammunition, explosive, explosive device or hoax device (as that term is defined in M.G.L. c. 266, § 102A 1/2 ) on the Airport. The penalty for violation of 740 CMR 30.00 shall be the maximum fine the Authority is authorized to assess.

I would seem that any possession, transportation, or carry is prohibited "on the airport", with the exception for air travel in 30.04:

30.04: Firearms, Ammunition and Dangerous Weapons

All persons shall, promptly upon entering the passenger terminal or General Aviation Terminal, as the case may be, deliver any unloaded Firearms and ammunition, as they are carrying and licensed to carry under Massachusetts law to the appropriate Air Carrier agent for transport in the hold of the aircraft, in the case of commercial flights, or directly to the aircraft, in the case of general aviation aircraft.

Am I interpreting this correctly?
 
M

MACGYVR

Yep pretty much. You better be travelling with it and have a ticket/reservation proving it. Pretty clear. Anything else and its up for interpretation by the people doing the random search.
 
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Yep pretty much. You better be travelling with it and have a ticket/reservation proving it. Pretty clear. Anything else and its up for interpretation by the people doing the random search.

Yeah, that does seem to be what it means. What a poorly written law.

Edit: is it still possible to show up at the airport and buy a ticket or do you need one in advance?
 

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This one looks like a real gem!

I'm not one of the tin-foil crowd, but this looks to me (IANAL) to be one of those "if we said you did it, that's prima facie evidence that you did it"!??

The other thing that I notice is that unlike some other CMRs and CFRs that I've read, this one does NOT cite MGL as their authority to promulgate these Regs! None of 740 CMR 30.00 that I could see here cited any MGLs for it's "authority"!


CODE OF MASSACHUSETTS REGULATIONS
TITLE 740: MASSACHUSETTS PORT AUTHORITY
CHAPTER 30.00: AIRPORT SECURITY
Current through September 4, 2009, Register #1138

30.36: Prima Facie Evidence

Any written citation or notice of violation issued by the Authority, Massachusetts State Police or TSA, with regard to a violation of 740 CMR 30.00 shall be prima facie evidence of the commission of such violation by the Person to whom the citation or notice of violation was issued and of the facts giving rise to such violation, as set forth in the citation or notice.

<General Materials (GM) - References, Annotations, or Tables>

Mass. Regs. Code tit. 740, § 30.36, 740 MA ADC 30.36

740 MA ADC 30.36
 
M

MACGYVR

Yes it is still possible to buy a ticket at the airport.

and if you are travelling that day you will be flagged for a cavity search. [wink]

Well at least a secondary search.
 
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This one looks like a real gem! I'm not one of the tin-foil crowd, but this looks to me (IANAL) to be one of those "if we said you did it, that's prima facie evidence that you did it"!?

I agree that this is disturbing. It actually looks like this verbiage was included in 740 CMR 21.11 when it was proposed to replace 740 CMR 21.07 back in 2007.

http://www.massport.com/about/press01/pdf/logan_secur_740cmr.pdf

Yes it is still possible to buy a ticket at the airport.
and if you are travelling that day you will be flagged for a cavity search. [wink]
Well at least a secondary search.

True that. And if you want the full treatment, buy a one way ticket with cash then say "Oh, and I'd like to check my firearm." [wink]
 
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M

MACGYVR

I've never had any additional search when traveling with a firearm out of Logan, and I've done it multiple times.

Yep the firearm does nothing to you to trigger getting searched. It might as well just be another bag.


But buy a same-day ticket and you will get a secondary search no matter what you are travelling with.
 

Rob Boudrie

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But buy a same-day ticket and you will get a secondary search no matter what you are travelling with.
Been there, done that when Continental got me on another airline after my flight was cancelled while they were getting ready for takeoff. The system did not recognize that this new ticket was not in fact a "last minute" purchase so I got the extended treatment.
 
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This is hypothetical, but sometimes 1A North is detoured through the airport due to road construction. Suppose your coming back from a day of shooting, now your FORCED on to the airport property by the traffic patterns. This sounds silly but I can remember when I was going to school in Boston this would happen to me driving home at least once a week.
 
M

MACGYVR

So I flew United this morning with my shotgun.

No problems except the non-english speaking baggage gophers that I could not figure out if they worked for united or not. They are there like rodeo clowns to send people in the right direction I guess.

Got it sorted though that I had to check a firearm. And it was painless. All of 2 min with TSA dude who fondled the foam in the case pretty well and asked if there were any bullets in the case. Thats all.

I never go in the front door of Login. Avoid all the secuity checks.
Go in the back door by the fuel tanks and park in economy and take the shuttle.
 

terraformer

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This is hypothetical, but sometimes 1A North is detoured through the airport due to road construction. Suppose your coming back from a day of shooting, now your FORCED on to the airport property by the traffic patterns. This sounds silly but I can remember when I was going to school in Boston this would happen to me driving home at least once a week.

It would be an affirmative defense, and frankly I doubt they would be doing spot checks on those days as to avoid traffic jams. But such is the absurdity of the whole thing.
 
M

MACGYVR

ok here is how life should work.

I return my rental car in Knoxville, TN at the airport and the guy asks me how I did shooting sporting clays (this was in the airport garage). I go into the airport and check in. I say I need to check a firearm. The guy goes in the back grabs me an onboard carry form [rofl] and they says oh you going to check it or carry it! Didnt even blink.

Then the guy asks me to open the case and gives me the little card. I open the case and he looks down and says ok.
Lock it back up and they tag it. I drop it off at the xray machine with everyone elses bags.

Thats it.

No freakouts, no comments from the peanut gallery, and most of all no one going around to each ticket agent saying, "he wants to check a firearm, can he do that, how do we do that, OMG! (typical logan experience)

Ahh to live in a free state. Unfortunately I must now return to our prison state.
 

skyhawk

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ok here is how life should work..

Nice.

I was just in Minneapolis and had to wait in line 30+ mins to get to an agent @
checkin counter. Saw two women check in at the Frontier counter next door
and one of them had a lever rifle. She opened the case and cycled it and
everything was cool. No one freaked out, and they seemed like they had some
experience with this before...although there are a lot of loonies there in MN [rolleyes][laugh]
 

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It is clearly stated that unless you are LEO or authorized by TSA to carry a firearm any where's within the Airport's Authority as defined in 740CMR 30.04, you can be arrested. Check this page and read about half way down there is a complete description on the airports boundries.... http://www.handgunlaw.us/states/massachusetts.pdf

Skip
More than what you stated, even municipal police are illegal to carry on Massport airport properties!! Only MSP and Feds are allowed per the CMR.
 

EMTDAD

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I was just thinking about this scenario last night as I picked up my wife at Terminal B. I parked in the Term B garage. They did ask me to open the trunk to check.

I guess reading the earlier posts, if I were carrying, I'd be in violation.
 
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