Legaly displaying firearms at home in Mass

[Mattitude]

I understand that my MA residence falls the same laws as your residence but the relationship that we have with the chief is very personal and they have been to my family home numerous times over the past 35+ years and they are a bit more "understanding" (maybe that is the correct word) about storage & acess due to the "remoteness" and other factors (maybe the correct word) with wildlife and such. None of my registered firearms are displayed out of the safe but they are available if the need arises. IANAL so make your own choice to listen or not...more than likely not.

Former CT resident, current NC resident, part-time MA resident

The laws are no different in your cabin than they are in my house. You may feel that you have different laws because you have no neighbors in close proximity but that does not mean that the laws are different.
When someone posts a question on this message forum they are seeking advice from folks who presumably know what they are talking about. There are plenty of folks who will answer a question by guessing but all in all it's a terrible idea and I'm not sure why someone would do that.
Remember how Obama looked when he said he didn't know what happened in Cambridge and then proceeded to make a comment about it?

 

[richc]

I feel that this is a pretty friendly place but scrivener thinks that he is somehow above me by his original condesending tone which continues. I don't see how asking your legal authority proper storage is "a bad idea" since any local arrest would go through that person. It's verhy easy to give advise over the internet and let someone else be the test case because no one has anything to lose BUT the author. Thank you scrivener for putting me down in your own a-hole way and if you read my "drivel" twice I said to take it with a grain of salt and I'm sorry for not also putting the IANAL (maybe you are) as well. Try some internet people skills because there were better ways to show me the error of my advise without your holier-than-thou attitude. I value personal freedoms, I defended them and in said defense I am now permanently disabled at only 38 after 17+ years of service. I don't appreciate you treating me differently but if you have anything negative to say to me/about me then be a man and send me a PM instead of belittling me on a public forum.

Mattitude... Scrivener is an attorney... and you are not the first to notice his poor people skills. Thank you for your service, and as my Dad used to say, "Don't let the bastards get you down".

Oh... here's a recently commentary on Scriv:

http://www.northeastshooters.com/vb...uld-you-wait?p=1306807&viewfull=1#post1306807



RichC

 

[M1911]

I feel that this is a pretty friendly place but scrivener thinks that he is somehow above me by his original condesending tone which continues. I don't see how asking your legal authority proper storage is "a bad idea" since any local arrest would go through that person.

Many of us have direct experience with law officers, including police chiefs and licensing officers, giving bad advice about MA gun laws. Chief Glidden's book about MA gun laws runs to over 300 pages. Police officers aren't lawyers. Few of them have studied the law in any detail. Furthermore, police chiefs and licensing officers retire, or change jobs -- the one who told you X was OK 5 years ago might not be the one to make a decision today, or he might be the same guy who just changed his mind. And they wouldn't be doing the prosecuting -- that would be the DA. The judge won't be impressed if you say "but the Chief told me it was OK," particularly when you have nothing to back that up and the Chief says otherwise. It is far safer to obey the law in the first place.

It's verhy easy to give advise over the internet and let someone else be the test case because no one has anything to lose BUT the author.

There's no need for anyone to be a test case, as this is already settled law in MA. Precedent exists. And Scrivener is an attorney. He gets paid for his advice and defends people in MA court.

I value personal freedoms

All of us here do. Which is why we don't want to see people given bad advice about MA gun law, because they could lose those very same freedoms. In particular, they could end up spending 10 years in jail.

I defended them and in said defense I am now permanently disabled at only 38 after 17+ years of service.

Thank you for your service and your sacrifices. But that has nothing to do with the gun storage laws in MA. Nor does it change the fact that your advice was bad. I'm sorry to put it plainly, but there it is.

If you don't know the laws, and it appears that you don't, please don't give people advice about them. If someone actually followed your advice they could wind up in deep trouble. MA gun laws are already very difficult to understand without bad advice from folks who don't know the laws.

 

[Mattitude]

RichC, thanks for the reply and information. If scrivener is an attorney his people skills should be better if for anything to attract paying clients. Personally I don't care for his style with free advice...hopefully he is more professional with paying clients. He hasn't gotten me down but I am disheartened that he treats other fellow gun owners with such attitude, espically when he doesn't know me and I shudder to think if he would be the same face to face and just not a keyboard commando.

Mattitude... Scrivener is an attorney... and you are not the first to notice his poor people skills. Thank you for your service, and as my Dad used to say, "Don't let the bastards get you down".

Oh... here's a recently commentary on Scriv:

http://www.northeastshooters.com/vb...uld-you-wait?p=1306807&viewfull=1#post1306807



RichC

 

[M1911]

I understand that my MA residence falls the same laws as your residence but the relationship that we have with the chief is very personal and they have been to my family home numerous times over the past 35+ years and they are a bit more "understanding" (maybe that is the correct word) about storage & acess due to the "remoteness" and other factors (maybe the correct word) with wildlife and such. None of my registered firearms are displayed out of the safe but they are available if the need arises. IANAL so make your own choice to listen or not...more than likely not.

If your guns in MA are not locked up, then you are committing a felony. Your current chief may let you slide on that. The next chief may not. If you find yourself getting the attention of the State Police, they won't look the other way like your current chief does, and they won't need your current chief's permission to arrest and charge you. If your current chief considers you to be a suspect in a different crime and he knows that you have guns improperly stored, he could use that to get a search warrant, and then use the improper storage charges as a lever. If your guns are not locked in MA, you are playing a very dangerous game indeed.

 

[Hanwei]

Mattitude, according to your join date, you've been around a while. Don't you know about Scrivener already!?

Think of Keith as a nun with a ruler walking around NES ready to put the smack down whenever he sees misinformation being spread. There's nothing personal about it. And his tone is only such because he wants the person spreading misinformation to know that under no circumstances is their misinformation right. That's it. You're either right or wrong. You either know or you don't. Any "I think's" will receive a slap in the wrist with his ruler.

 

[qmmo]

I just had a visual of Scriv in a habit....I'll not be sleeping well this evening thank you.....

 

[Scrivener]

I feel that this is a pretty friendly place but scrivener thinks that he is somehow above me by his original condesending [sic] tone which continues. I don't see how asking your legal authority proper storage is "a bad idea" since any local arrest would go through that person. .

For someone here three (3) years, you are appallingly ignorant about MA storage laws and the PD being a notoriously poor source of information regarding firearms law.

From the top:

You posted MISinformation.

When corrected, you STILL asserted your erroneous position.

You now whine about being slapped for willfully posting WRONG information.

Thank you for your service. It is, however, wholly irrelevant to the discussion at hand and your trying to use it to distract us from your posting misinformation or otherwise hide behind it is degrading.

You screwed up. We all do.

Admit it and move on.

 

[Scrivener]

I just had a visual of Scriv in a habit....I'll not be sleeping well this evening thank you.....

I thought you preferred the "naughty parochial school girl."

 

[Mattitude]

M1911, thanks for being civil. My registered firearms are in a locked compliant safe, just as I stated so there should be no issue with improper storage. I realize that my service has nothing to do with MA firearm laws, it was a statement made because I value freedoms & ideals. A good number of people (I didn't say everyone now) who haven't served don't know what it means to defend or even what or why said defense is necessary. I never claimed to be a know-it-all and I am falliable just like everyone else here...including the lawyers even though they won't ever admit that they could ever be wrong about anything or give questionable advice (I'm not directing to this subject). Hanwei, I've been around here for a little bit but I'm no where as active due to my medical issues. That being said I don't know much, if anything about scrivener or his methods. There are ways to get things across, but him being a paid professional I would expect more than making one feel like dirt. That just isn't right but he can do what he wants I guess. I have delt with to the point lawyers but they weren't asses about it...they were still professional. I mean who wants to approach someone, much less PAY them, and fear to be treated like a lower person. Think about it. I get the feeling that his feeling is that there ARE stupid questions asked by stupid people.

 

[HooVooLoo]

RichC, thanks for the reply and information. If scrivener is an attorney his people skills should be better if for anything to attract paying clients. Personally I don't care for his style with free advice...

To know him is to love him is to know him...

That being said I don't know much, if anything about scrivener or his methods. There are ways to get things across, but him being a paid professional I would expect more than making one feel like dirt. That just isn't right but he can do what he wants I guess. I have delt with to the point lawyers but they weren't asses about it...they were still professional. I mean who wants to approach someone, much less PAY them, and fear to be treated like a lower person...

This is a message board, not a law firm's office where everyone is wearing a suit. Maybe you should seek Scriv's counsel in person and see whether he giggles when you poke his belly.

 

[Hanwei]

M1911, thanks for being civil. My registered firearms are in a locked compliant safe, just as I stated so there should be no issue with improper storage. I realize that my service has nothing to do with MA firearm laws, it was a statement made because I value freedoms & ideals. A good number of people (I didn't say everyone now) who haven't served don't know what it means to defend or even what or why said defense is necessary. I never claimed to be a know-it-all and I am falliable just like everyone else here...including the lawyers even though they won't ever admit that they could ever be wrong about anything or give questionable advice (I'm not directing to this subject). Hanwei, I've been around here for a little bit but I'm no where as active due to my medical issues. That being said I don't know much, if anything about scrivener or his methods. There are ways to get things across, but him being a paid professional I would expect more than making one feel like dirt. That just isn't right but he can do what he wants I guess. I have delt with to the point lawyers but they weren't asses about it...they were still professional. I mean who wants to approach someone, much less PAY them, and fear to be treated like a lower person. Think about it. I get the feeling that his feeling is that there ARE stupid questions asked by stupid people.

I understand where you're coming from. Just thought I'd try and help give some perspective on the Scrivener experience, is all

 

[calsdad]

RichC, thanks for the reply and information. If scrivener is an attorney his people skills should be better if for anything to attract paying clients. Personally I don't care for his style with free advice...hopefully he is more professional with paying clients. He hasn't gotten me down but I am disheartened that he treats other fellow gun owners with such attitude, espically when he doesn't know me and I shudder to think if he would be the same face to face and just not a keyboard commando.

He already got banned here once. Maybe he's working on the second time?

As an example of how little understanding of MA laws LEO's have here in MA - here are a couple of examples:

A fellow NES member I bought a Glock from told me this story. He had an FN2000 bullpup rifle - which was fully MA compliant in that it had no flash hider, no adjustable stock, no bayonet lug, etc. He was at the range - and a fellow wandered over to where he was shooting and made a comment that ran something like " you can't own that gun here in MA, it's a machine gun". The FN2000 owner responded that NO - it wasn't a 'machine gun', it was a semi auto rifle, was fully in compliance with MA laws - and had been legally purchased at a MA gun dealer. The beginnings of an argument ensued - and Mr. Alleged LEO got on his cell phone to call his chief. After some talking back and forth about what was going on it was finally determined that the rifle was in fact MA legal and Mr. FN2000 owner was doing nothing wrong.

This obviously could have gone a different way if Mr. Alleged LEO had just decided to arrest Mr. FN2000 owner, or if he was really feeling SWAT'y that day had decided to call in the Rabid Response Team because there was "some guy with a machine gun down at my range".

The end result was that Mr. FN2000 owner got rid of the rifle rather than risk any more adventures with law enforcement.

The second example happened directly to me. I bought a Glock 21. I was looking for more magazines for it - and found a place selling 10 round Glock 21 mags on Gunbroker. So I bought a few. 10 round mags are actually sort of hard to come by, most people don't want them because they live in free states. The auction specifically listed 10 round magazines. A week or so later a package arrives - I open up the package and find 4 13 round Glock 21 mags in the box. So I called the guy and asked him why he sent me four felony convictions in a box.

The auction specifically called out 10 round mags for sale, I specifically asked the guy if they were 10 rounders BEFORE I paid him. They obviously sent me the wrong ones. BUT - the thing is that when I talked to them on the phone they insisted that the mags were legal in MA. They insisted they had been told by numerous MA State Police troopers that the mags were legal - they insisted they sold them at gun shows , and troopers had seen them for sale and had no problem. I had to (with help from NES) dig out the relevant MA laws and print out and send them to the guy to try and educate him on what the law REALLY was - not what the Troopers were telling him.

Moral of the story: The police don't know the law. Don't rely on them to know or enforce the law properly - in either direction. They may let you get away with things that are illegal because of their ignorance - or they may arrest you for perfectly legal stuff because of their ignorance.

It's even worse here in MA because the firearms laws are insane. Actually fully understanding MA firearms law takes a lot of reading. The only reason there are people here on NES who fully understand it is because they have the incentive to not get arrested. Cops don't have that incentive - they can arrest you wrongfully and get away with it most of the time. Hence - no REAL incentive to really learn the details of the laws.


If it was me I wouldn't display guns anyway - it only invites criminals to learn what you have. If you are displaying guns it's for one of two reasons - because it makes you happy to see them - or because you are showing them off to others. Showing them off to others may at some point invite others to tell their friends. Said friends will then tell other friends - and then you may get a visit to your home while you are away on vacation.

 

[Hanwei]

Maybe you should seek Scriv's counsel in person and see whether he giggles when you poke his belly.

Or you could just ask Blitz. I believe he has first hand experience.

 

[Scrivener]

I mean who wants to approach someone, much less PAY them, and fear to be treated like a lower person. Think about it.

1. You didn't "approach someone," still less me; you posted MISinformation on an open forum. Repeatedly.

2. Your errors were exposed so that they wouldn't get anyone foolish enough to take your advice into serious trouble.

Think about it.

 

[Old Glory]

Until a law is tested in front of a judge and/or jury we really can't be 100% sure in situations like these. And even then, as society changes laws change. Isn't it still illegal for a single man to own sheep in Massachusetts?

I am single and I own Mass Compliant sheep.

 

[HooVooLoo]

I am single and I own Mass Compliant sheep.

Be careful in tending your sheep, Little Bo Glory, or you might catch a $10 fine.

Chapter 266: Section 118. Domestic animals; trespass on land
Section 118. Whoever, having the charge or custody of sheep...wilfully suffers or permits them to enter or remain on or pass over any orchard, garden, mowing land or other improved or enclosed land of another, after being forbidden so to do in writing or by notice posted thereon by the owner or occupant thereof...shall be punished by a fine of not more than ten dollars.

 

[qmmo]

I thought you preferred the "naughty parochial school girl."

I'm too old for that....I was thinking of nightmares and other such horrors.

 

[Mattitude]

For some reason you fail to be a decent human being and I don't understand how you treat people like crap. My "distraction" as you call it has nothing to do with MA laws and I posted so in a previous post and to call me degrading is pretty ironic. You interpret things to suit your mood it seems. How long I have been a member of this forum has no bearing on who I know or what information is passed that I "should" be aware of. Just because I don't work and am at home all day doesn't mean that I spend all my time reading/posting on forums. I won't admit anything to you with your condesending attitude. It appears that a law degree does strange things to certain people and you are no exception with your incredible sized head.

To the author, I am sorry that your thread turned into...this, but I hope you got something out of it somewhere. With the posted stories about FS2000's and Glock magazines it might be safe to say (lawyers chime in...) to actually PAY for advice. If any lawyers here that give free advice and will back it up with free representation then by all means follow it. Choose a lawyer carefully. If they treat you or anyone with disrespect or is an ass in general with free advice, see how they change when you put money in their hands. If then they treat you like a human being, then they are all about your money, but if they are still an ass and act like it, then question yourself if it's worth it to have a person like that represent you in a court of law if the need arises.

To all others, thank you for "talking" to me like a person and I'm sorry if my "advice" isn't sound. No one has to take it if they feel it isn't sound. I am falliable just like everyone else...including the lawyers. Like it or not I am a New Englander and proud of it, and I would like to feel welcome in a forum that can provide me information for when I do go back up north that will benefit me and not only keep me out of trouble but also provide some fellowship in sport.

For someone here three (3) years, you are appallingly ignorant about MA storage laws and the PD being a notoriously poor source of information regarding firearms law.

From the top:

You posted MISinformation.

When corrected, you STILL asserted your erroneous position.

You now whine about being slapped for willfully posting WRONG information.

Thank you for your service. It is, however, wholly irrelevant to the discussion at hand and your trying to use it to distract us from your posting misinformation or otherwise hide behind it is degrading.

You screwed up. We all do.

bla bla bla bla bla...

Admit it and move on.