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Know your enemies. (read this!)

Holy F'! What a rag!

I just skimmed through ~the first / last 15 pages. The basic message is use emotion to drive the conversation and don't let facts get in the way of emotion.

Here's a jewel from pg 58:

"Some Ineffective language to avoid .....
I'm not trying to interfere with people's Second Amendment rights."

hmmmm.... [thinking]
 
taz-2005 said:
Dupe

http://www.northeastshooters.com/vb...ion/217411-antis-really-do-have-playbook.html

And if by "influencing opinions" you mean lies, phony studies, distorted facts and demonizing your opponents then that book is for you.
Click to expand...

There are plays to emotions that can be useful for our side too. The mother who had to hide in her closet with her kids and then shot the home invader is one example. The Cheshire CT home invasion is another. It's also useful to know the other side's techniques so they can be countered.

I plan on doing some of this the next time I testify in front of Naugton's committee hearings.


taz-2005 said:
Exactly. We don't need lies like they do.
Click to expand...

In MA, the Constitution is null and void, so I don't see a problem with misinformation as a means to an end.
 
Fail

"Advocates for gun violence prevention win the logical debate, but
lose on more emotional terms."
 
Whenever I read or hear the word "feel", I think liberal mindset.
I am studying weapons used by anti-gunners, liberals, socialists, anarchists.
So far, I've collected 107 relevant documents.
The mission is to codify these manipulative weapons so I can identify when I'm under attack.
 
PaulD said:
..... so I don't see a problem with misinformation as a means to an end.
Click to expand...

Personally, I think that this is bad policy, as if you get caught out in one "factoid", your entire argument is now suspect. Not all Antis are ignorant, and many are not stupid.

Not mentioning stuff that does not bolster your opinion is a different matter.
 
MisterHappy said:
Personally, I think that this is bad policy, as if you get caught out in one "factoid", your entire argument is now suspect. Not all Antis are ignorant, and many are not stupid.

Not mentioning stuff that does not bolster your opinion is a different matter.
Click to expand...
A useful read, nonetheless.

They've got unbridled emotion and piles of bodies to point at. We've got facts plus (if you don't subscribe to the government-as-religion paradigm) history, the Constitution, and the theory of self ownership on our side. They just historically do a better job at getting people to turn off logical thought than we do at laying out the facts in a persuasive way.

There's certainly things that we can learn from this.
 
PaulD said:
There are plays to emotions that can be useful for our side too. The mother who had to hide in her closet with her kids and then shot the home invader is one example. The Cheshire CT home invasion is another. It's also useful to know the other side's techniques so they can be countered.

I plan on doing some of this the next time I testify in front of Naugton's committee hearings.




In MA, the Constitution is null and void, so I don't see a problem with misinformation as a means to an end.
Click to expand...

I brought up the Cheshire case during my testimont on Friday as I knew Dr. Petit's brother growing up.

One point I made was that we are all talking about "gun violence", his wife and two young daughters were NOT victums of gun violence, but they are still very much dead! The antis love to talk about "gun violence" but IGNORE overall violent crime, which guns in the hands of lawful citizens prevent. MA has violent crime rate 4X NH, VT, and ME. We need to accentuate this point.

There is also the case of the woman in GA that shot an intruder 5 times (out of 6 shots) and the dude walked out the house and drove off in his car. If there was a 2nd assailant, she and her infant son were dead. This is an excellent case against 7-rd mag limits.
 
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Wow, I just to the part where they say that the NRA prevents people from protecting themselves against gun violence [shocked]

Liberalism truly IS a mental disorder.
 
One of the big problems for our side is that the majority of us are intelligent and logical thinkers and far too many believe that intelligent and logical arguments actually have anything to do with persuasion - they do not. These people involved in putting this "guide" together are experts at brainwashing.
 
GBH2 said:
One of the big problems for our side is that the majority of us are intelligent and logical thinkers and far too many believe that intelligent and logical arguments actually have anything to do with persuasion - they do not. These people involved in putting this "guide" together are experts at brainwashing.
Click to expand...

The reality is some maybe most people respond better to emotion than to facts. Unfortunate but true.
 
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GBH2 said:
One of the big problems for our side is that the majority of us are intelligent and logical thinkers and far too many believe that intelligent and logical arguments actually have anything to do with persuasion - they do not. These people involved in putting this "guide" together are experts at brainwashing.
Click to expand...

Well when they have access to your kids from kindergarten through college having them believe a "guide" like this is nothing.
 
taz-2005 said:
Well when they have access to your kids from kindergarten through college having them believe a "guide" like this is nothing.
Click to expand...

You are absolutely correct that the brainwashing the next generation has been subjected to makes keeping any rights extremely difficult. They are told from an early age GUNS=BAD and it is effective. This is, in part, why they desperately do not want children to get "Gun safety" education that would teach GUNS= A TOOL that can be handled safely and used effectively for good. Even if it saved a few kids lives it would just make their job of banning guns harder.

Overcoming GUNS=BAD can not be accomplished with:
"It's my right"
"The 2nd Amendment says so"
"You will have to pry my gun from my cold dead hands"
 
PaulD said:
In MA, the Constitution is null and void, so I don't see a problem with misinformation as a means to an end.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but you can't lie because it's so easy to destroy the other side's credibility with that, because they're doing it all the time.

There are plenty of ways to get points across without being intellectually dishonest when you do it.

-Mike
 
MisterHappy said:
Personally, I think that this is bad policy, as if you get caught out in one "factoid", your entire argument is now suspect. Not all Antis are ignorant, and many are not stupid.
Click to expand...

I agree, but.... **** the antis. It's not the antis you need to target. It's the bystanders/weebly wobblies which might be listening to them. All "declared" antis are pretty much ignorant in one respect or another because they were stupid/dense enough to get sucked into the machine. The vote you want, the attention you want- is from the massive shitload of people who have not made up their mind about gun control. There are tons of people who are clueless about guns or laws against guns, etc, etc, ad nauseam... that is the target market. Not the 0.5% that virulently hate guns.

-Mike
 
drgrant said:
I agree, but.... **** the antis. It's not the antis you need to target. It's the bystanders/weebly wobblies which might be listening to them. All "declared" antis are pretty much ignorant in one respect or another because they were stupid/dense enough to get sucked into the machine. The vote you want, the attention you want- is from the massive shitload of people who have not made up their mind about gun control. There are tons of people who are clueless about guns or laws against guns, etc, etc, ad nauseam... that is the target market. Not the 0.5% that virulently hate guns.

-Mike
Click to expand...

100% correct. To get a "rabid anti" to change their mind they would have to admit to themselves that they have been duped, or that they were being stupid and that they have wasted a portion of their lives fighting for something that is wrong. Very few people can handle the kind of devastating psychological turmoil this creates. No one is going to convince the "rabid antis" to change their minds short of years of effort or a dark cell and some electrodes. :)

I do think that with the proper persuasive communication and emotional appeal the easily swayed, wishy-washy masses can be brought around.
 
GBH2 said:
100% correct. To get a "rabid anti" to change their mind they would have to admit to themselves that they have been duped, or that they were being stupid and that they have wasted a portion of their lives fighting for something that is wrong. Very few people can handle the kind of devastating psychological turmoil this creates. No one is going to convince the "rabid antis" to change their minds short of years of effort or a dark cell and some electrodes. :)

I do think that with the proper persuasive communication and emotional appeal the easily swayed, wishy-washy masses can be brought around.
Click to expand...

And persuasive communication and emotional appeal is what that playbook teaches. Disagree with its content and abhor its message all we will, that's a well thought out and executed document.

Where's ours?

This is a project worth undertaking.
 
Project pretty much already done - get a copy of "CONTROL" - Beck - Incidents, names, arguments, figures.
enjoy
 
drgrant said:
Yeah, but you can't lie because it's so easy to destroy the other side's credibility with that, because they're doing it all the time.

There are plenty of ways to get points across without being intellectually dishonest when you do it.

-Mike
Click to expand...

Misinformation was a poor choice of words. Tailored emotional arguments wouldn't hurt though.
 

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