1. If you enjoy the forum please consider supporting it by signing up for a NES Membership  The benefits pay for the membership many times over.

  2. Dismiss Notice

JHP ammo vs ball/FMJ

Discussion in 'Ammunition' started by AngelKing, May 10, 2011.

  1. AngelKing

    AngelKing

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2010
    Messages:
    5,550
    Likes Received:
    1,526
    Location:
    Hyde Park
    My RIA SUCKS when it comes to HP ammo, but in everything I've read, it seems as if the old school 1911s or things patterened to BE old school 1911s aregoing to have this issue. Is it worth chancing it and carrying with ball or should I just keep the 1911 for range use?

    Conversely, I haven't had a chance to shoot my Astra (.380) just yet - I see mixed reviews as to its relibility with respect to JHP. With this being a slightly lower velocity round of limited penetraton (as one review said), is this something recommended that I stick with FMJ?

    Thanks
     

  2. M1911

    M1911 Moderator NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2005
    Messages:
    38,866
    Likes Received:
    6,626
    Location:
    Near Framingham
    Take it to a good 1911 plumber and get it fixed. My 1911s shoot JHP.
     
  3. Walter Smitty

    Walter Smitty

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2005
    Messages:
    113
    Likes Received:
    1
    Location:
    Fargo North Dakota
    If your pistol functions well with ball, why not use it? The military used it for many years with acceptable results. Hollowpoints may work and they may not, even then you're not guaranteed success. If you just can't live with the thought of ball ammo however, do what you must in order to have confidence in the gun you chose to rely on. The .380 with ball will probably be as effective as hp's. Just a thought.
     
  4. sportycliff

    sportycliff

    Joined:
    Dec 3, 2008
    Messages:
    2,311
    Likes Received:
    254
    Location:
    DownEast Maine, and loving it...
    All of my 1911's shoot everything I put in them... Get a tune up.
     
  5. Bob P

    Bob P NES Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2008
    Messages:
    11,003
    Likes Received:
    2,659
    Location:
    Texas
    My S&W feeds JHP's reliably. Second the motion to get a tune up. OTOH, you're not going to have over penetration issues with 230gr ball and, while you'll get a bigger wound channel with a JHP, I'd still not want to get shot by .45 ball.
     
  6. AngelKing

    AngelKing

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2010
    Messages:
    5,550
    Likes Received:
    1,526
    Location:
    Hyde Park
    I likely WILL get the 1911 tuned up as I may want to carry that - but I won't have overpenetration with ball ammo? That was actually my main concern.

    With the .380 - is there a chance of overpenetration or is that round too slow to begin with?

     
  7. What brand/type of hollow points are you using or have you tried?

    Remington Golden Sabers function flawlessly in mine and are the closest profile to ball ammo that I've found in hollow points. If you haven't tried them you might think about buying a box or two and try them in your gun.
     
  8. M1911

    M1911 Moderator NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2005
    Messages:
    38,866
    Likes Received:
    6,626
    Location:
    Near Framingham
    You may well have overpenetration with FMJ.
     
  9. Skald

    Skald

    Joined:
    Aug 23, 2005
    Messages:
    7,521
    Likes Received:
    257
    Location:
    Jacksonville, FL (AKA a free state)
    Got to agree with M1911 your chance of overpenetration is greater with Ball/FMJ than HP. With a HP it is able to dump its energy into your target, with Ball/FMJ it is designed not to, and as such, overpenetrates.
     
  10. whatluck

    whatluck

    Joined:
    May 31, 2009
    Messages:
    7,925
    Likes Received:
    2,860
    Location:
    Braintree, MA
    One of the reasons you may decide to just stick with ball is because .45 ball will pierce a windshield and not lose trajectory as badly as other calibers.
     
  11. Garys

    Garys NES Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2005
    Messages:
    17,866
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    Location:
    Stoughton
    On a similar note, I recently acquired a S&W 457 which will likely see some carry for self defense. Included in the deal were two boxes of Federal Hydroshock .45 ACP HP rounds. One is 230 gr and the other is 185 gr. Any opinions on which is more effective for self defense carry?
     
  12. whatluck

    whatluck

    Joined:
    May 31, 2009
    Messages:
    7,925
    Likes Received:
    2,860
    Location:
    Braintree, MA
    Even though the 185 may produce more net energy, the 230 will displace more air therefore effect more shock. I always choose heavy over fast.
     
  13. vellnueve

    vellnueve

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2006
    Messages:
    16,912
    Likes Received:
    760
    Location:
    BIOT
    The RIA guns and AO guns are designed for hardball ammo like the original military issue guns - I'm not surprised they have issues with JHP.
     
  14. ptanks56

    ptanks56

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2008
    Messages:
    709
    Likes Received:
    27
    Location:
    Eastern Ct
    "Power Ball" designed ammo has a poly ball in the hollow and behaves most like a ball ammo round of all the hollow points. Plus helps the round penetrate fabric barriers
     
  15. 55_grain

    55_grain NES Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2009
    Messages:
    2,439
    Likes Received:
    247
    Location:
    near Worcester, MA
    This!
     
  16. Garys

    Garys NES Member

    Joined:
    Oct 19, 2005
    Messages:
    17,866
    Likes Received:
    2,409
    Location:
    Stoughton
    Thanks.
     
  17. drgrant

    drgrant Moderator NES Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2006
    Messages:
    66,062
    Likes Received:
    22,028
    The .230 is also pretty much the .45 ACP standard for ball ammo, so 230s are pretty much the logical choice.

    -Mike
     
  18. SgtBFGunner

    SgtBFGunner

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2010
    Messages:
    92
    Likes Received:
    18
    Location:
    Northeast CT
    +1 on Heavy over Speed (IMHO), more energy.
    You WILL get over penetration in a self defense situation with another organic target. Now, you have to worry about who or what is behind your offending offender.
    You may still get over penetration depending on the brand/composition of JHP, you have to experiment. The "PowerBall" type ammo keeps the HP filling up with material and interfering with expansion (layers of clothing, etc.) and also pushes into the HP, assisting in expansion. Everyone has their opinions/favorites when it comes to JHP...
    A 230 grain (HEAVY) JHP should penetrate a windshield, but will likely have a deflection, similar to a FMJ. The first shot could clear the way for the second shot if need be to stop the threat?
     
  19. M1911

    M1911 Moderator NES Member

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2005
    Messages:
    38,866
    Likes Received:
    6,626
    Location:
    Near Framingham
    I doubt it. They aren't both going to go into the same hole and the windshield won't shatter from the first shot.
     
  20. drgrant

    drgrant Moderator NES Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2006
    Messages:
    66,062
    Likes Received:
    22,028
    If people are so concerned about intermediate barrier penetration just get a .357 Sig and be done with it. Everything else is pretty much "weird" and "unpredictable" WRT auto glass.

    -Mike
     
  21. SgtBFGunner

    SgtBFGunner

    Joined:
    Feb 18, 2010
    Messages:
    92
    Likes Received:
    18
    Location:
    Northeast CT
    When I say "clear the way", I should have actually said "penetrate and breach the integrity of the surrounding window area". Hopefully a second shot would be in the general vicinity of the first shot.
    The 45 is a tool. It does some things better than others. Penetration is not what a JHP was designed to do. But I believe it will penetrate a windshield, as I say, with deflection. How much depends on construction of bullet, construction of the windshield, angle of windshield, distance from the windshield, temperature, humidity... day of the week...
    Add the "45 windshield penetration test" to my Bucket List.
     

Share This Page