Is Harvard's 300 yard range really 300 yards????

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Download the Nikon Spot-on app. I plugged your numbers in and their drop, etc. are the same (Nikon goes out two decimal places). Judging by your results your velocity is fast.

In spot-on, it has a "Find Muzzle Velocity" tool where you select your zero and drop distance (e.g. 100yd zero and the actual drop(rise) at 200) and it will calculate your muzzle velocity, which you can enter as a "Customized handload" vs the factory specs
 

vicorjh

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Yep. Searching for a Chrono online now. See if I can get this straightened out by next weekend...... What makes it interesting is I'm playing around with the velocity in the Hornady calculator. If I jack it up to 3100 the 300 yard MRAD setting lines up at .8 over my 100 yard zero. Problem being though is it drops the 200 yard Come Up to .3 MRADs, which I know is wrong as I needed to be .4 MRADs to zero properly at 200 yards.

Just a tad bit frustrated...... This is the fun part, right???? :oops:
I can borrow you a Labradar for Chrono if needed. In Chelmsford.

I've used that to chrono handloads on the 200 yard range. Results were ballistically accurate to 1K at Granby.
 

wahsben

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I don’t have a chrono so I’m grabbing the details from Hornady’s web site. They list the velocity per bbl length and 2710 is what the list for a 24” bbl. guess it has to be wrong.
Some barrels are faster or slower than others even though they're the same length. Also even though they have shot the same cartridge/bullet it was most likely from a different lot than yours and that could cause some variation in the velocity too. Although I don't think it would be 300fps more it might be.
 
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Not quite. According to the calculator my 300 yard come up should be 1.1 MRADs over 100 yard zero. I do that and I'm 4-5 inches high. I adjust down to .8 MRADs over 100 yard zero and I'm dead on. 3 shot group is less then 1 MOA. The calculator says .8 MRADs over 100 yard zero is the adjustment for 250 yards.
Good lesson in DOPE. Now you need to know for sure if you 100 yd zero is at 100 yards, 200 is 200 and so on.
So now you know if your going to 300 from 100 any where .9 gets you on target and you can fine tune from there.
Also the scope might have a some lash in the turrets in that particular range of adjustment.
Scope details?

What size targets will you be shooting and what diastance. ?

Did you account for elevation and temp?

last are you sure you came up 1.1 from your 100 yard zero? Sounds like you came up 1.1 from your 200 yard zero. Drop from 200-300 is about .8

did you change your scopes Magnification? Did you dial in your side focus?

either way unless your shooting at some small ass targets even shooting at 10" plates your still just catching the top edge if your holding 1 moa groups. Well at least on of those 3 shots should catch the edge.
So split the difference and come up .9 you should still be on target at 300, vertically anyway.
 
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that’s just silly. It involves math. Simpler is to flip an old Grossman’s yard stick end-over-end 300 times. ;)
Yeah, but would you be using the US survey foot or the International Foot?

I told my psychiatrist that I've been hearing voices...He told me that I don't have a psychiatrist!
Psych: So, how long have you believed you are a dog?
Patient: Ever since I was a puppy
 
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franktc

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Using my aging bushnell rangefinder, I get 304 at the 300 and 210 at the 200, measured from the front edge of the tables. At the 100, I get exactly 100 measured the same way. I have no idea if the rangefinder has ever been calibrated since it was a hand me down to me. Just another data point for your consideration.
 

Mountain

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You can borrow my MagnetoSpeed, it's the more advanced version. The Magnetospeed plus this JBM - Calculations - Trajectory (Drift) , the JBM trajectory 'app' on their website worked very well for me out to 1020 yards. You'd have to come to Holden, Worcester, or Wachsett Mtn to find me for the chrony. I printed the drops / windage from the JBM app and left some space to take notes for corrections.

You absolutely have to get chrony data for that load in that specific rifle. I don't know about a match, but when qualifying for the 1000 yd range at Granby you had to have that data / DOPE before they'd let you even try to qualify.

One other thing to be sure you plug in correctly is your sight height above bore centerline. Off by a little is fine but off by an inch not so much.

Show up to the match early enough so that you can see if it's possible to be paired with a very good spotter. Not sure how they handle that, but for myself as a relative newb I'd want someone who can quickly give me a good correction. If your brake is really good maybe you will see your impacts.
 
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I haven't seen it mentioned yet, but are you sure your score is tracking correctly?
This cant more stressed. I had to put a 20MOA base on one of my rifles because the upper/lower range of my turrets tracked like shit. So 20 MOA base got me back to the center range of the turret adjustments. The big problem is the receiver not being true and needing much more adjustment just to zero my rifle. Now I have only been out to 600 yards a handful of time in the past 4 years but I would have been lost If I did not catch this issue early. I sent the scope back last fall and they sent me a new scope. Said parts where not available any more for mine.
My less expensive scopes.... lets just say one click can be a huge change and sometimes 8 clicks dont do shit.

I found my problem like this. He also touches on range finding and error corrections to deal with it. I been trying to use more of this "math" but honestly Im only shooting 200 yards with 22lr for the most part.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12Wf0Cuwwi8
 
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Rockrivr1

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Good lesson in DOPE. Now you need to know for sure if you 100 yd zero is at 100 yards, 200 is 200 and so on.
So now you know if your going to 300 from 100 any where .9 gets you on target and you can fine tune from there.
Also the scope might have a some lash in the turrets in that particular range of adjustment.
Scope details?

What size targets will you be shooting and what diastance. ?

Did you account for elevation and temp?

last are you sure you came up 1.1 from your 100 yard zero? Sounds like you came up 1.1 from your 200 yard zero. Drop from 200-300 is about .8

did you change your scopes Magnification? Did you dial in your side focus?

either way unless your shooting at some small ass targets even shooting at 10" plates your still just catching the top edge if your holding 1 moa groups. Well at least on of those 3 shots should catch the edge.
So split the difference and come up .9 you should still be on target at 300, vertically anyway.
I’m shooting with a Vortex Viper Gen I in 5x25-50 FFP. I think the scope is ok as I was able to shoot a 3 shot cloverleaf at 300 yards once I had it at .8 over my 100 yard zero. I had it at full magnification and I did adjust the focus before shooting

This was going to be my first attempt at a match at Grandby so cant say for sure what the targets will be.

I’m pretty sure I adjusted 1.1 up from my 100 yard zero as the scope showed one notch past the number 1 on the turret. Though at this point who knows.

at this point I’m going to scrap the whole thing and start from scratch with my 100 yard zero and try again.
 
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I’m shooting with a Vortex Viper Gen I in 5x25-50 FFP. I think the scope is ok as I was able to shoot a 3 shot cloverleaf at 300 yards once I had it at .8 over my 100 yard zero. I had it at full magnification and I did adjust the focus before shooting

This was going to be my first attempt at a match at Grandby so cant say for sure what the targets will be.

I’m pretty sure I adjusted 1.1 up from my 100 yard zero as the scope showed one notch past the number 1 on the turret. Though at this point who knows.

at this point I’m going to scrap the whole thing and start from scratch with my 100 yard zero and try again.
I have done this plenty of times you forget where you left off on adjustments or convinced you did adjust,
Are your scope caps marked. I dont have zero stop turrets so I mark my zero with a paint pen.

Just because your shooting a nice group does not mean your scope is tracking accurately . My Athlon scope gave me fits. I used it for a few years and found a solution but sent it back. I was told the parts for the erector where no longer available and they sent me a new scope. The turrets are a tad different and feel much better.

next time you get out try this
100 yards with your 100 yard setting come up 1mil you should be 3.6" high from the aim point. Do for 10 shots cycling from 100 yd zero to 1mil you can even do -1mil then stretch it out to 5 or 10 mils and just see how well the impacts are compared to the adjustments. Remember you aim at the same point through out the test.
 

Dave Marshall

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I’m shooting with a Vortex Viper Gen I in 5x25-50 FFP. I think the scope is ok as I was able to shoot a 3 shot cloverleaf at 300 yards once I had it at .8 over my 100 yard zero. I had it at full magnification and I did adjust the focus before shooting

This was going to be my first attempt at a match at Grandby so cant say for sure what the targets will be.

I’m pretty sure I adjusted 1.1 up from my 100 yard zero as the scope showed one notch past the number 1 on the turret. Though at this point who knows.

at this point I’m going to scrap the whole thing and start from scratch with my 100 yard zero and try again.
That scope should be good to go. I wouldn’t be looking at turret lash or issues unless it was old and well used. Did you use the zero stop shims? You definitely want the elevation to bottom out at least .5 (5 or 6 clicks) below your 100yd zero.

The velocities that Hornady publishes are usually very close. I’ll have my chrono at the match, we could always fire a few rounds real quick. It’s a beginner friendly match and lots of help will be available. Don’t drop out of the match.

Did you allow the app to gather local weather data? When did you shoot? If it was really cold, That 4” difference at 300 is not odd at all.

Most apps also have a velocity truing feature, but you need more than 300yds to do it. You tell the app how much it is off by at 4 or 5 ranges and it will adjust the velocity to true the ballistic curve.

Like I said. Don’t drop out of the match. Even if you struggle, make good notes and get actual DOPE (Data of Precious Engagement) for next time. It’ll still be fun, too.
 

Rockrivr1

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That scope should be good to go. I wouldn’t be looking at turret lash or issues unless it was old and well used. Did you use the zero stop shims? You definitely want the elevation to bottom out at least .5 (5 or 6 clicks) below your 100yd zero.

The velocities that Hornady publishes are usually very close. I’ll have my chrono at the match, we could always fire a few rounds real quick. It’s a beginner friendly match and lots of help will be available. Don’t drop out of the match.

Did you allow the app to gather local weather data? When did you shoot? If it was really cold, That 4” difference at 300 is not odd at all.

Most apps also have a velocity truing feature, but you need more than 300yds to do it. You tell the app how much it is off by at 4 or 5 ranges and it will adjust the velocity to true the ballistic curve.

Like I said. Don’t drop out of the match. Even if you struggle, make good notes and get actual DOPE (Data of Precious Engagement) for next time. It’ll still be fun, too.
Thanks! I was seriously considering dropping out as I didn’t want to be “that guy” who held everyone up. I’ll still show up.
 

Dave Marshall

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Thanks! I was seriously considering dropping out as I didn’t want to be “that guy” who held everyone up. I’ll still show up.
Last summer, we had one guy show up with his AR and ammo that his dad had loaded. All or most of the ammo was loaded too long to fit in the magazine. Either way we found him some .223 to shoot and lent him one of our guns for the longer stages. He stayed for the whole match, had loads of fun, and still didn’t finish dead last.
 
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Last summer, we had one guy show up with his AR and ammo that his dad had loaded. All or most of the ammo was loaded too long to fit in the magazine. Either way we found him some .223 to shoot and lent him one of our guns for the longer stages. He stayed for the whole match, had loads of fun, and still didn’t finish dead last.
Maybe his dad loaded up some 80 grain for long range?
I feel for that guy did the same thing a few times and I needed to shoot rapids !
 
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Thanks! I was seriously considering dropping out as I didn’t want to be “that guy” who held everyone up. I’ll still show up.
Definitely dont drop out. Your not that far off really.
Your pulling off MOA groups at 300 yards and your guestimated adjustment only put you 4” high of expected impact.
Like said if tour shooting at 10” plates your just dinging the top edge. If your trying to hit the X ring your still hitting 10s if using a SR-3 or similar targets
 
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Dave Marshall

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Definitely dont drop out. Your not that far off really.
Your pulling off MOA groups at 300 yards and your guestimated adjustment only put you 4” high of expected impact.
Like said if tour shooting at 10” plates your just donging the top edge. If your trying to hit the X ring your still hitting 10s
Unless the stage is offhand, the target would probably only be 6 or 8 inches. The 4” error matters. Especially if that degree of error is present at longer range.
 

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The last time we lased the HSC ranges, the 300 was spot on from the front of the concrete firing line to the paper target frames, but the 200 was (from memory) 207 yards. Seems to me we heard a story about the target frames having been moved some time ago while being rebuilt.
 
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Unless the stage is offhand, the target would probably only be 6 or 8 inches. The 4” error matters. Especially if that degree of error is present at longer range.
its not enough to not go, is it.
the only way to learn is to go and have people around who know get you on target.
Still think he came up 1.1 from his 200 setting not 100.
Even with 6 to 8 inch targets hes only "just" missing. Lighting can have a few MOA effect on your shots.
Now once you see your error cant you figure out how to calculate that degree of error and correct for other targets.
lets say you find yourself at 100 yards. 1.0 mil adjustment is only getting to 3.1" not 3 .6" you now need to factor that in.

If you know your error "dope" you can factor that in all the way out to ~ . It may not be easy and i cant easily tell you the math especially with mil. Im stuck on MOA myself.
 
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The last time we lased the HSC ranges, the 300 was spot on from the front of the concrete firing line to the paper target frames, but the 200 was (from memory) 207 yards. Seems to me we heard a story about the target frames having been moved some time ago while being rebuilt.
Now how far back from the cement edge is the shooting position. Do you measure 100yards from muzzle or center of scope.
 
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That scope should be good to go. I wouldn’t be looking at turret lash or issues unless it was old and well used. Did you use the zero stop shims? You definitely want the elevation to bottom out at least .5 (5 or 6 clicks) below your 100yd zero.

The velocities that Hornady publishes are usually very close. I’ll have my chrono at the match, we could always fire a few rounds real quick. It’s a beginner friendly match and lots of help will be available. Don’t drop out of the match.

Did you allow the app to gather local weather data? When did you shoot? If it was really cold, That 4” difference at 300 is not odd at all.

Most apps also have a velocity truing feature, but you need more than 300yds to do it. You tell the app how much it is off by at 4 or 5 ranges and it will adjust the velocity to true the ballistic curve.

Like I said. Don’t drop out of the match. Even if you struggle, make good notes and get actual DOPE (Data of Precious Engagement) for next time. It’ll still be fun, too.
Not so much "lash" as worn out but the accuracy and repeatable adjustments.
At 100 yards when you dial up 10 mil is the bullet impact 36" high/ low/left/right from point of aim?
Shooting MOA add 1/2" error so with in 35.5" 36.5" i would call it good. Now what would be a limit of error. 2 % 4%?
Its all fun and much easier to figure out cown range.
 
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I’m shooting with a Vortex Viper Gen I in 5x25-50 FFP. I think the scope is ok as I was able to shoot a 3 shot cloverleaf at 300 yards once I had it at .8 over my 100 yard zero. I had it at full magnification and I did adjust the focus before shooting

This was going to be my first attempt at a match at Grandby so cant say for sure what the targets will be.

I’m pretty sure I adjusted 1.1 up from my 100 yard zero as the scope showed one notch past the number 1 on the turret. Though at this point who knows.

at this point I’m going to scrap the whole thing and start from scratch with my 100 yard zero and try again.
Good thing is you , ammo , gun and scope are
capable of moa. Just start fresh like you say.

I use these at 100 yards. The reticle shows up nice against the red dot and if you take the time to square/level/plumb the target the grids work well to check your cross hairs. Along with any "grid" "hash" marks and make sure they are "good" enough.http://www.mytargets.com/target24%20red%20half%20inch%20on%20grid.pdf
I have "mil dot" scopes that are not "mil" in any way but having Dots on the vert/horiz lines.
They are actually closer to MOA. If i put a few of my $200-300 "mil dot" style scopes against the red dot target dot to dot is just shy of 3"
My $250 mueller is dead on at 24x
 

dcmdon

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Yep. Searching for a Chrono online now. See if I can get this straightened out by next weekend...... What makes it interesting is I'm playing around with the velocity in the Hornady calculator. If I jack it up to 3100 the 300 yard MRAD setting lines up at .8 over my 100 yard zero. Problem being though is it drops the 200 yard Come Up to .3 MRADs, which I know is wrong as I needed to be .4 MRADs to zero properly at 200 yards.

Just a tad bit frustrated...... This is the fun part, right???? :oops:
That suggests that the BC entered isn't correct.
 
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