Iron Glock

A point about ways to increase durability and safety of the Iron Glock design would be to add steel reinforcing strips from front to back using some .032" 4130 steel sheet, anchored to the base frame with spot welds. This eliminates concern about a weld failure leading to a catastrophic frame separation - not that such is likely with proper welds
Another approach would be to apply a lamination of carbon fiber tape down one side, around the back and up the other in an unbroken band, epoxy bonded to the steel frame eliminating the potential for frame failure.

Considering the number of people shooting high powered rifles and MG's with re-welded receivers, I feel pretty confident this design will prove durable even without reinforcement.
 
Sure, but the total amount of weld area would be greater. BTW the only time the nose-to-grip weld is placed under tension is during slide closure...so a sudden break would result in the slide flying forward off the gun.

During recoil the force is placing the front welds under compression, and if the barrel block is fitted to buttress against the grip section where the upper curve forms a strong support ledge, the welds themselves are under low stress.

This is also why I used OA welds...gas welds are softer and less likely to crack, and R70S rod has a tensile strength of 83,000psi which means mighty strong if I did my job right. I'm pretty sure the tensile strength of polymer before cracking and failure is substantially lower.
 
Kilibreaux said:
Outstanding series on YouTube broken down over 20 clips titled: "30 minute Glock, part 1 (-20)." The video series begins with unpacking the raw materials and culminates with the final product being fired.
While the poster isn't named Boris, the person in the video is performing all the tasks with the swift surety of someone who has built more than a few frames so I suspect it is Boris.
Altogether and excellent builder's guide that makes the entire process considerably less daunting.
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Thank you! That is I and that was the point. I am glad it comes across right.

Kilibreaux said:
Just finished building the Snapdragon kit in 9mm.
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that is awesome!!!1 That really made my day seeing that people build them. Can you share some pictures?

Kilibreaux said:
A point about ways to increase durability and safety of the Iron Glock design would be to add steel reinforcing strips from front to back using some .032" 4130 steel sheet, anchored to the base frame with spot welds. This eliminates concern about a weld failure leading to a catastrophic frame separation - not that such is likely with proper welds.
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I understand concern. However, the weld is fillet weld, as long as plenty of shielding gas it is stronger of any other part of the frame. The recoil on 9mm is so weak, I use to test with .40 and also gun needs to be held firmly, otherwise limpwristing will absorb so much 9mm recoil that not engouh will be left to unlock barrel.

Aside from hypothetical theorizing consider this, MG type 3 frame (top rail glued in plastic) with extended magwell by 4.5mm for bigger cartridge. I shot 45GAP, 45ACP and 10mm with it.

Here it is in 50 cal (50GI):

[video=youtube_share;iyWknnZ2P6M]http://youtu.be/iyWknnZ2P6M[/video]

and if is no good, .46 Rowland on the same ironglock frame:

[video=youtube_share;6vr2rIlll1M]http://youtu.be/6vr2rIlll1M?t=13s[/video]


So 4" 9mm is like 500 J and .46 Rowland, 6" can go up to 2300 j and 3000fps. Is like ant want to compare with Peter North.

... also, I post later, the trigger housing is held with paper clip.
 
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Boris, I'm a true believer to be sure! I agree the question of weld strength is "asked and answered" as they say in legal parlance.
BTW for those interested the unloaded weight of the basic Snapdragon is 24.4 ounces. The steel frame version weighs just 5.5 ounces more than the polymer! That is of course without an enclosed recoil spring but it does include the steel backstrap made from .063" wall thickness square tube.
I'm definitely interested in doing a steel frame G29 using the "SF" trigger housing. I know most will want to go with the polymer grip with the abbreviated frame, but I'm interested in crafting an all steel that looks good enough to show off!

I would post pics but I don't have privileges.
 
Kilibreaux said:
Boris, I'm a true believer to be sure! I agree the question of weld strength is "asked and answered" as they say in legal parlance.
BTW for those interested the unloaded weight of the basic Snapdragon is 24.4 ounces. The steel frame version weighs just 5.5 ounces more than the polymer! That is of course without an enclosed recoil spring but it does include the steel backstrap made from .063" wall thickness square tube.
I'm definitely interested in doing a steel frame G29 using the "SF" trigger housing. I know most will want to go with the polymer grip with the abbreviated frame, but I'm interested in crafting an all steel that looks good enough to show off!

I would post pics but I don't have privileges.
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host the pics on photobucket, imgur, etc.
 
warwickben said:
I'm confused what kit do I need for a .45 build?
And is there a airsoft frame that will work for it .
I keep getting distracted by all the pretty pictures and Boris's sexy hands.
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there are no kits for wide frame, but if there were, they would be very similar to regular sized frames with the exception of the middle/mag piece. There is also no good airsoft frames at all. I don't see any airsoft G20 or 21. May be airsoft people have small hands only? This things was made from zm17 and there is barely any plastic left on it.
 
Kilibreaux said:
Outstanding series on YouTube broken down over 20 clips titled: "30 minute Glock, part 1 (-20)." The video series begins with unpacking the raw materials and culminates with the final product being fired.
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watching those clips 50 seconds at a time is annoying..... if i get some spare time and am motivated enough i'm going to combine them into one video and set them to music.....
"my favorite things" from the sound of music would fit nicely i think......
 
Boris said:
there are no kits for wide frame, but if there were, they would be very similar to regular sized frames with the exception of the middle/mag piece. There is also no good airsoft frames at all. I don't see any airsoft G20 or 21. May be airsoft people have small hands only? This things was made from zm17 and there is barely any plastic left on it.
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:(
 
Here is my progress so far on the SD kit (G19). I like the exposed steel frame so I'm trying to make it more complete by adding the recoil spring enclosure, a back strap and enclose the trigger housing. Eventually I plan to clean it up and put a finish on it to see how it looks.
Right now I have the mag catch spring locked down with a machine screw but I plan to come up with a more complete solution.
For the slide release I used a 1/4" dia coil spring situated on an 8-32 screw to lock it in place from slipping - the slide release works per normal.


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I got the "3 pin" parts for the G19 but couldn't see any way to accurately drill for the small pin at the barrel block. At the same time I realized the short base and single pin retention would not be enough to prevent the barrel block from tilting - ever so slightly. So I shortened the small pin and carefully honed away material just behind the barrel block until the block can be secured by it's single large pin, and the small pin absolutely prevents any upward, rear rotational movement.
The problem with drilling before or after welding (small pin) is that before the hole would have been inside the weld area and after the weld area made accurate drilling highly unlikely so I was planning to not use it, however the angle formed by the nose piece and grip section aren't a perfect match to the barrel block...to have it flat on the bottom meant some amount of "slop" along the back despite careful filing, so, once everything was completed going back and adding the pin solved the potential for the barrel block to rock forward and back.
 
Used a section of 4130 steel tube - cut it off, sliced it open, then bent it outward to match the shape of the trigger housing then welded it on! One problem I have is I have an "0" and a "1" tip for my Henrob torch and I REALLY need something in the middle - so I'm awaiting the arrival of a ".5" tip.

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Kilibreaux said:
Used a section of 4130 steel tube - cut it off, sliced it open, then bent it outward to match the shape of the trigger housing then welded it on! One problem I have is I have an "0" and a "1" tip for my Henrob torch and I REALLY need something in the middle - so I'm awaiting the arrival of a ".5" tip.

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nice, i like this!
 
Boris said:
Thank you! That is I and that was the point. I am glad it comes across right.



that is awesome!!!1 That really made my day seeing that people build them. Can you share some pictures?



I understand concern. However, the weld is fillet weld, as long as plenty of shielding gas it is stronger of any other part of the frame. The recoil on 9mm is so weak, I use to test with .40 and also gun needs to be held firmly, otherwise limpwristing will absorb so much 9mm recoil that not engouh will be left to unlock barrel.

Aside from hypothetical theorizing consider this, MG type 3 frame (top rail glued in plastic) with extended magwell by 4.5mm for bigger cartridge. I shot 45GAP, 45ACP and 10mm with it.

Here it is in 50 cal (50GI):

[video=youtube_share;iyWknnZ2P6M]http://youtu.be/iyWknnZ2P6M[/video]

and if is no good, .46 Rowland on the same ironglock frame:

[video=youtube_share;6vr2rIlll1M]http://youtu.be/6vr2rIlll1M?t=13s[/video]


So 4" 9mm is like 500 J and .46 Rowland, 6" can go up to 2300 j and 3000fps. Is like ant want to compare with Peter North.

... also, I post later, the trigger housing is held with paper clip.
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Boris,

I take there are no plans to introduce a large-frame kit specific to the 10mm/.45ACP?
If not, would splitting the existing grip lengthwise down each side and introducing a spacer to extend it for the larger mag be the only major "redesign" needed to adapt an existing kit for the larger calibers? My thinking is that since the G29 is dimensionally only slightly long than the G26, and mag well front to back length is greater, the nose piece length is probably similar. So if I start with a SD kit built for the G19 will the nose piece be long enough or do I need to acquire a Marigold nose piece - I realize either will need some dimensional adjustment to fit the G29.
 
dyer01905 said:
Ugh my brain hurts. I wanna do this but I'm scared to try it on my own. [laugh]
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What's the worst that can happen?
All the extra scary stuff happens in the slide.

I think the worst that can happen is that the slide flies off backwards and hits you in the face.

and the one word I think should be applied is "LANYARD".
 
For the AR people, you can improve your accuracy and your confidence around your mom's basement by adding tactical unicorns with horns ribbed for his pleasure and fruity shit.

Look at that mother****ing unicorn! It got rainbow coming out of its ass!
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I just pee'd a little....
 
Kilibreaux said:
Boris,

I take there are no plans to introduce a large-frame kit specific to the 10mm/.45ACP?
If not, would splitting the existing grip lengthwise down each side and introducing a spacer to extend it for the larger mag be the only major "redesign" needed to adapt an existing kit for the larger calibers? My thinking is that since the G29 is dimensionally only slightly long than the G26, and mag well front to back length is greater, the nose piece length is probably similar. So if I start with a SD kit built for the G19 will the nose piece be long enough or do I need to acquire a Marigold nose piece - I realize either will need some dimensional adjustment to fit the G29.
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Oh man, thank you for the photos, these are awesome and it's great to see that other people actually building these. This totally made my day!

In terms of grip for wide body, it needs to be wider and longer (looking from top) The mg-3 type it doesn't need to be as wide, because the top is on top of mag which is conical, so technically rail just needs to be longer.

When the kits will come up? I'm not sure. There is just little demand, too little, literally few people (Marsha rejoice!) wanting these. I need to make the die for the grip. I'll try to do it tomorrow, next days. If it is not happening this week, next week I start day job.

I really wish you do not try to put inserts into mag, it's doable but too much work and I feel guilty for just not getting the dies done.
 
kid_fisto said:
What's the worst that can happen?
All the extra scary stuff happens in the slide.

I think the worst that can happen is that the slide flies off backwards and hits you in the face.

and the one word I think should be applied is "LANYARD".
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That's pretty much it! Flying slide is the only thing that would be really bad, however it is not like 1911 slide or other pistols of blockback design. The force of slide goes into the grip so much that many glocks I built before, if too much friction 9mm would not cycle them and I used 40 just to see that dimensions were right. So there is not much force left at all. Even if all four rails fail at the same time, shooter may get slide with force of bitch slapped by Richard Simmons, probably not fatal.

Also, I was saying about limpwristing. There is so little energy left after unlocking slide that with a limpwrist, it is possible that glock won't cycle on 9mm, so little energy is left.
 
From the rear view it's clear more work adding epoxy filler, blending and smoothing is needed but the primer coat shows progress made as well. I considered doing the fill work with ABS, but instead opted for JB Weld with steel...takes awhile to cure but it gets pretty hard and will probably hold up. For the back strap area I broke down and applied some epoxy steel putty...not as strong as JB Weld, but it'll do. After all the fill work is purely cosmetic.

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Kilibreaux said:
From the rear view it's clear more work adding epoxy filler, blending and smoothing is needed but the primer coat shows progress made as well. I considered doing the fill work with ABS, but instead opted for JB Weld with steel...takes awhile to cure but it gets pretty hard and will probably hold up. For the back strap area I broke down and applied some epoxy steel putty...not as strong as JB Weld, but it'll do. After all the fill work is purely cosmetic.

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keep up the good work, this is looking good!
 
Boris said:
holy crap man, I will burn you a wide frame kit tomorrow and get the dies done. Thank you for posting the photos!
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You know I'm down for the large frame kits...but I'm primarily interested in building them out with exposed steel - no polymer housing. I have an idea for a more streamlined front enclosure for the mag release spring which would eliminate the need for a lot of filler and reduce grip housing. Also I would imagine an "SF" frame kit would be desired. I think an all steel can come in with a smaller grip and reach than the polymers.

I definitely want to build up a G20 and G29 equivalent steel frame.
 
Boris,

You know I'm not sure you couldn't produce your frame kits in "pre-welded" form sans pin holes and still easily meet the ATF requirement they require 20% or more to complete.
Only adaptation required would be to create a drill template - ideally with an index point for alignment.
If the user has to drill the holes, do all the grinding to fit the slide - the locking block, etc, plus either finish out a "1" spec frame, or do the work to seat a "3" series inside polymer, they're easily doing most of the work. This would undoubtedly increase interest just as is the case with 80% AR and 1911 frames/receivers because the most daunting part that requires a fair degree of skill an investment in welding equipment come already done.
Just a thought and my .34 cents worth cause this system and method of building is the only way to acquire a Glock!

I'm going to pm you about another idea you may or may not be interested in R&Ding.
 
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