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Interesting info on anti depressants
- Thread starter Buggin
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I was on anti depressants for 3 years after I was diagnosed with my leukemia. Off them since last summer.
Hated feeling pretty much nothing about anything.
People are SUPPOSED to have up and down swings of mood and happiness.
Better off just being off of them.
Hated feeling pretty much nothing about anything.
People are SUPPOSED to have up and down swings of mood and happiness.
Better off just being off of them.
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Hmm. My Doc prescribed a low dose of amitryptiline for neuralgia from shingles. Stuff made me stop to think and forget to start again (I kid you not - I kept finding myself just completely blanking out for 5-30 seconds). Switched right back to the normal painkillers and ibuprofen. That stuff scares me, man. Any drugs designed to alter feelings and emotions scare me. (Excepting, of course, the recreational stuff. I've got no dog in that fight, no interest in them myself, but the prohibition causes more problems than the drugs themselves)
I have 2 friends that have each been on them for years. Both have ended up suicidal with their meds being upped, changed, combined with other meds to keep them stable etc.
Once someone has been on them long term it changes their brain chemistry and they will be on some type of anti depressant probably for life.
The medical community seems to want everyone on something.
Once someone has been on them long term it changes their brain chemistry and they will be on some type of anti depressant probably for life.
The medical community seems to want everyone on something.
A low dose of amitrytiline is quite successful in relieving cronic pain associated with nerve damage. The main problem is that it takes two weeks for the body to get used to it. During that two week period, the patient feels tired and lethargic, especially first thing in the morning. On day 15, life is good again.
Many medications when used properly can help a patient return to a pain reduced state. The key words are: "when used properly."
It would be a complete injustice to link everybody's use of RX to "Gun Mental Health Checks." The average person will think an anti-depressent is only used by the clinically depressed or mentally ill. And that is just not true.
Best regards.
They all had a size 10 shoe, wore a white t-shirt at some point, and have ears.
Know what I noticed about that list?
There's under 30 people named. There's 80 million gun owners, quite literally. Of those, I'm sure 1/10th of them are on anti-depressants of some sort (given the political climate, that's probably an understatement). Miraculously, that list still remains under 30.
Knee jerk reactions. There is no problem. No mental health in America issue. No gun issue. Nothing. It's a human problem, and once in a while there are people that are hellbent on doing evil. It's unavoidable. There are no fingers to point, no one problem that needs a solution. It cannot be solved. Evil exists, no law will cast it away. No reform will prevent it. It's a fact of life, and we need to accept it.
Know what I noticed about that list?
There's under 30 people named. There's 80 million gun owners, quite literally. Of those, I'm sure 1/10th of them are on anti-depressants of some sort (given the political climate, that's probably an understatement). Miraculously, that list still remains under 30.
Knee jerk reactions. There is no problem. No mental health in America issue. No gun issue. Nothing. It's a human problem, and once in a while there are people that are hellbent on doing evil. It's unavoidable. There are no fingers to point, no one problem that needs a solution. It cannot be solved. Evil exists, no law will cast it away. No reform will prevent it. It's a fact of life, and we need to accept it.
Yup. Statistics 101: correlation does not prove causation.
Did the meds cause them to go nuts? Or were they very disturbed individuals to start with, who were seeing psychiatrists that were trying to treat their psychoses?
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Except that there are some people who never experience the Up part of the swing, the are stuck in the down part and that is no way to exist. I say exist because it is not really any kind of life
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Different people react differently to a medication. There are quite a few anti-depressants. For some folks, one won't work, another will a little, another will a lot, but they get side effects, etc.
So I think it is unwise to generalize.
I would agree that there is alot of people living normal life's on anti depressants, but there are exceptions to the rules, and some people in a small percentage may be having strange reactions to the drugs that cant be over looked.
If there is a link to anti depressants causing some people to act in a more violent manner then normal it would be beneficial to find out why in these people it did this and possibly prevent this from happening agen.
Truthfully as of now its unknown if it was the anti depressant, or that it had directly or in cobination with other drugs caused a chemical imbalance, or if it was the type of mental problem the person had.
It could be all of these things together that make a bad combination causing someone to do such a violent thing.
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Im not talking about reform, im talking about investigating first on what was the mental state of these people before and after taking any medications and proceding from there, if it is so like you say not something found to be relevant, then there is no need to act on it,
but i have this feeling that there are quite a bit more people you dont know about that did not commit violent crimes but have had bad mental reactions to anti depressants, and im just saying If this is true and some people are experiencing bad reactions and its not looked into to some existent, then things would be bound to repeat themselves.
But your right, changing laws or making new ones from little to no information is not the way to go, i believe it needs to be look into and if nothing is found leave it alone.
I just dont trust drug companies who spend hundreds of millions to develop meds to be compleatly honest about what they can do to a person, and i dont care how much testing is done before hand.
Unless the anti- depressant theory on mass shootings is peer reviewed by a Medical Journal, I remain very, very skeptical. We don't have any of these shooters medical records, we don't know what they felt before they were on anti-depressent, or after. Frankly, we don't even know if this shooters were on any anti-depressent at all. So to blame all the shootings on anti-depressents is real ignorant.
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Agreed i dont like the idea of mental heath and gun rights being together, most people would not get the help they need out of fear of loosing there ability to own a gun,
Also who knows what the goverment would classify as someone not fit to own a gun due to mental illness.
I would just like the meds looked at and evaluated and see if they were part of the problem or not
These lunatics are are screwed up from the get go. There are countless instances in which an individual shows violent tendencies and are severely mentally ill, yet if they are on correct meds they are harmless Most instances when they do not take their medication they revert back to their "normal" state of being ****ed up and dangerous. I fear that you guys have become entrenched in a situation of what I consider "copy cat mass shootings" and believe that it is statistically relevant to actual gun related murders in this country. Bottom line is, some people are evil, at birth or because of their upbringing. You think these freaking gang bangers in Chicago or any other crime ridden shit holes are shooting people because of anti-depressants or lack thereof??? NO. They dont have medical insurance, they dont get treatment, they dont do shit except be violent CRIMINALS. Take a look at the stats of mental illnesses/disorders in this country, it is staggering. Some are severe (Schizophrenia/psychosis) some are not (anxiety/mild depression/OCD etc). Most people in their lifetime could be considered having a mental illness or disorder. Ya great idea stigmatizing them and stripping them of their constitutional right based on their medical records and a subjective LO that now, in essence, would be acting as an MD. Just another reason to deny us our LTC's. All aboard the Linsky train.
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True and i feel this should be looked into, it should be taken into consideration if any of the recant shooters were proven to be off there meds or on the wrong ones when they went on there rampage, as well as what are the effects of the brain when suddenly one stops taking these meds. could proove to be nothing but if you dont look you will never know.
Preaching to the choir, so great article, Im going to share it.
I was divorced in 2005. It went down as one of the worst experiences I've ever had to face. I was nearly dumbfounded with sadness and often slept every moment I could get away with.
I had no shortage of friends, family, doctors etc, urge me to take an anti depressant, to try this, try that etc. Im not claiming to be some genius on pharmaceuticals, but after having seen people do strange things as an EMT AND because my ex wife was on them since the age of 16, I had a certain bias towards them and think they had a certain part to play in the demise of our relationship....among many other obvious red flags that a young man ignores when he's in love with a soul sucking whore....oh, sorry, tangent there.
Anyway, if that's something one needs to get through, I'd never begrudge them that- my divorce taught me what anguish was. On the other hand, I think it made me what I am today and Im grateful that I found within myself the capacity to fight through it without an artificial means.
I was divorced in 2005. It went down as one of the worst experiences I've ever had to face. I was nearly dumbfounded with sadness and often slept every moment I could get away with.
I had no shortage of friends, family, doctors etc, urge me to take an anti depressant, to try this, try that etc. Im not claiming to be some genius on pharmaceuticals, but after having seen people do strange things as an EMT AND because my ex wife was on them since the age of 16, I had a certain bias towards them and think they had a certain part to play in the demise of our relationship....among many other obvious red flags that a young man ignores when he's in love with a soul sucking whore....oh, sorry, tangent there.
Anyway, if that's something one needs to get through, I'd never begrudge them that- my divorce taught me what anguish was. On the other hand, I think it made me what I am today and Im grateful that I found within myself the capacity to fight through it without an artificial means.
Again, this exactly.
THIS.
Guys and gals, I happen to be a psychiatrist and these correlations certainly are not the only ones that have been falsely attributed to causation (by some). It would be akin to saying that normal Saline infusions are associated with sudden death in hospitals simply because patients who died were on fluid infusions.
There was a similar situation with antidepressants in children and adolescents. To this day, antidepressants carry a BLACK BOX WARNING (simply an FDA statement that places the sole responsibility onto the prescriber and absolves the pharmaceutical companies of any liability) for children and adolescents up to age 25. This is because it was found that in some patients who were very depressed and vegetative physically, the medicines activated them and in some, caused an increase in suicidal thoughts. Now this is only thoughts/ideations. NOT completed suicides. And so when this warning first came out, child and adolescent psychiatrists got spooked and the rate of antidepressant prescriptions to youngsters declined rapidly. And guess what? The suicide rate in this population rose just as dramatically.
What drives people to commit violent acts is in no way uniform or analyzable to any great degree on a "meta" level. Certain risk factors are known to most: certain mental illnesses, substance abuse, personality disorders, disinhibition substances, certain medical neurological conditions, and so on and so forth. What's more, antidepressants are extremely over prescribed in general, especially by non mental health professionals. Did you know that most antidepressants are prescribed by OB-GYN's? Did you know that an antidepressant prescribed to someone who is experiencing bipolar depression as opposed to generic unipolar depression can precipitate an episode of mania and-or psychosis?
Without getting into any more specifics I can attest 100% that these medications are completely safe when used appropriately. Moreover, the sad fact is that despite the best doctors and best treatments, some seriously mentally ill folks will commit acts of violence against themselves, others, and/or property. And you can bet the farm they'll likely have psychotropic medications in their system at the time.
Hope this was helpful.
You are right on the money. I didn't like not giving a crap.
correlation doesn't neccessarily mean causation, but one cannot overlook the fact that anti depressants seem to be a common player on this stage of tragedy. The medication is part of an overall treatment, a treatment that involves diagnoses that utterly failed to detect and deal with a threat to the community at large.
yes, correlation doesn't equate to causation, but another factor that's overlooked is video games. Im the first one to admit, I LOVE FPS games and there is a measurable seratonin hit one gets when eliminating another player on COD that equated to when I'd stop a shot on the ice as a kid. Now, thrust a kid with a mental deficiency in an online world where he attains validation through shooting at people he doesn't see as people and its not hard to see where he disconnects from reality.
This is not to suggest I want bans on games - I love the first amendment too much to even consider such a notion. On the same token though, I can't seperate the underlying spectre that gaming, drugs and parental neglect appears to have associated itself with these tragedies.
yes, correlation doesn't equate to causation, but another factor that's overlooked is video games. Im the first one to admit, I LOVE FPS games and there is a measurable seratonin hit one gets when eliminating another player on COD that equated to when I'd stop a shot on the ice as a kid. Now, thrust a kid with a mental deficiency in an online world where he attains validation through shooting at people he doesn't see as people and its not hard to see where he disconnects from reality.
This is not to suggest I want bans on games - I love the first amendment too much to even consider such a notion. On the same token though, I can't seperate the underlying spectre that gaming, drugs and parental neglect appears to have associated itself with these tragedies.
DRDavid -
While I agree with your statement "when used appropriately" - can you not agree, as I've seen as an EMT, that when not used appropriately or when not constantly monitored by a doctor, that a disasterous result may ensue?
I ask with all due respect because I suspect some in your profession, like all professions, lack the ability or desire to follow up on treatment regimens as to their success for each individual patient.
While I agree with your statement "when used appropriately" - can you not agree, as I've seen as an EMT, that when not used appropriately or when not constantly monitored by a doctor, that a disasterous result may ensue?
I ask with all due respect because I suspect some in your profession, like all professions, lack the ability or desire to follow up on treatment regimens as to their success for each individual patient.
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It's a known fact that drugs such as prozac cause suicidal thoughts. Particularly in adolescents and mostly when the drug is first administered or when doses are altered. They also have any number of other serious side effects.
It doesn't take a genius to notice that most of these people are committing atrocious acts and then killing themselves.
There may be a correlation. Either way the drug companies should be working on improving their products. The families of patients should be more aware of possible troubles. Doctors should be more cautious when weighing the benefits of the treatment with the risk of the side effects.
IMHO less people should be medicated but that's just how I feel.
It doesn't take a genius to notice that most of these people are committing atrocious acts and then killing themselves.
There may be a correlation. Either way the drug companies should be working on improving their products. The families of patients should be more aware of possible troubles. Doctors should be more cautious when weighing the benefits of the treatment with the risk of the side effects.
IMHO less people should be medicated but that's just how I feel.
REaltor
In my experience, I know that a lot of psychiatrists don't want to prescribe to teenagers -- and in many cases, teens ARE on them, but prescribed by general practitioners who don't do the neccessary follow up.
Some folks need to be medicated, and in a lot of instances, it keeps them in check or at the least, keeps them safe, albiet through an alteration of their personality. Its when there's a lack of follow up, there's a problem.
In my experience, I know that a lot of psychiatrists don't want to prescribe to teenagers -- and in many cases, teens ARE on them, but prescribed by general practitioners who don't do the neccessary follow up.
Some folks need to be medicated, and in a lot of instances, it keeps them in check or at the least, keeps them safe, albiet through an alteration of their personality. Its when there's a lack of follow up, there's a problem.
The fact is that the psychiatric profession can not predict with much confidence who will be violent and who will not.
The people who kill a bunch of people and then kill themselves are likely deeply psychotic. They are probably under treatment or have been treated for their psychosis. That treatment likely involves psychoactive medication. But the cause of the violence is, almost certainly, not the medication. The cause of the violence is the psychosis.
The people who kill a bunch of people and then kill themselves are likely deeply psychotic. They are probably under treatment or have been treated for their psychosis. That treatment likely involves psychoactive medication. But the cause of the violence is, almost certainly, not the medication. The cause of the violence is the psychosis.
There is a theoretical base AND a real evidence of increased aggression in laboratory rodents who were treated with substances increasing brain serotonin levels. There is a theoretical base of increased aggression in humans taking drugs increasinng brain serotonin levels. Is there a real evidence for humans? Yes and no. Different articles say different things. But I think the fact that so many schools shooters were on anti-depressants does say a lot.
I think the problem is that nowadays anti-depressants, which are designed to treat a psychiatric disorder, are prescribed to treat normal mood changes. Basically it is prescribed for healthy people, messing up their nerutransmitters and leading to unpredictable consequences.
I think the problem is that nowadays anti-depressants, which are designed to treat a psychiatric disorder, are prescribed to treat normal mood changes. Basically it is prescribed for healthy people, messing up their nerutransmitters and leading to unpredictable consequences.
The question is: what was the original problem in those killers? Was it an actual psychosis (which, BTW, is treated with anti-psychotics, not anti-depressants)? Was it an actual clinical depression? Was it a bipolar disorder? Or was it a standard popular complaint of feeling blue and being over stressed, which does not necessarily means a psychiatric condition?
