I saw a zip car at the range, it made me wonder

[gearjunky13]

So a zip car to my knowledge is a rentable car that is owned buy a individual and through this company "zip car" you can rent this persons car for what ever?

Now if im not mistaken if a zip car is owed in MA and one of the people who have drove it leaves just one casing in the car by accident and the actual owner or next person driving it dose not have a ltc, the crap they could be in if ever stopped and searched.

Kinda wonder how this would go trying to exsplane its not yours

 

[Silversnake]

Actually, the model's slightly different unless they changed it since the last time I looked. The car is actually owned by the ZIP Car company. You become a Zip Car member and then you can reserve and "check out" to drive any vehicle in the Zip Car fleet based on what's close to where you are. A bit different than a private citizen renting his car out.

Not sure how this would work if you tracked brass in to the footwell of the car and it was there for the next person who checked out that car and gets stopped by the cops for speeding or something. I would guess that person would have some 'splainin' to do. I'd guess the company does routine cleaning/service on the cars from time to time.

 

[gearjunky13]

Ok that sounds better, but i was positive there is some company that alows you to post a personal car that you can rent out fore extra cash. Maby im wrong.

 

[Zappa]

Here's something very few people know, most Zipcars have a spare key tied up in place somewhere underneath .
But, they also have the primary key inside, tethered to the dash.
However, you can't actually start the engine with it unless the control center sends an authorization signal to enable the car.
They also have GPS tracking and the Zipcar control center can locate any car in the fleet in seconds, they can also send a kill signal to disable the engine.

 

[gearjunky13]

Cool zappa, so can you leave it anyware, or do you have to bring it back were you found it

 

[inerlogic]

Cool zappa, so can you leave it anyware, or do you have to bring it back were you found it

you bring it back where you found it...
they used to have 'em at Ikea where my wife works, that's where i first heard of the thing.....
you sign up, they send you a card with a chip in it (like the one to get into the range)
reserve a certain car at a certain location, wave your card at it and it unlocks the car (opens only for the card that has the reservation)
if the car is dirty nasty you can call 'em to report it, they'll schedule a cleaning and try to find you another car, or if you want you can clean it and they reimburse your account....

 

[gearjunky13]

Thanks inerlogic, but i still laugh a little seeing one at the range, i dont know why that is, anyways +1 for all, thanks for the info

 

[Zappa]

you bring it back where you found it...
they used to have 'em at Ikea where my wife works, that's where i first heard of the thing.....
you sign up, they send you a card with a chip in it (like the one to get into the range)
reserve a certain car at a certain location, wave your card at it and it unlocks the car (opens only for the card that has the reservation)

This.

Some towns have contracts to provide reserved/posted parking spaces specifically for Zipcars.
I know for certain that Brookline has a few in some of the municipal lots, as well as a few more in select locations along Beacon street. The spaces are posted for Zipcars Only and have no parking meters. If a non-Zipcar parks in one of those spots, the police will and tag and tow it.

 

[Mudfish]

I'm sure it is exactly the same as if you left anything else illegal in the car. If a few pills dropped out of someone's pocket and rolled under the seat the next driver would have some explaining to do.

 

[bostonasphalt2]

Google is like a condom for the Internet: it prevents accidents like this thread from happening

 

[ZX14]

So a zip car to my knowledge is a rentable car that is owned buy a individual and through this company "zip car" you can rent this persons car for what ever?

Now if im not mistaken if a zip car is owed in MA and one of the people who have drove it leaves just one casing in the car by accident and the actual owner or next person driving it dose not have a ltc, the crap they could be in if ever stopped and searched.

Kinda wonder how this would go trying to exsplane its not yours

Really? Who cares?

"Joe NoGuns" rents the car after you inadvertantly drop one shell casing in the car. He gets stopped in roadblock and the police notice the casing.

It's a rental car. He has no ltc/fid/xyz so he has no guns and no need for buying ammunition. Even a public defender on day 1 would get that tossed. A few judges would probably issue reprimands to anyone who filed something so ridiculous.

 

[Rider]

A few judges would probably issue reprimands to anyone who filed something so ridiculous.

You really think so? (Honest question.) My experience with MA courts is that there is no case too ridiculous or frivolous that it shouldn't waste the court's time and a citizen's money. But then, I'm thinking about the Probate Court, which has a huge amount of bandwidth, since they are barely hearing 60 cases a day currently.

 

[ZX14]

You really think so? (Honest question.) My experience with MA courts is that there is no case too ridiculous or frivolous that it shouldn't waste the court's time and a citizen's money. But then, I'm thinking about the Probate Court, which has a huge amount of bandwidth, since they are barely hearing 60 cases a day currently.

Honest Answer: Yes I do.

Consider the fact that you probably can't find any case where someone is only charged with illegally possessing ammunition components along with this situation where the posseeeion occurred in a rental car and I'd say most judges would be pissed to see this before them.

Why would a 2nd Ammendment friendly judge not think this is a waste of time?

Even an Anti-2nd judge would realize the system is persecuting a good non-guntoting citizen.

The solution is everyone should get an LTC on the odd chance that they rent a car in which another LTC dropped some brass.

 

[FreeWillie]

Actually all you need is a FID

 

[Broc]

Go to a Plymouth 4th of July parade. They leave all the empty casings from the M1 on the street and kids pick them up. I picked one up 10 years ago before I even had an FID.
An empty casing is not a big deal. You have bigger things to worry about if a cop is searching your car.

 

[JohnnyViper]

there is a online rental system that allows private owners to rent their cars, its starting to gain popularity.

 

[namedpipes]

. . . Not sure how this would work if you tracked brass in to the footwell of the car and it was there for the next person who checked out that car and gets stopped by the cops for speeding or something. I would guess that person would have some 'splainin' to do. I'd guess the company does routine cleaning/service on the cars from time to time.

No different from renting a car from Hertz. If the cleaning crew (mainly hourly wage youngsters focused on getting to the end of their shift) doesn't find it the next renter has that same risk, zipcar or not.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

And, as a matter of practicality, the chances that a cop would make an arrest for a piece of spent brass absent any other indication of criminal activity is probably rather small. As bad as MA sucks, I don't think it has yet reached the point where an expended case rises to the level of "non-discretionary arrest".

No different from renting a car from Hertz.

Untrue. Cars rented from traditional agencies are gone over and cleaned between customers. Zip cars are often rented with no rental agency action between renters.

 

[namedpipes]

. . . Untrue. Cars rented from traditional agencies are gone over and cleaned between customers. Zip cars are often rented with no rental agency action between renters.

I meant the consequences of spent brass in a conventional rental vs a zipcar (zipcar is nothing more than a rental agency), but the cleaning process of a rental car between rentals is surely pretty lackadaisical.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Consider the fact that you probably can't find any case where someone is only charged with illegally possessing ammunition components along with this situation where the posseeeion occurred in a rental car and I'd say most judges would be pissed to see this before them.

The system does not like to go "unfed", and it is very rare for prosecutors to walk away from a case - even with evidence of innocence, except in the case where there is a replacement defendant. Chances are the prosecution would offer proposing a deal of court costs plus CWOF, or prepare for trial to the defendant - if it even got that far.

I am reminded if a case I saw in Florida in the mid 80's that sounded very much like an old Odd Couple episode (the similarities were staggering). In both the real, and fictional case, a bunch of people (senior citizens in the Briney Breezes FL case) were brought to court on gambling charges and the judge threw the case out of court when the fact that it was a quarter a hand poker game came out. I believe they actually introduced the "pot" as evidence in the FL case.

 

[LittleCalm]

btw, there is another company that does "rent" out private citizens' cars. I forget the name of course. But you sign up and it operates a little like zip car. You split the rental fees with the company.

 

[Acme.Armament]

Good rule of thumb;
If you see a ZipCar on the road, get in front of it or go the other way!
The people driving them are some of the worse drivers out there.

 

[SkydiveGuy]

they used to have 'em at Ikea where my wife works

I never understood why Ikea gives special parking spots to people using "hybrid/electric cars" which are close to the entry/exits. If I owned a store like this, I'd give special parking spots to the people with large trucks/SUVs that plan on filling them up with my merchandise.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Good rule of thumb;
If you see a ZipCar on the road, get in front of it or go the other way!
The people driving them are some of the worse drivers out there.

Consider that the target market is urban dwellers who use a car so rarely that renting a car for $8/hour or so (includes gas, but unlike aircraft is not hobbs meter time, but includes time the car is parked at the maul, massage parlour or beach) is more cost effective than owning, and it's a recipe for inexperienced drivers.

I never understood why Ikea gives special parking spots to people using "hybrid/electric cars" which are close to the entry/exits.

Marketing. It makes the company look socially responsible and green at virtually no cost.

 

[F2386]

Good rule of thumb;
If you see a ZipCar on the road, get in front of it or go the other way!
The people driving them are some of the worse drivers out there.

Yep, you said it right. I worked for Zipcar for about 2 years and I was very very close to the Accident/Insurance team. We did analysis on the risk of our members by age group. No surprise, 18-24 were the highest risk age group...followed closely by 25-39. If you consider the type of people who utilize Zipcar, you can probably infer that the largest portion of Zipsters fell within these two age groups. In my time there, we were contemplating instituting premiums based on risk profiles. I'm not sure where Zipcar is now on that, there were a lot of shake-ups soon after I left so the project might have been delayed or scraped. FYI, Zipcar has a University program that allows those under 21 to obtain membership. You had to be 18 and not have any driving violations. Problem is, most 18 year old drivers don't have enough driving history to predict their suitability. Since we were rated on our membership growth you can imagine what we did when we had to flip a coin... Be extremely careful when you're near a college area and you see a Zipcar on the road.

To be on topic with the original post, I have personally gone to court for a Member because he was cited for driving without a license. The driver had a NH license but was driving a MA based Zipcar. There's a lot more behind this but in summary, the case was thrown out when the Magistrate found out that the driver had a NH license that was in good standing. To me, this experience highlights the fact that anything is possible, not matter how far-fetched it may be.

EDIT:

Imagine this scenario: Cop pulls over a Zipster. Driver is combative or not complying. Cop visually sees empty brass in the back seat and asks for FID/LTC. Driver has no idea what's going on. Cop takes subsequent action.

Though highly improbable, stranger things have happened...

 

[Acme.Armament]

Yep, you said it right. I worked for Zipcar for about 2 years and I was very very close to the Accident/Insurance team. We did analysis on the risk of our members by age group. No surprise, 18-24 were the highest risk age group...followed closely by 25-39. If you consider the type of people who utilize Zipcar, you can probably infer that the largest portion of Zipsters fell within these two age groups. In my time there, we were contemplating instituting premiums based on risk profiles. ...

Yes. Imagine them on Route 3 in traffic while they are texting on their smartphone.

 

[OfficerObie59]

And, as a matter of practicality, the chances that a cop would make an arrest for a piece of spent brass absent any other indication of criminal activity is probably rather small. As bad as MA sucks, I don't think it has yet reached the point where an expended case rises to the level of "non-discretionary arrest".

Remember, context matters. You need to be asking why the cops was tossing your car in the first place. Believe it or not, the police will only tend to search your car if they think they're going to get something serious out of it. Like, way much more than a spent shell-casing from a law abiding citizen.

If you're using the ZipCar to mule drugs from New Bedford to Lawrence and the cops have probable cause suspect it but only find a shell casing, then yeah, you stand a good chance being charged with it.

One thing I will say is that unlike some of the other stupid MA gun laws (the evil features that make an AR and AWB or not an AWB, the proper way to store when trasnporting vs. storage), I remember the "spent brass is ammunition" lesson being drilled over and over in the academy. That's not one of the ones the police tend to mess up or forget.

 

[OfficerObie59]

To be on topic with the original post, I have personally gone to court for a Member because he was cited for driving without a license. The driver had a NH license but was driving a MA based Zipcar. There's a lot more behind this but in summary, the case was thrown out when the Magistrate found out that the driver had a NH license that was in good standing. To me, this experience highlights the fact that anything is possible, not matter how far-fetched it may be.

Yeah, beleive it or not, you can be arrested for driving without a license (MGL ch. 90, § 10) if you don't have your out-of-state license in possession. The police have no duty to look up an out-of-state license. Why that's the case in this day in age with computerized everything is beyond me.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Like, way much more than a spent shell-casing from a law abiding citizen.

Except, of course, if this is spotted on school property and the officer suspects the driver might have a gun legally stored in the trunk in compliance with 269-10j

There was an amusing post on NES a few years ago from a member whose kid got the "I could arrest you for that" line of grief at a traffic stop for a bullet casing keyring. Naturally, being an NES member's kid, he or she (forget which) just happened to have an FID.

 

[namedpipes]

Yeah, beleive it or not, you can be arrested for driving without a license (MGL ch. 90, § 10) if you don't have your out-of-state license in possession. The police have no duty to look up an out-of-state license. Why that's the case in this day in age with computerized everything is beyond me.

Do they have the ability to do so? Like a phone call to a PD in the driver's home state?

Yes, I do realize the license also carries photo.