How many rounds is enough?

[xtry51]

We've had this numbers discussion before a lot of times before and the only real answer is "as much as you can afford, and spread it out geographically storage wise if possible."

People who don't train regularly and/or have never been in combat have a hard time understanding how quickly you can run through ammo. The U.S. Military arguably has the most sophisticated and effective logistics supply chain ever crafted by man. With that chain a rifleman carries at minimum 210 rounds (7 loaded mags). That means groups of well armed, well trained men who literally spend every waking hour of their lives focused on killing people understand 210 rounds is a MINIMUM ROUND COUNT for a GROUP of people to have a gunfight.

Think about that real hard. You don't have a supply chain. You most likely don't have a group of people who are very well supplied. How many "missions" can you have with the ammo you have on hand? How many fire teams (4 people) can you equip? Can you even supply a squad for one encounter? A squad is 3 fire teams. That's 12 people with 210rds MINIMUM. That's 2,520 rounds of ammo per mission.

 

[AllaSnackbah]

Your theory is ok for 1 engagement. What about the second, or third, or?

i dont know about you but i plan on avoiding any (fair) engagements i can. my post was in reference to a basic load out carried on person, hopefully having stored ammo for resupply on hand for later.

I'm not addressing anything other in this thread than the last line in this post, so try to stick with me on a side point here.

You need to seriously consider the mental/psychological aspect of carrying a 22LR and getting into a fire fight with someone shooting an AR15/AR10/AK.Even ignoring the penetration issues of what becomes cover vs concealment against 22LR, you need to consider the fear induced of being shot at by a large caliber rifle barking at you. Are you going to stay calm and collected enough to return fire knowing you're out gunned?

I can tell a difference when training if someone is using an AR10 and I'm using my 15. It's distracting even when you're fighting on the same side because you know that lead going down range is far more destructive.

This, throughout history it has been shown the guy who makes the bigger bang, the loudest war cry, the most intimidating posture, etc most usually comes out on top. Psychology plays a bigger part in war than most people think. I would be rather uncomfortable trying to convince undesirables not to **** with me while holding a gun which in the average person's eyes is barely a gun, one step above a pellet gun, a squirrel gun. Another example proving this is LEO officers who tell stories of why they like 12g shotguns so much, its the intimidation factor, I've heard multiple counts of officers who had problems getting compliance from a suspect through verbal command or even pointing a handgun at them, but when a shotgun is put in play, they get results. Intimidation/posture is important in armed conflict.

We've had this numbers discussion before a lot of times before and the only real answer is "as much as you can afford, and spread it out geographically storage wise if possible."

People who don't train regularly and/or have never been in combat have a hard time understanding how quickly you can run through ammo. The U.S. Military arguably has the most sophisticated and effective logistics supply chain ever crafted by man. With that chain a rifleman carries at minimum 210 rounds (7 loaded mags). That means groups of well armed, well trained men who literally spend every waking hour of their lives focused on killing people understand 210 rounds is a MINIMUM ROUND COUNT for a GROUP of people to have a gunfight.

Think about that real hard. You don't have a supply chain. You most likely don't have a group of people who are very well supplied. How many "missions" can you have with the ammo you have on hand? How many fire teams (4 people) can you equip? Can you even supply a squad for one encounter? A squad is 3 fire teams. That's 12 people with 210rds MINIMUM. That's 2,520 rounds of ammo per mission.

Great point, I hope I'm not being mistaken as saying all the prudent prepared individual needs in an event is just a basic load out. Obviously having ammunition stockpiled would be helpful not only for use, but also for trade, arming friends (scary thought) etc. That said, we are not the military, we are most likely, and hopefully not going to need that kind of firepower in a situation where law and order has broken down.

 

[xtry51]

To clarify by "mission" I don't mean LARPing through the woods looking for ISIS. I simply mean a goal, which can simply be just defending your house and property. Yes, it's prudent to avoid gunfights whenever at all possible, but sometimes trouble finds you. And if there ever is an actual SHTF scenario, trouble WILL find you.

 

[AllaSnackbah]

To clarify by "mission" I don't mean LARPing through the woods looking for ISIS. I simply mean a goal, which can simply be just defending your house and property. Yes, it's prudent to avoid gunfights whenever at all possible, but sometimes trouble finds you. And if there ever is an actual SHTF scenario, trouble WILL find you.

i know what you mean, and i agree. this thread is going off in so many different directions because some people envision "SHTF" as bugging out into the wilderness with a backpack and a rifle, some envision bugging out in a vehicle to a BOL, some envision building a militia and overthrowing .gov, some envision staying in their house and bugging in, and some envision building a community of like minded people to take care of problems as they come and just try to help each other get by, and some are too busy worrying about having the right permit to even envision SHTF. (sorry i had to)

 

[jibbr71]

i know what you mean, and i agree. this thread is going off in so many different directions because some people envision "SHTF" as bugging out into the wilderness with a backpack and a rifle, some envision bugging out in a vehicle to a BOL, some envision building a militia and overthrowing .gov, some envision staying in their house and bugging in, and some envision building a community of like minded people to take care of problems as they come and just try to help each other get by.

I'll take door #5.

I'm putting up as much as I can afford, and I train with my shit so that if God forbid I ever have to use it, I'll be able to in the most efficient manner possible. That being said, also working with friends near and far to help all of us cover as many bases as possible. Wolverines!!

 

[ChevyGuy91]

i know what you mean, and i agree. this thread is going off in so many different directions because some people envision "SHTF" as bugging out into the wilderness with a backpack and a rifle, some envision bugging out in a vehicle to a BOL, some envision building a militia and overthrowing .gov, some envision staying in their house and bugging in, and some envision building a community of like minded people to take care of problems as they come and just try to help each other get by.

I stack ammo because I like getting together to with you dudes to make dick and fag jokes.

 

[jibbr71]

I stack ammo because I like getting together to with you dudes to make dick and fag jokes.

Well there's that too.

 

[AllaSnackbah]

I stack ammo because I like getting together to with you dudes to make dick and fag jokes.

as long as you dont make fun of my pants you know I'm down. lol

 

[xtry51]

as long as you dont make fun of my pants you know I'm down. lol

I thought the idea he was getting at was no pants?

 

[ChevyGuy91]

as long as you dont make fun of my pants you know I'm down. lol

I am trying so hard to screen shot that video, but my damn internet is useless.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

 

[Cloverleaf Firearms Group]

I don't even stack ammo.

 

[AllaSnackbah]

oh god...

 

[Cloverleaf Firearms Group]

oh god...

You don't even love me enough to cover me

 

[xtry51]

You will dude, you will.

If you want to stack more ammo, gotta reload. I haven't purchased commercial loaded .223 ammo since 2011.

 

[AllaSnackbah]

You don't even love me enough to cover me

sorry bro priorities.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

You don't even love me enough to cover me

ANNND IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIeeeeeeeeeeeeIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII.......

 

[xtry51]

ANNND IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIeeeeeeeeeeeeIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII.......

 

[ChevyGuy91]

https://instagram.com/p/7gN9o8uyqW/

 

[spt_1955]

Part of the problem in MA is that everyone waits for everyone else to be the one to stand up first. I've already been there, done that, and ended up more than slightly frustrated over the lack of participation, etc. Everyone in MA loves to bitch but then can't be bothered trying to change it. Some even laugh at those who try. I gave up trying.

I gave up in 1975. Not much worth overthrowing the government for after that.

 

[spt_1955]

I was just using those numbers to show that it's not hard to reach large numbers of consumption.

Yep... bought a case of 9MM from my favorite online retailer just to back me up when I don't have time to reload. 6 weeks later I went to grab a coupe of boxes because I had shot 2 days in a row and did not have time to reload for the next day... there were only 2 boxes left... where the F--k does it go?

 

[Chevy 2 65]

Yep... bought a case of 9MM from my favorite online retailer just to back me up when I don't have time to reload. 6 weeks later I went to grab a coupe of boxes because I had shot 2 days in a row and did not have time to reload for the next day... there were only 2 boxes left... where the F--k does it go?

It goes down range

 

[bigblue]

This thread just went gayer than a bag of dicks.

 

[ChevyGuy91]

This thread just went gayer than a bag of dicks.

It went gay when a question was asked about storing ammo for SHTF and people started tripping over themselves make sure everyone was in compliance with some retarded law or ordinance or permit or wtf it is.

 

[spt_1955]

i know what you mean, and i agree. this thread is going off in so many different directions because some people envision "SHTF" as bugging out into the wilderness with a backpack and a rifle, some envision bugging out in a vehicle to a BOL, some envision building a militia and overthrowing .gov, some envision staying in their house and bugging in, and some envision building a community of like minded people to take care of problems as they come and just try to help each other get by, and some are too busy worrying about having the right permit to even envision SHTF. (sorry i had to)

Dude, if you don't have the right permit you cannot legally prepare for SHTF. and if you get caught breaking the law in this state ... they take your guns ... then SHTF will not matter because you'll be one of the victims. Plus everybody is talking about needing ammo to fight when SHTF ... I think it will be more important for barter.

 

[bigblue]

It went gay when a question was asked about storing ammo for SHTF and people started tripping over themselves make sure everyone was in compliance with some retarded law or ordinance or permit or wtf it is.

If he were in a free state that would not be part of the discussion. Living in a Communist country (state) comes with sacrifices.

- - - Updated - - -

Dude, if you don't have the right permit you cannot legally prepare for SHTF. and if you get caught breaking the law in this state ... they take your guns ... then SHTF will not matter because you'll be one of the victims. Plus everybody is talking about needing ammo to fight when SHTF ... I think it will be more important for barter.

Wait, so you plan to trade away ammo to a person who may turn around and use it to shoot you then take their own shit back?

 

[ChevyGuy91]

If he were in a free state that would not be part of the discussion. Living in a Communist country (state) comes with sacrifices.

He also stated that he was moving out of MA, so...

 

[spt_1955]

If he were in a free state that would not be part of the discussion. Living in a Communist country (state) comes with sacrifices.

- - - Updated - - -




Wait, so you plan to trade away ammo to a person who may turn around and use it to shoot you then take their own shit back?

(a) SO when did this thread turn into a rant against the government? and (b) can you point to when "people started tripping over themselves".

 

[ChevyGuy91]

(a) SO when did this thread turn into a rant against the government? and (b) can you point to when "people started tripping over themselves".

I think you meant to quote me, so I will take this one.

(a) When I pointed out that our forefathers hated us for being concerned about an arbitrary limit on ammo. and (b) post 5, and then 16, and then...

 

[spt_1955]

I think you meant to quote me, so I will take this one.

(a) When I pointed out that our forefathers hated us for being concerned about an arbitrary limit on ammo. and (b) post 5, and then 16, and then...

All I know is that I responded to a specific post that said "You cant do that in this state.. the law says 10,000" with "no big deal just get a permit at the fire department" and suddenly I got flamed for being some sort of pocket communist that empowers all the corrupt nepotistic government employees sucking the lifeblood out of all us courageous freedom fighters by contributing my $25.