If you enjoy the forum please consider supporting it by signing up for a NES Membership The benefits pay for the membership many times over.
The information presented in the article seems to suggest that it wasn't an issue of payment.So she turned down a lesbian wedding cake and they made it sound like it was due to them being lesbians. Maybe it was due to what they wanted on the cake. Or that they couldn't complete it in the time given. Or maybe the lesbians wanted to pay less than it would cost to make the damned cake. I wouldn't put that past them.
In May, because of their religious beliefs, the Kleins turned down a request from a lesbian couple, Rachel Cryer and Laurel Bowmann, to bake a cake for their upcoming wedding.
However, those folks who are turned down should have the right to voice their story, and allow the market to dictate the future of the business, right?I suspect they turned down the work for valid reasons, and in a non-offensive way...
Maybe we should send flintoid over to the [lesbian couple's] wedding...
- - - Updated - - -
IMO, turning down a commission/job over religious reasons is 100% valid. You won't see a kosher catering service serving pork.
Yup, that's how I see it. Now, involving the state labor bureau crosses the line, but if I'm reading the article correctly, the state hasn't taken any action yet. So far all the results are just customers voting with their wallets.However, those folks who are turned down should have the right to voice their story, and allow the market to dictate the future of the business, right?
From the looks of it, the business turned down the request, the clients brought their story public, and the business had to close down because of their place in the public space.
If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen... or move your kitchen to home.
This.Actually, if the couple wasn't looking for $50,000 in damages (according to the article), I'd consider this more of the free market causing the business to close. The business owners should have the right to refuse service if they choose to, however they will have to deal with the consequences of that decision. In this case it caused customers to cancel their orders, new customers to look elsewhere and business associates to rethink their business relationship with this particular business. Because of the drop in revenue from losing business, this business is going under.
If the government rules in favor of the couple, it will be setting the precedent that if someone comes to your business seeking service, you are required to serve them.
Pretty sure they took exception to the lesbian couple getting married part. I bet if it was for a different event (b-day, etc.) there would have been zero issue...The owner sounds like an idiot. Show me in the bible where it says to not sell cakes or anything to homosexuals. The bible does however say lots of things that no one follows:
they have every right not to make the cake, the gays have every right to orchestrate boycotts and give them bad pressI don't agree with their decision to turn down a client just because they are gay, but don't they have the right to refuse service for any reason? Did they come out and straight say we don't serve gays?
The owners are stupid for doing it and the people that are now calling them names and hate mail is hilariously ironic.
No argument here. My opinion would be exactly the same though: private businesses have the ability to make their own decisions regarding their business and apparently only the government, fueled by special interest groups and lobbyists can say otherwise. If I opened a bakery (I have considered it, tbh) and I decided I didn't want to sell my product to someone for any reason, their options are to find another place to buy that product or don't buy the product, my reasons are my own and this bakery should have kept their reasons to themselves.
Man wtf was this, one long a$$ run on sentence? Let people run their business the way they want. That is like a store that sells everything for just left handed people and you are a right handed person, are you going to go and complain and moan about it?my mom and i bake and decorate cakes as a hobby for friends and friends of friends. more than once we have been asked to make a cake for a friend who was either a) marrying somebody they should not (i.e. scumbag, gold digger), b) had a teenaged daughter who was having a baby, c) decided to use FONDANT (so freaking gross) etc etc. it was distasteful to us, and totally against our beliefs (seriously guys, fondant is disgusting), but we did it because that is what was expected of us and we enjoy making and decorating cakes.
this woman runs a cake business. she is already a sell out. i am pretty sure her religion objects to having babies out of wedlock, but i would guess she never bothered to ask every person getting a cake for a baby shower if the parents were married. i bet she's also against divorce, but i know every bakery i have been to (or worked at) has done "congratulations on your divorce!" cakes. i also know that my white aunt and black uncle got some flak when they were going around looking for cakes for their wedding, but the really professional places did not give a crap. it is a business.
basically, my view is that if she is so set in beliefs laid down by her religion, there would have been many other stories before this one. it seems to me that something was different this time and she outright told these women that she thought their marriage was wrong. unless she pulls she same crap on everyone who is not "perfect and right" in the eyes of the church, it's not cool of her to do it to just them.
not that i think it would be OK to treat everyone like crap. but i've always felt you cant' just pick and choose what things of your religion to follow. if she wants to use her religion as an excuse for this, she needs to carry around stones to throw at girls who have premarital sex, etc
blah blah if she was refusing service to mixed race couples nobody would bat an eye at the place closing down as a result, yadda yadda
my two cents, for what it's worth.