im a college student and was wondering if it is lawful to leave my pistol locked up in the car when im in school? I haven't take it yet because im not sure if it is legal for me to leave it locked away in the car on a campus at all...Does anyone know?
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gun on school property??
- Thread starter 6shootR
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Notice how jdubois says "not in violation". In practice, expect to be in a world of chit if someone knows you have it locked in your car.
![[wink]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/002.gif "Wink [wink]")
The net is, it's legal but not necessarily advisable.
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Yes, however:
1. The fact that it is legal does not preclude the school from imposing sanctions other than prosecution
2. Do not expect campus police (generally sworn police in MA) to be cognizant as to the nuance of 10j, or of the fact that the courts have held that a differences in wording within different sections of the same law are to be construed as having meaning.
3. Be aware that successfully arguing that what you did is legal (which should be possible provided you can afford it) (a) Does not free you from the lifetime obligation to report the arrest on future LTC applications and (b) Does not assure that the issuing chief in your current or future town will not use the arrest as an indication you are not a "suitable person to be so licensed."
4. Do NOT drive to campus and then move the gun to storage in your trunk or locked case, as the handling of the gun would be "on your person" and place you inviolation. DO remember than a remark like "I put it in the case before getting out to go to the building" can give enough evidence for a conviction when there was no otherwise provable violation of MGL.
5. Do be aware of the practical complications of reporting a stolen car, or gun stolen from a car, to responding police whose training on 269/10j consists solely of "it's illegal for non-police to have guns on campus".
6. Expect that it will take a court order to get campus police to return your gun, and they may refuse on the basis of having no obligation to meet you off campus, and no legal way for you to transport it from their station to your car.
7. Do not expect your attorney to be aware of the "on one's person" limitation of 269/10j unless the name is something like Langer, Arbabi, Cohen or Macnutt. Unless you get a specialist gun attorney, expect your attorney to tell you the CWOF+court costs+forfeiture of the gun you are being offered after expen$ive negotiation is a "good deal you should take".
1. The fact that it is legal does not preclude the school from imposing sanctions other than prosecution
2. Do not expect campus police (generally sworn police in MA) to be cognizant as to the nuance of 10j, or of the fact that the courts have held that a differences in wording within different sections of the same law are to be construed as having meaning.
3. Be aware that successfully arguing that what you did is legal (which should be possible provided you can afford it) (a) Does not free you from the lifetime obligation to report the arrest on future LTC applications and (b) Does not assure that the issuing chief in your current or future town will not use the arrest as an indication you are not a "suitable person to be so licensed."
4. Do NOT drive to campus and then move the gun to storage in your trunk or locked case, as the handling of the gun would be "on your person" and place you inviolation. DO remember than a remark like "I put it in the case before getting out to go to the building" can give enough evidence for a conviction when there was no otherwise provable violation of MGL.
5. Do be aware of the practical complications of reporting a stolen car, or gun stolen from a car, to responding police whose training on 269/10j consists solely of "it's illegal for non-police to have guns on campus".
6. Expect that it will take a court order to get campus police to return your gun, and they may refuse on the basis of having no obligation to meet you off campus, and no legal way for you to transport it from their station to your car.
7. Do not expect your attorney to be aware of the "on one's person" limitation of 269/10j unless the name is something like Langer, Arbabi, Cohen or Macnutt. Unless you get a specialist gun attorney, expect your attorney to tell you the CWOF+court costs+forfeiture of the gun you are being offered after expen$ive negotiation is a "good deal you should take".
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Justification? It's called "inventory" of the property in the car. Every PD does this on a police tow.
School rules/policy always will nail your a** to a wall if found out in any way whatsoever. Count on being expelled from the college and being blackballed wrt going to any other college in MA.
Bruff, I'm going to let someone who is a FT PO currently answer your question wrt a "police tow" directly as it's been so long since I was involved in that sort of thing that the rules may have changed.
If you park in a business parking lot and the business owner has you towed, the police aren't involved and I doubt anyone will inventory what was in the car. If something becomes missing upon retrieval it becomes "he said, she said" with an uncertain outcome.
If the police order your car towed, they want to cover themselves legally wrt being accused of stealing something from the car, so I would "expect" them to inventory the car before handing it off to the tow truck driver. Policies in different places may differ, thus I'd prefer a current PO answer this one more precisely.
If you park in a business parking lot and the business owner has you towed, the police aren't involved and I doubt anyone will inventory what was in the car. If something becomes missing upon retrieval it becomes "he said, she said" with an uncertain outcome.
If the police order your car towed, they want to cover themselves legally wrt being accused of stealing something from the car, so I would "expect" them to inventory the car before handing it off to the tow truck driver. Policies in different places may differ, thus I'd prefer a current PO answer this one more precisely.
However, in the last week the SJC rendered a decision overturning the opening of a "locked" container during an inventory search; the implication, I gather, is the the unopened container should have been logged as the inventoried item. Interesting implication for those lockable steel pistol boxes.
Check your school policies. I can almost guarantee that they already have a rule concerning guns on campus and that you would get expelled.
I would expect that if my car was towed by a towing company (rather than as a result of a police action), that the towing company drone would use a slim-jim to open the door, and then help himself to anything valuable in the car.
Just to be completely clear, if you haven't gotten the idea already, leaving a gun in your car on school campus is not a particularly good idea.
tuna
NES Member
Is it always a school, even at night?
I know this sounds stupid, but I remember getting a class at a school in Belchertown in order to hunt the Quabbin. The class was at 8 or 9 PM IIRC.
No one from Fish and Wildlife ever said anything about firearms not being allowed in / at the school, but it was made clear that anyone caught smoking in the parking lot would lose their hunting license. It still makes no sense.
And no, I figured if I wasn't going to risk a cigarette, I'm WAY too chicken to risk CCW.
I know this sounds stupid, but I remember getting a class at a school in Belchertown in order to hunt the Quabbin. The class was at 8 or 9 PM IIRC.
No one from Fish and Wildlife ever said anything about firearms not being allowed in / at the school, but it was made clear that anyone caught smoking in the parking lot would lose their hunting license. It still makes no sense.
And no, I figured if I wasn't going to risk a cigarette, I'm WAY too chicken to risk CCW.
Yes, it is still a school even when school is out of session. MGL Chapter 269 Section 10j does not have an exception for when school is out of session.
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Since we're on the subject - what defines "school grounds?" For example, the building that I work in has one floor (of many) that has some administrative office space for a local college. Is the entire building a "school" or just that floor?
What about urban areas with extended campuses? (BU for instance - seems like half of Boston is BU property....)
What about urban areas with extended campuses? (BU for instance - seems like half of Boston is BU property....)
A number of years back, I hired an attorney to research that very subject. The statute does not elucidate your question and he was unable to find any precedents. Anyone volunteers to be the test case?
