Getting stopped with gun in trunk-Hypothetical

[News Shooter]

I know you are not required in MA to notify a cop that you are carrying or have a properly stored gun in the car, but...

Suppose you are stopped, the cop knows you have an LTC and asks if you are carrying. You reply that the gun is unloaded and in the locked trunk (and in my case also locked in a safe).

Does that answer constitute probably cause for him to search the car?

If he asks to see it should the answer be NO?

 

[Len-2A Training]

No probable cause!

NO! is the correct answer, although my response would be "certainly, as soon as you show me a search warrant" - it is the most correct and polite response you can give.

If I was asked "are you carrying" and I was NOT CCW'g but had a gun in the trunk, the proper response is NO! If asked "are there any guns in the car?", my response (in that case) would be "yes sir, unloaded and locked in the trunk". If asked to show them, I'd ask for the above-mentioned search warrant.

Always be polite and cooperative (within what the law allows).

From 25 years of being involved in LE, my experience has been (for MA only, other states especially down South are very different):

- Car stops, officers want everyone to stay in the car without doing any "furtive movements". [It is a lot safer for the officer, that's why we don't "remove" people from the car without back-up AND a damn good reason (silver bracelets to follow).]

- Only time that an officer will ask you to step out of the car is when he/she intends to arrest.

- After an arrest the officer can do an "inventory search" of the vehicle prior to having it towed away.

 

[bpm990d]

The thing to do is answer the question.

Q: Are you CCW now?
A: No

To say you have a gun in the trunk is providing information that was not asked or for.

As for probable cause, I doubt it unless the officer thinks a non sequitur answers is enough for him to think you are on something or being evasive. How that would hold up I don't know.

I would politely decline showing it to him.

YMMV

B

 

[M1911]

Suppose you are stopped, the cop knows you have an LTC and asks if you are carrying. You reply that the gun is unloaded and in the locked trunk (and in my case also locked in a safe).

If there is a gun in the trunk, then you aren't carrying, so the correct answer would be "no."

That said, I doubt a MA police officer would ask you if you were "carrying." The officer might ask if you have any guns, knives, or drugs. That's a very different question than "are you carrying." If you had a gun in the trunk, then the correct answer would be as LenS suggested, that you have an unloaded gun locked in the trunk.

I've been stopped once in MA while I was carrying. He didn't ask about guns and I didn't volunteer. He let me off with a warning for 42 mph in a 25 zone. My lucky day...

 

[digitech]

When they run your info does the computer tell them you have a LTC?

 

[Len-2A Training]

digitech, no not unless they bring up a special query screen. Something that they won't do on a simple traffic stop.

I've been stopped for speeding twice while CCW'g (back in the 1980s, once on Rte. 3 Boston, other time Rt. 16 Newton). No mention of it and no questions. No harm, no foul.

I stopped an officer one night for blowing a red light on US-1. I saw the stripe down the side of the trousers. Never asked if he was carrying (and he didn't flash a badge either), again not relevant. Ran him, handed his papers back to him and told him to be more careful.

 

[doobie]

I've always figured it would go like this:

LEO: Are you CCW'ing?
Me: (yes or no as appropriate)
-> If yes I would have my hands on the wheel at ALL times unless responding to a question of his and my wallet would be out of my pocket before he came to the window, with my drivers license and registration in my hand.

LEO: Do you have a gun in the vehicle?
Me: (yes or no as appropriate)

LEO: Can I search the car?
Me: Am I under arrest?

LEO: No
Me: Do you have a search warrant?

LEO: No
Me: What is your have probable cause to search this vehicle?

LEO: ....
Me: I'm very sorry I am unable to allow you to search this vehicle without a warrant or valid probable cause

LEO: Damn lawyers!
Me: Am I free to go?

 

[doobie]

Is OC considered CCW? Or does a LEO have to specifically ask about OC?

 

[P-14]

Any guns or drugs in the car?

A co-worker of mine who does not own a gun was stopped for speeding by Cambridge PD and asked, "Any guns or drugs in the car?" Just a vague enough question to catch the CCW or the locked gun in the trunk.

In my case, the answer to the drugs question would be NO! But, depending on the day with the LTC-A ALP, how should we answer the gun part of the question? Can they search me and the car after I answer?

All thoughts on this are appreciated!

 

[doobie]

Actually, is it better to say "Yes I'm carrying a gun" or hand them your LTC-A ALP if asked if I had any guns on me or in the car before saying anything?

 

[digitech]

I have a good one for you. It happened to a good friend of mine on the way home after shooting.

Ma State Trooper: walks up to the car at about 2:00am after stopping him for speeding on the way home.

Trooper: looks in the back seat and sees used targets full of holes and 5.56 brass all over the floor.

Trooper: Asks driver if there are any weapons in the car.

Driver: yes officer there is a Sig 226 on my right hip and two spare magazines on my left, and a AR15 in the case in the back. Would you like to see my permit.

Trooper: No you have a good night now.

Trooper: gets in car and drives away.

 

[M1911]

Actually, is it better to say "Yes I'm carrying a gun" or hand them your LTC-A ALP if asked if I had any guns on me or in the car before saying anything?

I would NOT bring it up unless asked (or in a jurisdiction that requires it). If asked and currently carrying, I strongly suggest that you do NOT say "I have a gun." I recommend that you follow Ayoob's advice and instead say: "I have a license to carry and I am carrying now. How would you like to proceed."

If you say "I have a gun" the officer isn't going to hear anything you say after "gun".

 

[RKG]

I have a good one for you. It happened to a good friend of mine on the way home after shooting.

Ma State Trooper: walks up to the car at about 2:00am after stopping him for speeding on the way home.

Trooper: looks in the back seat and sees used targets full of holes and 5.56 brass all over the floor.

Trooper: Asks driver if there are any weapons in the car.

Driver: yes officer there is a Sig 226 on my right hip and two spare magazines on my left, and a AR15 in the case in the back. Would you like to see my permit.

Trooper: No you have a good night now.

Trooper: gets in car and drives away.

Not trying to play "one up," but following is true story:

Also stopped for speeding in ME.

After taking OL, going back to cruiser, and writing, Trooper walked up to my window and handed me written warning.

Put car in gear and got maybe 10 feet when it dawned on me that he had forgotten to give me back my OL.

Back in park, exited car, with M19 in pancake holster in plain view. Walked back to cruiser and said, "I think you still have my license?"

He looks under the clip of the tag pad, finds license, and hands to me, all the while eyeballing the revolver.

Walked back to the car and drove away.

He never asked anything about the revolver and I never volunteered anything.