Gardner PD Confiscates Guns & Ammo

[Enzo]

In 2015, Gardner LTC holder is given an appointment to renew his LTC a week after the expiration date. Goes to the appointment and told not allowed to have guns and ammo because his LTC is now expired!
Guns & ammo seized. Eventually returned but not mags pre 1994.

http://www.telegram.com/news/20171026/gardner-gun-owner-sues-police-over-seizure-of-firearms

 

[Lowbird]

There was a Comm2a thread on this somewhere.
Glad he got most of his shit back. Hope those responsible are gone when I go for renewal in a few months. Or they've pulled their heads out of there collective asses.

 

[Knuckle Dragger]

This has been an ongoing problem with the Gardner Police Department and one officer in particular. Storm is the second case we've brought. See this thread for the history.

Discovery took longer than anticipated.

We're aware of other incidents as well.....

 

[noxin]

I just heard of a guy who, due to crazy bitch syndrome, had all his stuff and ltc yanked due to a restraining order on a Friday/Saturday. Reportedly the RO was rescinded on Monday in court when the officer escorting the victim (guy) to get the child backed up the victim's statement.

Gardner PD has dicked this guy around for months about getting his LTC and his stuff back. Certainly seems like Gardner PD needs to get beaten about the ****ing head.

 

[Len-2A Training]

This has been an ongoing problem with the Gardner Police Department and one officer in particular. Storm is the second case we've brought. See this thread for the history.

Discovery took longer than anticipated.

We're aware of other incidents as well.....

Can you class action this? Or add other plaintiffs to show it as a pattern?

Good luck to Steve, the victim of theft and Comm2A on this case!

 

[Knuckle Dragger]

Can you class action this? Or add other plaintiffs to show it as a pattern?

Good luck to Steve, the victim of theft and Comm2A on this case!

No we can't. While the cases are similar and have similar sets of circumstances, the actual facts are each different. Discovery and motions would be a mess if we tried to combine cases. If we interpleaded new plaintiffs we'd have to start all over again with an amended complaint.

At the end, the real issue is is whether the plaintiffs are entitled to any type of injunctive or declaratory relief. Because the plaintiffs have their licenses, guns, etc. back, the town will want to moot the cases. Increasingly that's the battle that needs to be fought. The tendency of the court is to say because this is gun or the Second Amendment, (e.g. a lesser right), the voluntary cessation doctrine shouldn't apply

 

[Frizzle Fry]

Gardner is awful. My father struggled to get a license living there in the late 70s as a LEO (had to have his chief meet with their chief). They've been pulling shit like this for years, and worse. Bad news.

 

[Asaltweapon]

Just wow!! What a bunch of douche nozzles

 

[GlockJock]

The Cliff Notes/ Quick Moral of Story:
In Massachusetts, the "average citizen" gun owner (actually not just gun owners. ANY average citizen) should never never never never never never never NEVER trust ANYTHING that any police, any law enforcement, any dot.gov, any office, anyone in "authority", anyone in power in any town, city, county, or statewide tells you.

Never.

 

[BenDover]

So the police can effectively revoke your LTC (and confiscate your guns) in MA by simply not giving you an appointment to renew your LTC?

Sounds like a banana republic where the state claims that all it citizens have a right to self defense publicly, but confiscates guns from its citizens by not having anyone available to make LTC appointments. Unless of course you are wealthy, well connected, or important.

 

[EJFudd]

At least his guns didn't disappear into one of our illustrious Massachusetts "bonded warehouses" never to be seen again. Yes, he lost his pre-bans and ammo but it could have been a whole lot worse. What a crazy town. What a crazy state.

Let this be a lesson to us all. Apply for renewal well before your expiration day... many months before!!! And if it somehow slips your mind, bring your **** to some other licensed friend's or relative's house, preferably out of this crazy nanny state.

 

[PaulR]

In 2015, Gardner LTC holder is given an appointment to renew his LTC a week after the expiration date. Goes to the appointment and told not allowed to have guns and ammo because his LTC is now expired!
Guns & ammo seized. Eventually returned but not mags pre 1994.

http://www.telegram.com/news/20171026/gardner-gun-owner-sues-police-over-seizure-of-firearms

Wow, just wow.
Unreal that the police would do that to a law-abiding citizen. There must be an ulterior motive........or as above, the cops in question are absolute a%%holes.

 

[caboose84]

I thought if you had filed your renewal application in MA- you had a grace period.

You couldn't carry or purchase anything after the expiration- but as long as they were properly stored at home you couldn't be charged? Or was an expired LTC a defense against illegal possession only?

It's a real dick move by the PD against a law abiding person.

 

[Len-2A Training]

I thought if you had filed your renewal application in MA- you had a grace period.

You couldn't carry or purchase anything after the expiration- but as long as they were properly stored at home you couldn't be charged? Or was an expired LTC a defense against illegal possession only?

It's a real dick move by the PD against a law abiding person.

Prior to the 2014 law change, you only had a 90 day grace period IFF you applied before expiration. Many times applicants were NOT given any proof of their application.

As of the law change in 2014, if you apply (and PD processes you on MIRCS) prior to expiration your grace period is infinite. In this case yes you can carry (if expired is unrestricted) and purchase/sell guns under MGL. If you apply after expiration, you still have a 90 day grace period but can not buy/sell anything (uncertain about carry).

An expired LTC makes it a NON-criminal offense to possess or carry without a valid LTC. It is simply a civil fine and I've been told by the gurus in LE that the courts won't even hear those cases. That said, I testified in such a criminal case and am aware that some DAs and police are criminally prosecuting those with expired LTCs. If they have a court-appointed attorney, chance of conviction is high as they usually have no idea of the exemption and do not take the time to study the law for their clients (from personal experience in the case I was involved with).

All this said, since the PD is the cause of the delay, no sane PD would confiscate as they will look like a horse's ass when questioned by competent counsel in court. Even if a PD ran over the 90 days, 99.9999% of PDs wouldn't do anything as the reason for the delay is always due to police in-action.

 

[cthorne98]

I just renewed and was told I was good to go since I renewed prior to expiration. Was given a receipt as proof with all the DCJIS info filled out.

On the very bottom is printed

chapter 284 of the acts of 2014 sec 36 and 54 creates a indefinite grace period for those who submit renewal applications prior to expiration.
The current card /license will remain valid after expiration until application is either approved or denied


BTW this was not in Gardner

 

[drgrant]

Gardner is awful. My father struggled to get a license living there in the late 70s as a LEO (had to have his chief meet with their chief). They've been pulling shit like this for years, and worse. Bad news.

A friend of mine, his 70+ year old mother got B-rammed by them several years ago (when the B still existed) I was taken aback. I think they even lied to her and told her that she could carry a revolver on it. That town has always been shifty and ****ed up WRT licensing.

-Mike

 

[rep308]

This is why my wife and kids also have their LTC's, each with a different year of expiration.

Time to donate to Comm2A again

 

[Knuckle Dragger]

A friend of mine, his 70+ year old mother got B-rammed by them several years ago (when the B still existed) I was taken aback. I think they even lied to her and told her that she could carry a revolver on it. That town has always been shifty and ****ed up WRT licensing.

-Mike

^It's not unreasonable for them to come to that conclusion. During Hightower litigation the way the Commonwealth or Bosotn was trying to duck the carry issue was by implying that someone could openly carry a revolver with an LTC-B

This is why my wife and kids also have their LTC's, each with a different year of expiration.

Time to donate to Comm2A again

I've always said that everyone in a gun owning household should have a license. Preferably and LTC. These days, it might make sense to have BOTH and LTC and FID.

 

[namedpipes]

... These days, it might make sense to have BOTH and LTC and FID.

Please elucidate?

The street advice here on NES lately has been to get your LTC-A and not bother with FID. At least that's my recollection.

(Not disputing your comment, just trying to find out if I'm remembering incorrectly or just hearing bad advice)

 

[JayMcB]

The economics of this can be fear inspiring.

My standing goal is to have >1000 rounds of each caliber I shoot.

Some of the specialized calibers like .30-06 for my Garand, 50BMG match stuff, 6.5CM, etc. - are quite expensive.

I'd literally be out thousands of dollars if they took and kept my ammunition, with some of it being a stock built over years and quite difficult and expensive to replace

 

[noxin]

I just renewed and was told I was good to go since I renewed prior to expiration. Was given a receipt as proof with all the DCJIS info filled out.

On the very bottom is printed

chapter 284 of the acts of 2014 sec 36 and 54 creates a indefinite grace period for those who submit renewal applications prior to expiration.
The current card /license will remain valid after expiration until application is either approved or denied


BTW this was not in Gardner

Your department did it right by entering it in mircs and giving you the reciept. Gardner didn't accept the application from the guy and wouldn't until his appointment after the expiration date.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

 

[Garys]

I got one of those too when I renewed a few weeks ago. I was told that the only thing that I might not be able to do was buy from a FFL. That's the option of the shop, not the law. Hopefully it won't be an issue and I'll have my renewal before that.

I just renewed and was told I was good to go since I renewed prior to expiration. Was given a receipt as proof with all the DCJIS info filled out.

On the very bottom is printed

chapter 284 of the acts of 2014 sec 36 and 54 creates a indefinite grace period for those who submit renewal applications prior to expiration.
The current card /license will remain valid after expiration until application is either approved or denied


BTW this was not in Gardner

 

[Coyote33]

I just renewed and was told I was good to go since I renewed prior to expiration. Was given a receipt as proof with all the DCJIS info filled out.

On the very bottom is printed

chapter 284 of the acts of 2014 sec 36 and 54 creates a indefinite grace period for those who submit renewal applications prior to expiration.
The current card /license will remain valid after expiration until application is either approved or denied


BTW this was not in Gardner

Your department did it right by entering it in mircs and giving you the receipt. Gardner didn't accept the application from the guy and wouldn't until his appointment after the expiration date.

Just pointing out that maybe people should request their department please put this in MIRCS, and give them the receipt. Show them that you understand the process, and want to follow it, holding them accountable.

 

[firestorm]

Just pointing out that maybe people should request their department please put this in MIRCS, and give them the receipt. Show them that you understand the process, and want to follow it, holding them accountable.

The departments that will screw someone like this don't care that you know the process, they hold all the cards. They are delaying you because they want to make it miserable for gun owners here. If they have to put it into MIRCS they can't delay you another few weeks by having it sit on someone's desk before they bother to put it through. Do you really think they give appointments 6+ months from when you call because they can't have someone sit with you for 5 minutes and type in the info?

 

[boiler_eng]

The departments that will screw someone like this don't care that you know the process, they hold all the cards. They are delaying you because they want to make it miserable for gun owners here. If they have to put it into MIRCS they can't delay you another few weeks by having it sit on someone's desk before they bother to put it through. Do you really think they give appointments 6+ months from when you call because they can't have someone sit with you for 5 minutes and type in the info?

Yeah I called my licensing officer on a Thursday afternoon and he got me in on a cancellation spot he had the following Tuesday. He also just got up in the middle of the appointment, walked to the printer, and handed me the receipt the explained it.

It's totally within their control how they manage the process of doing the licensing.

Sent from my XT1650 using Tapatalk

 

[Horrible]

I wonder what would happen if the right to vote was treated in the same manner as 2A. Such bullshit!

 

[noxin]

I got one of those too when I renewed a few weeks ago. I was told that the only thing that I might not be able to do was buy from a FFL. That's the option of the shop, not the law. Hopefully it won't be an issue and I'll have my renewal before that.

Every sale is at the option of the shop.

 

[Coyote33]

The departments that will screw someone like this don't care that you know the process, they hold all the cards. They are delaying you because they want to make it miserable for gun owners here. If they have to put it into MIRCS they can't delay you another few weeks by having it sit on someone's desk before they bother to put it through. Do you really think they give appointments 6+ months from when you call because they can't have someone sit with you for 5 minutes and type in the info?

Yeah I called my licensing officer on a Thursday afternoon and he got me in on a cancellation spot he had the following Tuesday. He also just got up in the middle of the appointment, walked to the printer, and handed me the receipt the explained it.

It's totally within their control how they manage the process of doing the licensing.

I wonder what would happen if the right to vote was treated in the same manner as 2A. Such bullshit!

Every sale is at the option of the shop.

This is when you bring it to the attention of your Board of Selectmen. If that doesn't work, then write your local papers or run against them!

 

[jayhitek]

I'm shocked at how scummy Gardner PD is. Pretty crappy.

 

[HiCap]

More protecting and serving. Comical at all the "III%" folks who believe the police will be on their side when the time comes to round up the guns...