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First pistol buy for 2018. Maybe!
- Thread starter smokingbarrel
- Start date
E.Stoner
NES Member
Do you want a shooter or a Gucci gun? For another 200-300 you could make that used Sig just as bit as nice a shooter as the Legion.
Legions are really nice guns, I have a couple, but it's an aesthetic choice. Any p22x can be made to perform/out perform a legion with a 30 dollar SRT and lighter mainspring and a little love. Sights and grips will add much more. The GGI trigger is nice, but not the unicorn everyone makes it out to be, I have left it out of my carry/home defense Sigs.
Legions are really nice guns, I have a couple, but it's an aesthetic choice. Any p22x can be made to perform/out perform a legion with a 30 dollar SRT and lighter mainspring and a little love. Sights and grips will add much more. The GGI trigger is nice, but not the unicorn everyone makes it out to be, I have left it out of my carry/home defense Sigs.
smokingbarrel
NES Member
You make a great point which I also considered after looking through video and other forums. Thank for your input sir.
E.Stoner
NES Member
FWIW. One of the first guns I bought was a plain-jane p229 that I ended up fully kitting out, it's still one of my all time favorite shooters. Sig actions definitely smooth out with use so the used gun will probably be nicely broken in!
Can't go wrong either way!
quinnjalan
NES Member
I second GoodWillHunting. I picked up a 226 that had a SRT kit installed and the internals polished. I recently did a complete disassembled, new spring kit and Gray Gun trigger. It runs like a champ and feels even better. It would be nice to have a Legion but I’m holding out for an STI. If I’m going to shell out big bucks for a production gun it will be a great shooter out of the box!
![[thumbsup]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/044.gif "Thumbs Up [thumbsup]")
Sparky123
NES Member
There's no way you will ever find a legion for anywhere near $600 bucks. But if you feel you really want to spend the extra cash then buy the used Sig P-229 and several thousand rounds of ammo. Yep ! That's would I would do.
smokingbarrel
NES Member
Yeah i know the cheapest i found a legion so far is 1200 and some change
Sparky123
NES Member
Hey ! You will never regret buying a used Sig P-229 because those pistols are built to last a lifetime. I've had the P-229, 226, 225 and the P-239, all in 9mm and none have ever fail me.
I think it was the early ones that had problems. I've had mine almost a year and its fine. Its funny how dry the pistol comes initially so the finish is dull looking. Sprayed it with oil and wiped it and it brought the color out.
I'd try to find an AREX Rex Zero 1 before I bought a P22x. Basically the same gun but a fraction of the price. Sig P22x series guns are overrated and overpriced in general. The legion series is just a stupid gimmick to separate Sig fanboys from a whole bunch of their money.
Hmmm, kinda looks like a Sig's ugly cousin. When they have the demonstrated longevity of a Sig, we might take notice.
Of course, YMMV.
Check out this. The AREX beats out a Legion in a torture test...
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LuPOqDlaX6U
I don't own either (or any DA/SA pistols for that matter), so I have no skin in the game, but the evidence available to me points to the AREX being at least equal to the SIG, if not better (for a fraction of the price). Other sources seem to point in that general direction as well.
E.Stoner
NES Member
I am slightly skeptical of torture tests and meltdowns. These “tests” might favor the gun that is a mechanically inferior (aka rattle boxes). Also I think IV8888 did an arex review last week and found the accuracy of the Arex to be really inconsistent. They may sorta look like Sigs but they aren’t Sigs.
I would still go p22x Sig over Arex every day simply because the sigs have a reputation decades of reliable service under their belt and the aftermarket is DEEP if you want to mess with it and make it your own. Personally that is one of my favorite things to do... after shooting.
I would still go p22x Sig over Arex every day simply because the sigs have a reputation decades of reliable service under their belt and the aftermarket is DEEP if you want to mess with it and make it your own. Personally that is one of my favorite things to do... after shooting.
Is it 9mm DA/SA, or fo-tay/357 in some crappy trigger config like DAK?
I like my 229 and carried it quite a bit this fall, but I've switched back to carrying my G26 lately.
The Legion undercut frame is the best part of that gun, IMO. I think night sights make more sense than the X-Ray sights when carrying, and the slim controls don't really change how concealable it is. Depending on your hand size, the Legion might be worth it just for that cut.
I like my 229 and carried it quite a bit this fall, but I've switched back to carrying my G26 lately.
The Legion undercut frame is the best part of that gun, IMO. I think night sights make more sense than the X-Ray sights when carrying, and the slim controls don't really change how concealable it is. Depending on your hand size, the Legion might be worth it just for that cut.
E.Stoner
NES Member
It’s true about the dry look of the finish. The first picture that hit the internets of finishing problems really just looked like bone dry Guns with spotty bits of lube. The reported issues premature wear seem to have leveled off and I think was a problem of the first runs. Which is something Sig is really good at: Screwing up the first production run.
In the three I have, I haven’t seen any premature mechanical wear I have about 1000 rounds on 226/220 and 2000 the p229 which is the oldest and I got on Nov 8 2016. This is not the best metric as these are range guns that I don’t carry. Ps. Now I have a new tradition (excuse) of buying a rediculous gun every year on Nov 8 in honor of Hillary! I strongly urge folks to observe F-Hillary Day!
E.Stoner
NES Member
The undercut it minimal and like the checkering is mostly hype/window dressing. It’s the super low profile g-10 Hogue grips that make the most difference in comfort and handplacement. I have baby hands and the old style and even e2 grips feel beefy in my hands (esp for a 226). Swap them for Hogue G10s and no problem. Holding them side by side I honestly can’t tell the difference. G10s are going to set you back another 100+ buck but if you have baby hands they are just the ticket.
The low profile controls are legit, and will prevent the common riding of the slide stop which is common in Sigs. Although the slide stop is so low profile that you have to work at it. The one feature I really wish my stock Sigs had were front serrations, but that is really no big deal.
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9 or 40?
smokingbarrel
NES Member
I found the undercut to be more than just window dressing. My 229 has E2 grips, but my hand is that exact size that puts my pinky right on the seam of the magazine/frame. That doesn't happen to me on Legions. The vertical relief and rounded edges of the cut are JUST enough for me.
I don't like G19s for the same reason, but a G19 with a little bit of bubba dremeling is perfect.
Rockrivr1
NES Member
The Sig 229 was the first handgun I purchased many years ago and I still have her. Rock solid and dependable. She came in 40 and I added a Sig 357 Sig and Barsto 9mm barrels which all reliably feed with the stock mags. One great gun and one I've been hbappy with from the start. Sometime bells and whistles on a gun are just nice to haves, but not entirely necessary.
Can't go wrong with a 229, I love mine. I put in the GG trigger, SRT, spring kit and the GG steel guide rod. DA is butter smoother and SA is even better. About 3k rounds with 0 problems. I'm hunting for a 226 Stainless elite or a Legion for a range/competition gun. I like the SSE's extra 12oz due to the frame, but the legion's smaller controls would fix the slide stop ride problem. I'm with GoodWillHunting, if you want the Gucci gun save and splurge for the legion. If you just want a great shooter get the used one and dress it up.
E.Stoner
NES Member
Fair enough, I haven't noticed a problem certainly not on the level of Glock irritation which is real and super-shitty (thanks Gaston!). The G10s are subtle improvement over the E2 (which I had originally been running on my 229) for the baby-handed, like me. The feature I like the most is the extra beavertail. The standard nubbin-tail can irritate the web of you hand during long shooting sessions with lots of mag changes/holster draws.
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E.Stoner
NES Member
the Arex zero is an interesting pistol but has nowhere near the track record of a Sig P226. for defensive purposes i would not consider the Arex in any way superior. MAC throwing a pistol in mud is of entertainment value only. under his conditions the Arex did well but I can assure you that as conditions vary so will results. i am shocked how many people make decisions about their pistols based on his videos. even he appropriately cautions against over-interpretation of results.
i certainly like the P226/P229 pistols but to quote drgrant they are "schoolbuses". the few times I've shot them alongside a G17, M&P 9 or Steyr M9 the sigs just flip all over the place in comparison. the bore sits substantially higher and not just where the tang rests over the web of hand. measure the height from under the trigger guard to the bore compared to a G17. they're nice guns but ancient design. for casual shooting, pleasure or defensive purposes they're wonderful, but for shooting quickly or carrying they suck.
obviously the .40 cartridge is in the toilet right now, which is funny because not long ago everyone was blabbing about how the 9mm sucks and we all need to go .40. regardless the .40 S&W does offer two MAJOR advantages in 2018: 1) guns are cheap and 2) in the event of another Newtown .40 ammo will be the only pistol ammo that's easy to find. 9mm and 45acp will spike in cost or even worse shelves empty out.
i certainly like the P226/P229 pistols but to quote drgrant they are "schoolbuses". the few times I've shot them alongside a G17, M&P 9 or Steyr M9 the sigs just flip all over the place in comparison. the bore sits substantially higher and not just where the tang rests over the web of hand. measure the height from under the trigger guard to the bore compared to a G17. they're nice guns but ancient design. for casual shooting, pleasure or defensive purposes they're wonderful, but for shooting quickly or carrying they suck.
Hmmm lots of used .40's around.....
obviously the .40 cartridge is in the toilet right now, which is funny because not long ago everyone was blabbing about how the 9mm sucks and we all need to go .40. regardless the .40 S&W does offer two MAJOR advantages in 2018: 1) guns are cheap and 2) in the event of another Newtown .40 ammo will be the only pistol ammo that's easy to find. 9mm and 45acp will spike in cost or even worse shelves empty out.
