FFL Transfer Fees

[EJFudd]

My main guy started out at $20.00 and I gave him a ton of business as a result. Then he went to $25.00. Then he went to $30.00. Finally, he went to $40.00.

As a result, my business with him slowed, incrementally over time, to a crawl. Now, it is practically nonexistent.

At least from me, he lost a whole lot of income by raising his transfer fee too high. Perhaps he made it up from others.

 

[KrymSIX]

$50-$60 seems really high.

Around here (western MA) most shops seem to be around $25-$30 which I don't mind. Covers the cost of them having an employee taking the time to go through the process.

 

[Marty McFly]

There used to be a guy in north-central CT who did $20 transfers at his house. That's all he did all day and night long. 15 minute intervals. Not a bad $80/hr gig.

Mostly cash too. I love it

 

[drgrant]

Do FFLs get charged a fee for doing transfers and then pass it on to us? I’m just curious as to why some fees are so crazy high.

my FFL told me he was just passing it on and I thought it was weird as the fees fluctuate between stores.

he’s lying to you. That said, if the fees too high use someone else. Although im going to laugh my ass off in a few years at crying flints when the typical transfer eventually is $50 or $100.

 

[Len-2A Training]

I just checked Firearm Transfers and am shocked to see:

• $60 standard transfer fee (FREE for members)

They'll never get my business!

I've used 619DW for two inbounds so far and he charges $20.00. Very reasonable and I like Keith. When we were still MA subjects, my Wife bought a rifle and I've bought a few cases of ammo there.

In general, I need to down-size my collection so I'm not buying much unless something catches my eye.

 

[greencobra]

shops should all agree to charge the same fee...50 bucks sounds good for a private sale. want to have the shop bring in a gun for you and do paperwork, well $100 sounds fair. that solves the skinflint problem. i certainly wouldn't have a problem if a guy wanted to give a regular a break. but that regular would have to buy more than a bottle of hoppes and some patches every year to become a "regular."

 

[drgrant]

My main guy started out at $20.00 and I gave him a ton of business as a result. Then he went to $25.00. Then he went to $30.00. Finally, he went to $40.00.

As a result, my business with him slowed, incrementally over time, to a crawl. Now, it is practically nonexistent.

At least from me, he lost a whole lot of income by raising his transfer fee too high. Perhaps he made it up from others.

At some point, he likely determined that the time cost value of entertaining cheap transfers was not worth his time.

 

[AMV]

At some point, he likely determined that the time cost value of entertaining cheap transfers was not worth his time.

Transfers can be filler for a slow day

 

[drgrant]

shops should all agree to charge the same fee...50 bucks sounds good for a private sale. want to have the shop bring in a gun for you and do paperwork, well $100 sounds fair. that solves the skinflint problem. i certainly wouldn't have a problem if a guy wanted to give a regular a break. but that regular would have to buy more than a bottle of hoppes and some patches every year to become a "regular."

Lol that’s dumb, because different shops have different ideas of TCV. A guy with a not busy shop is happy to get the $20. (this however eventually will not be sustainable ) Guys that are busy with whatever, it’s literally a waste at that price. That said I agree the flints are pretty nauseating but whatever. I’m surprised fees don’t vary by time/day. It’s cheaper for a shop to do a transfer on a tuesday at 9 than it is anytime on a Saturday….

 

[drgrant]

Transfers can be filler for a slow day

yes, I agree but on average, there’s also just a burden and an overhead thing, and also attracting flints is not really great for your business. Regardless of what your business is these people tend to waste inanimate amounts of your time with providing the least amount of payback.

 

[DW357]

The fact that a frame transfer costs more than a complete firearms transfer leads me to believe that there must be alot more work involved for the ffl?

I dunno. $50 is worth it to me. I can buy offlist guns online and have them shipped directly to my dealer. The convenience is worth the $50 but I’m not a skinflint either

 

[AMV]

I am on my way now to do a $30 transfer for a OU semi custom shotgun from out of state…. Nothing that could have been gotten for me by the FFL. He was closed a few days this week and said he was a bit backed up had 50 transfers come in this week….. is that not making money????

 

[drgrant]

I am on my way now to do a $30 transfer for a OU semi custom shotgun from out of state…. Nothing that could have been gotten for me by the FFL. He was closed a few days this week and said he was a bit backed up had 50 transfers come in this week….. is that not making money????

Yes, it is, if that’s your entire model.

 

[greencobra]

Lol that’s dumb...

it's the only way to stop the ffl transfer fee shoppers. it takes balls to think you're doing an ffl a favor by letting him do your transfer cause he's the cheapest. there's a ton of hobby ffl's out there who'll do the 20 buck transfer all day long. the only overhead they have is the light bulb over the kitchen table. you gotta just shake your head in amazement at the balls of some people.

 

[AMV]

Yes, it is, if that’s your entire model.

Let’s say it’s 25% of your model still good…right?

 

[EJFudd]

At some point, he likely determined that the time cost value of entertaining cheap transfers was not worth his time.

No, it had nothing to do with that. It was all the brand new guns that people were buying cheap and transferring in instead of buying them from him at his retail. He decided he needed to discourage that practice to stay in business. But rather than set-up a two-tier system (or refuse transfers of brand new guns which he could get), he raised his incoming transfer fee to $40.00 for all guns.

Since I was only transferring in used guns, he was not losing any sales on me. But his fee was his fee and it became uneconomic for me to use him.

 

[EJFudd]

shops should all agree to charge the same fee...50 bucks sounds good for a private sale. want to have the shop bring in a gun for you and do paperwork, well $100 sounds fair. that solves the skinflint problem. i certainly wouldn't have a problem if a guy wanted to give a regular a break. but that regular would have to buy more than a bottle of hoppes and some patches every year to become a "regular."

LOL!!! You are either very wealthy or you aren't doing many (or any?) transfers.

 

[greencobra]

LOL!!! You are either very wealthy or you aren't doing many (or any?) transfers.

lets just say i hate people who nickel and dime shit and call it a day.

 

[drgrant]

No, it had nothing to do with that. It was all the brand new guns that people were buying cheap and transferring in instead of buying them from him at his retail. He decided he needed to discourage that practice to stay in business. But rather than set-up a two-tier system (or refuse transfers of brand new guns which he could get), he raised his incoming transfer fee to $40.00 for all guns.

Since I was only transferring in used guns, he was not losing any sales on me. But his fee was his fee and it became uneconomic for me to use him.

That is the very definition of time cost value, think harder. Although there probably was a way he could have engineered a policy to have his cake and eat it too but most dealers don't think hard enough about how to
work that.

Like there are entire realms of work I dont take on because it basically just pisses me off. I didn't drop services
but I charge appropriately. If they dont like the fact that I charge $250 to mess with outlook they can get someone else.

 

[FalArAk]

he’s lying to you. That said, if the fees too high use someone else. Although im going to laugh my ass off in a few years at crying flints when the typical transfer eventually is $50 or $100.

I have a feeling most FFL's are secretly wanting the .gov to outlaw FTF transfers.

Then they can be like Cali FFL's where $75-$100 transfers are the norm.

 

[drgrant]

I have a feeling most FFL's are secretly wanting the .gov to outlaw FTF transfers.

Then they can be like Cali FFL's where $75-$100 transfers are the norm.

f*** no, the $ is because of their time. Cali FFLs likely charge that much because of overpriced real estate and the very real tax/overhead/communist burdens that state imposes.

 

[FalArAk]

f*** no, the $ is because of their time. Cali FFLs likely charge that much because of overpriced real estate and the very real tax/overhead/communist burdens that state imposes.

They charge that much because they can and there is no such thing as FTF anymore

 

[drgrant]

LOL!!! You are either very wealthy or you aren't doing many (or any?) transfers.

If a $50 transfer breaks your bank you might want to take up knitting or something. Whats that buy now, like 4 boxes of 9mm maybe? It wont even fill one of my gas tanks anymore. The guys I use charge $25-35 though
mostly if they asked for 50 id just pay it. I know what they're dealing with.

 

[drgrant]

They charge that much because they can and there is no such thing as FTF anymore

That is true but FFL density in CA is basically dog shit. Which means the dealers that exist are busy. So anyone who runs a shop likely has a fun time gating problem. Plus not sure if you know this, but CA inbounds have a whole other regulatory burden attached to them. You can't even send a gun to an FFL in that state anymore without being approved by the state. Thats how f***ed it is.

 

[drgrant]

it's the only way to stop the ffl transfer fee shoppers. it takes balls to think you're doing an ffl a favor by letting him do your transfer cause he's the cheapest. there's a ton of hobby ffl's out there who'll do the 20 buck transfer all day long. the only overhead they have is the light bulb over the kitchen table. you gotta just shake your head in amazement at the balls of some people.

Lol being communist doesnt fix that problem though. The guys doing the $15-$20 transfers love that shit and they dont care what anyones motives are. (even if I think they're basically punching themselves in the dick)

 

[drgrant]

Let’s say it’s 25% of your model still good…right?

yeah its great if you can facilitate 50 transfers without having it f*** up any other aspect of your business. I know some guys that basically only do transfers and they do pretty decent even at $25 or $35 although one guy I know is probably going to $45 because even as a transfer only guy hes starting to feel the TCV pinch. Even if it reduces the # of transfers hes not going to care much. Especially if it ends up breaking even. After a point in your life someone decides their time is worth more and charges appropriately.

ETA: regardless of what anyone thinks the market tends to sort things out pretty well on its own.

 

[FalArAk]

That is true but FFL density in CA is basically dog shit. Which means the dealers that exist are busy. So anyone who runs a shop likely has a fun time gating problem. Plus not sure if you know this, but CA inbounds have a whole other regulatory burden attached to them. You can't even send a gun to an FFL in that state anymore without being approved by the state. Thats how f***ed it is.

I know, but believe me transfers used to be pretty damn cheap there due to the amount of guns in Cali, there was actually competition... Once the state made it illegal for FTF transfers, the FFL's raised their prices 500% for facilitating a FTF transfer.

You know the gun owner that doesn't want the NFA to be abolished? It's the gun owner that just spent $25k for a transferrable Colt M16 who isn't filthy rich.

 

[drgrant]

I know, but believe me transfers used to be pretty damn cheap there due to the amount of guns in Cali, there was actually competition... Once the state made it illegal for FTF transfers, the FFL's raised their prices 500% for facilitating a FTF transfer.

How many dealers were there back then though? 10+ years ago the density of dealers in that state was unholy absolute dog shit horrible. (easily far worse than mass) The # of dealers per 100K pop was tiny, not sure what it is now.

You know the gun owner that doesn't want the NFA to be abolished? It's the gun owner that just spent $25k for a transferrable Colt M16 who isn't filthy rich.

True but my point is most of those CA dealers probably not getting rich off the $100 transfer, its an annoying process to them that interferes with their other business operations. If they are /all/ at $100 and not one dealer wants to compete with another on their transfer rate, that tells me that transfers arent a big part of their business models or theres a time gating problem with transfers that make it difficult for them to justify discounting the fee.

It's like in mass with plumbers or something. Good luck trying to get a plumber to even show up for under $150 cash on the barrel. Because there aren't enough plumbers. And the ones that do exist are basically always drowning in work.

ETA: any gun owner that doesnt want to see the NFA abolished is just a straight up a**h***, lol. regardless of what they paid for their overpriced shit.

 

[EJFudd]

That is the very definition of time cost value, think harder.

You're still not getting it. He wanted to sell the new guns because he made a far better profit by selling them than allowing those same new guns to be transferred in for a fixed fee (below what would have been his profit). Same work... same time spent... but he wanted a higher profit.

Although there probably was a way he could have engineered a policy to have his cake and eat it too but most dealers don't think hard enough about how to work that.

I recall at least one very popular shop that raised their incoming transfer fee on brand new guns into the stratosphere while maintaining a competitive fee on incoming used guns and person to person transfers. That's how they addressed the same problem.

Did my shop come out ahead overall by raising it's incoming transfer fee to compete with same gun sales profit? Who knows?

 

[EJFudd]

If a $50 transfer breaks your bank you might want to take up knitting or something. Whats that buy now, like 4 boxes of 9mm maybe? It wont even fill one of my gas tanks anymore. The guys I use charge $25-35 though mostly if they asked for 50 id just pay it. I know what they're dealing with.

Let me ask you this: At how many transfers per month does $40 or $50 per transfer start to add up for you? Does it ever start to matter such that you might decide to look elsewhere for more competitive rates?

I get the impression from your posts that you are quite well off financially. I am not.