FBI Agent John Shipley

[terraformer]

From the article:

Not a big surprise what got him in trouble with the BATF.

It was more than the sales. I read one thing where he was bragging he could turn around stuff quick. He claims now the sales were because he was hard up for cash, but given some emails they got out of him, there is another picture there.

 

[drgrant]

That's 54 guns in 41 months. Or 1.3 guns per month. 1 gun/month does not a dealer make. If I needed to raise some quick $$$ and sold everything I bought just in the past 12 months, my rate would be 2-3x that. Would I be considered a dealer then?

Sounds like trumped up chicken$hit charges to me. I hate the BATF. Very much.

Let me start by saying I don't agree with the laws... If anything, this case is a yet another graphic reason why most federal gun laws should be repealed outright.

That said, within the framework of the existing laws, if you look at the indictment it had little to do with the amount as much as it did the context of many of the transactions. This guy basically waved a red flag around in front of the bull, unfortunately for him. If even a quarter of what is in the indictment is true at all, it's readily apparent that he was intending on operating as a dealer on a for profit basis. You can't do things like order a gun for somebody, take cash up front for it, and still claim that you're not a dealer, among other things. The ATF has a term for this, called "Profit Motive". It would certainly appear that he had that. (EG, intending to run a business involved in selling firearms).

Yup. That, and his 2 sets of books...

I think therein lies part of his problem. If he's not a licensed dealer, what the heck is he doing
keeping a transaction log if he's not legally required to under such a circumstance? The mere
presence of the logs, raises more questions than answers, and gives them another thing to
gripe about.

-Mike

 

[Titan]

Lots of government employees feel they don't get paid enough and seek to 'supplement' their income.

This is no surprise.

This guy would have probably found something else to sell illegally if it wasn't guns.

 

[jcr]

They also accused Shipley of keeping two sets of records. One accurately reflected each of his gun dealings, but another that Shipley turned over to ATF agents lacked pertinent information such as driver's license numbers.

This is very confusing.

They say he was not a dealer and therefore charged him for dealilng without a license.

If one is a not-dealer, then it would seem that it is legal to keep any number of books, starting with 0. And if they ask for them, isn't the response, "Get a warrant"?

And if they have a warrant, why give or say anything. He is charged with a lie for saying that some "set of books" was his only set. Just shut the F... up.

Anyway, if you're a not-dealer, and you don't have to keep any books, why would books with Driver-License-# info be required.

All weird, but...

Could he have been a C&R holder? And that is the books they are talking about? Does a C&R licensee have to have DL#s in his C&R bound book?

 

[jcr]

You can't do things like order a gun for somebody, take cash up front for it, and still claim that you're not a dealer,

Did he take up front money?

When I followed some links, I couldnt get to the paperwork from last year. The indictment, didn't mention this in the four illegal 4473 charges.