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F-Tactical Rules?

Mountain

Mountain

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I've been searching but have yet to find clear rules for the new 'F-Tactical' class. F-TR totally clear to me, but the 2016 NRA rule book isn't clear to me for F-Tactical, at least what I read in the equipment section.

My understanding is caliber can be anything between ~.223 to .308 (maybe .35?)
Harris type bipod
Semi-auto
Scope limited to 12X?
Barrel length???
Comp allowed??? If yes, any restrictions on type?

While laid up after shoulder surgery, I have finally been playing around with my one-part-at-a-time Aero AR-308 build. It started with a NES group buy port cover, so naturally from that point it just needs a few more parts to finish [rofl]. Next thing I need is a barrel & think I have found a top shelf 6.5 Creedmoor barrel for very reasonable. Need to know if the caliber is OK and if there is a barrel length restriction (20"???).

I may just not F with it (cheesy pun intended) and do what I want- 22" or 24" barrel with a nice comp. However, depending on the rules my build may be done in a manner that is 'F-Tactical' compliant.

Input appreciated!
 
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Dan S said:
Sounds like a 6.5 Grendel would be a great round to shoot in that.
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Basically a mid-range competition, so probably the 6.5 Grendel would be GTG. Having port cover already, I naturally had to finish the LR 308 I started.
 
Mountain said:
Typical 'issue' flash hider OK, but no 'comps'. So assuming stock barrels all have threaded muzzles, what the heck are PRM inmates supposed to do? Pin and weld a thread protector? [puke]
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With as loose as everything else seems to be, this seems out of place.

It is lame if this is the case though. I have 51t muzzle devices on all my guns to use with my suppressors. So I would have to remove them to shoot these matches? Nah.
 
PatMcD said:
So this isn't F/TR class?
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No- semi-auto AR-based equipment with Harris type bipods and max 12X optics.

edmorseiii said:
With as loose as everything else seems to be, this seems out of place.

It is lame if this is the case though. I have 51t muzzle devices on all my guns to use with my suppressors. So I would have to remove them to shoot these matches? Nah.
Click to expand...

Sorry-

I was speaking from PRM (Mass) perspective. Maybe they are not a problem. Intent is to be similar to 'issue' AR types. Looser rules than CMP 'Modern Military'- maybe more like a designated marksman rifle.
 
Be nice if rules where clear.
I know a few people who went helbent getting "military" profile barrels for CMP Mondern Military matches just to have that thrown out and introducing optics and a weight limit.
I can see the issues with rules but sometimes simple is best.,especially if you want to attract new players.
At this point I don't care if I have to shoot out of competition as long as I can shoot.

I know the rule posted in your link says 12x but can my scope be a 8x32 and just set it on 12 and somehow tape it to show no tampering?
I have a 8x32x50 on my "tactical " AR 18" bull free float.
What is a rear rest used in military or police tactical situations?
My hand , T shirt , buddies ammo pouch?
If the goal is to attract new shooters the rules need to be very simple and clear.
AR platform
Optics or irons---optics will be restricted to 12x max but high mag scopes may be used but set at 12x for the match.
Standard AR stocks A1,A2 or M4 ? Will rules allow taped on mods like foam and duct tape for a cheak riser ?
Can I use a bag vs a bit pod...
 
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The problem with all these class's, is that they water down the field. A class that you win where you're the only player doesn't mean much.
 
PatMcD said:
The problem with all these class's, is that they water down the field. A class that you win where you're the only player doesn't mean much.
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True. But there's always the factor of competing against yourself for improved scores & also comparison against the next class 'higher' in equipment. It does open up the possibility for someone to compete prone mid-range with an AR based platform.

It's attractive to me for two reasons: fits a build I want to eventually finish, and I don't know how long it will be before my shoulder surgery heals enough to sling up. I had hoped to shoot Garand, Springfield, and try a couple high power matches this year but don't know when I will be GTG. Was hoping to come up and add to the numbers and be leg point fodder while I learn the ropes. I should be able to shoot prone as a lefty in about a month.

mac1911, yeah- some of the rules are as clear as mud. I think scope has to be max 12X capable, at least that's what I read. Rules do state 14 lbs max, which is relatively generous. Rear rest can't be a monopod or eared sandbag- I'm not clear about plain sandbags. Does say that a pack or rolled clothing is OK.

I think one could put a bipod and a scope on a high power AR and be done, though a .223 might be at a disadvantage to 6mm or 6.5mm AR-308 platform. As always, user skill probably trumps everything else.
 
Well I'm going to reading for a mid range prone with what I have.,
I think the biggest problem still as far as new classes and attracting new shooters is the new shooters already usually have a "gun" seldom do you see some one like yourself actually thinking of building something specific.
Note I never think of it as competing against others I go to beat myself if I happen to shoot better than most so,be it.
I get next to zero practice behind my AR or any center fire rifle so the 8-10 matches I do get to if I shoot in the High 80s low 90s I'm happy.... now if I can just get into and stay in the upper 80s off hand!!!!
I practice with a daisy 853 and a crosman 1400 from 60s
 
Anything that gets me more trigger time under the pressure of competition I like. Shooting prone events as a lefty will accommodate my temporary (I hope) handicap / injury and is something I can do when I get too old and beat up to do OK in rapids. Really, my pipe dream is to go to Perry and finish at least in the upper 50% for JC Garand, Springfield, and Vintage Military. Hope I am good to go for the New England Games this Sept. then we will see about Perry next year.
 
A lot of us have shot mid-range prone with an AR (.223) for many years now; we just use iron sights.

Didn't a AR with a bipod and a scope basically fall into the F/TR class?
You'll have to forgive me: I've been a little curmudgeonly about all the new rules allowing scopes, bags, bipods, etc..
I had to walk uphill in a snowstorm both ways to school and everybody else should too.
 
PatMcD said:
A lot of us have shot mid-range prone with an AR (.223) for many years now; we just use iron sights.

Didn't a AR with a bipod and a scope basically fall into the F/TR class?
You'll have to forgive me: I've been a little curmudgeonly about all the new rules allowing scopes, bags, bipods, etc..
I had to walk uphill in a snowstorm both ways to school and everybody else should too.
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An AR in .223 or .308 would of course fall into F/TR- scope and a bipod and good to go. The issue is that if one wants to be at the top of the heap for F/TR, it requires significant spend in custom special purpose bolt guns. Here's the Euro champ ~5 years ago and his rifle:

vinceftr01.jpg

I bet that cost some serious dinero and had a long lead time. In contrast, the new (I assume still provisional?) AR class requires semi-auto AR platform and has some limits that keep the spend down to earth. Probably the biggest difference from TR besides the semi auto only AR platform is that any caliber between .223 and .308 is OK. Unlike your typical highpower AR, the F Tactical / AR class allows adjustable butt stocks like the Magpul PRS and free-float fore-ends are OK. Some of the special calibers are not so special anymore. Even American Eagle is offering 6.5 Creedmoor, and some top quality Hornady 6.5 CM can be found for close to a buck a round. Some folks don't reload.

I found a semi-heavy 6.5 Creedmoor 20" barrel built on a Douglas blank for $315. We will see how it shoots, but I have heard good things about the maker. I had AR-308 parts from group buys and other cheap sources and already had a spare Rock River NM trigger. I have a decent Nikon variable scope up to 12X. After the barrel, probably the most I will spend will be on a nice JP free-float fore-end. I'll probably troll classifieds and ebay for a used Harris bipod. I plan to use a Luth buttstock, which has good reviews and cost much less than a Magpul. We'll see how this budget build works out- I'll post targets on NES when I eventually finish.

At heart, I think I score high on the curmudgeon chart. My absolute favorite is the as-issued JC Garand match. NES karma from mac1911 got me hooked on that. Guidance from him and a salty but awesome RSO had me immediately on the black. I'm still learning but generally shoot decently at the matches. I have an old Springfield National Match that will see time in matches as soon as I heal. This new-fangled class is interesting to me because it fits a build I want to finish and I can still compete if I have a long recovery for my shoulder surgery. I have little interest in F T/R and zero interest in full blown F-class.
 
F Open or T/R purpose built rifle ~$4K plus optic.
6.5 Creedmoor AR can be self built for under $1K.
 
Is this what you're talking about?: http://rulebooks.nra.org/documents/pdf/compete/rules/rul_hpr_16.pdf

NRA Mid-Range (Prone) Tactical Rifle (AR)​
Note: Most rules necessary for the integration of this rifle into existing competition are already in existence and remain the same.

MID-RANGE COMPETITION FOR TACTICAL RIFLES ON THE “AR-PLATFORM”​

Conceptually, this new NRA Mid-Range (Prone) Tactical Rifle (AR) program will be designed to provide civilian, military, and police shooters with an opportunity to shoot NRA Mid-Range Prone competition along-side of other Mid-Range Prone shooters in matches using semi-automatic rifles built on an “AR Platform” and equipment generally thought of as being “tactical” in design and use. These rifles will be configured so as to replicate as closely as possible the tactical rifles (semiautomatic) and equipment used by the United States Military and America’s Law Enforcement Community in “mid-range” tactical applications. These semi-automatic rifles will be more “off the rack” or “stock” than “competition” in nature. They will be more of a “tactical design” than “match design” and therefore less expensive than the vast majority of mid-range prone rifles currently in use.

These rifles will be of the “AR-Platform” variety, semi-automatic, chambered in any caliber from .223 cal./5.56mm up to and including .308 cal./7.62mm. The courses of fire will be the same courses of fire currently used for other NRA Mid-Range (Prone) High Power Competition (300, 500 & 600 yards) and are designed to be fired concurrently with other forms of Mid-Range competition. The targets will be the same targets that are used for Service Rifle, Match Rifle and Palma Rifle Mid-Range Prone competition. Mid-range telescopic sights will be allowed, but not required. Because this is prone competition, shooters may use tactical front rests such as Harris-type bipods and limited rear rests of the type one might find used in military or police tactical situations.

This new style of competition is designed to be more “tactical” in spirit and for that reason equipment normally found in other types of High Power Rifle Competition such as Match Rifle, Palma Rifle and F-Class Rifle will not be permitted. In order to understand the spirit of this new sport one might think of this sport as “prone Service Rifle with a bipod and a scope”. This IS NOT designed as another version of F-Class competition.

As a practical matter, Match Directors wishing to provide this competitive shooting opportunity within their programs will simply integrate this rifle with others already provided for within their standard Mid-Range program. In other words, this will simply be another category of rifle to be added to those already in existence.

These Rules should be “Provisional” to be revisited after three (3) years of operation; i.e., January of 2020 – if approved.
Click to expand...

FYI, comps are not allowed in any category:
3.16.1 Compensators and Muzzle Brakes—The use of compensators or muzzle brakes is prohibited. An extension tube that has been installed on the muzzle of a rifle to extend the sight radius shall not be considered a “muzzle brake.” The extension tube must have an interior diameter of .5 inches or greater and may have 1/4 inch x 1 inch slots cut at 12 and 6 o’clock to remove cleaning patches. Threaded holes along the top of this tube for the installation of sight bases will be allowed.

(a) Sound suppressors are not authorized for use in high power competition.
Click to expand...
 
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edmorseiii said:
With as loose as everything else seems to be, this seems out of place.

It is lame if this is the case though. I have 51t muzzle devices on all my guns to use with my suppressors. So I would have to remove them to shoot these matches? Nah.
Click to expand...

Nobody wants to lay down 2 feet to the right or left of some guy with an obnoxious comp and try to concentrate on breaking good shots.
 
jasons said:
Nobody wants to lay down 2 feet to the right or left of some guy with an obnoxious comp and try to concentrate on breaking good shots.
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Valid, but he said issued type flash hiders. I would entertain swapping the comp on my longer gun for a 51t flash hider if it were allowed, but that's about it.
 
edmorseiii said:
Valid, but he said issued type flash hiders. I would entertain swapping the comp on my longer gun for a 51t flash hider if it were allowed, but that's about it.
Click to expand...

Flash hiders are fine and common.
 
edmorseiii said:
I am paid up on a class that day, but this is something I am interested in, maybe an other time this summer?
Click to expand...

Check the calendar, we have a few MRP matches scheduled. I think Nashua, Pelham, and Scarborough also have some.

Here's a combined schedule for most of the clubs in the Northeast. Always check with the actual club before you drive though, sometimes individual clubs make changes that don't appear on the combined calendar.

http://www.nfga.org/highpower/pdfs/2016_NFGA_highpower_schedule.pdf
 
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JasonS-

Yes, that's the class and rules- thanks!

I won't be cleared to drive until late June, so I'll be looking at the match schedules for mid to late summer. Will be fun to try before I'm ready to jam into a sling again.
 
As much as I wish I could just keep shooting irons it's getting harder, eye sight is on its way out.
. Although now I'm tempted to slap a nice rear aperture and front globe on my 1903a3 and shoot a Mid range prone match with that!
Hope to see you up reading...I'm,not sure which match I will make it too. I'm trying to work out getting to the Service Rifle state shoot and then one match after.
Life schedule is getting in the way of the shooting life...
 
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This thread hasn't been posted on but I thought I'd clear up a couple of things.

The class in question in the original post is not a division of F-class. F-class rules are found as a subset of the NRA HP rules. There has long been discussion in many corners, and some informal rules at some ranges, for a practical or tactical F-class similar to F-TR. To date it is just that, an informal non-codified ruleset that differs from range to range.

The class that is being discussed here is a Provisional rule set from the NRA that is a subset of the HP rules. It is a "get people out on the line" class that in my opinion will never be a fully recognized class in it's current form. I think it is a great idea to get people to come out and shoot with what ever they have, but it's the bunny hill.

1. 600 yards from a supported position on HP targets. In back in about 2005 or 2006 before the F class rules were approved there was one of the first F class national championships in Oak Ridge. Frank Beckmann shot a 200-26X on a HP target at 1000 yards. (I think he was shooting a BRX or a Dasher) That was the day everyone new the target was too big for the game being played. The next yr the F class target scoring rings were ½ the diameter. In this provisional class newbie shooters get to put up decent scores and learn the game, but a shooter with a modicum of wind reading and loading skill puts up 200 with 18 or 19Xs on those targets with out a lot of effort. For the record, shooting 90VLDs I rarely shoot less than HM scores with an F-TR rifle on F class targets at 600. The last time I missed the 9 ring on an F class target (an 8 on an F class target is a 9 on a HP target) at 600 yards I hit the trigger closing the bolt and sent one in the general direction of the target (and still got a 6).

2. No chambering restrictions. Make it a real class and every serious competitor on the line will be running a 6mm/243 based chambering in an AR10 platform. Why wouldn't you?

Scroll down to section 23 on page 9 of the link below to see the rules for the class.

http://competitions.nra.org/documents/pdf/compete/rules/rul_hpr_16.pdf
 
It is still not really under consideration as I know, and it is not F-Class. (the title of this thread is confusing) As I noted above, it's something to get new shooters out to try shooting round targets on rectangular fields.

Considering the un-holy BS going on in NRA HP right now associated with the Nationals I doubt any changes are even on the long term radar.
 
Road_Clam said:
Any updates on this proposed new class ? I'm hearing that this class will be nixed ?
Click to expand...

I don't see why we'd need it anymore now that you can shoot with a scope on your "service" rifle. The only real difference between the new service rifle rules and the "Tactical (AR)" rules is that you could shoot off of a bipod in Tactical (AR,) which you can already do in F-Class anyway. Basically you either shoot from a sling and fall into "service rifle" or off a bipod and fall into "F-Class." Either way you can shoot.
 

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