ERPO: must your turn in guns from out of state?

[JayMcB]

so since there are no penalties for false ones, do we ERPO every single pol in MA to show how ludicrous the new law is?

Their tyranny makes me feel unsafe.

 

[Asaltweapon]

Federal felony to do FTF between 2 parties that don't live in the same state.

Not my point. It’s legal for me to buy X out of state as a legal resident according to ATF. Are you saying that I can not sell same X item to a same state resident that I legally obtained same said X item?

 

[HorizontalHunter]

Is there any protection in a gun trust?

Bob

 

[Asaltweapon]

Is there any protection in a gun trust?

Bob

Trust can’t own firearms in MA is what I’m told.
Great question for other states.

I have a trust so I’m paying attention even more now.

Maybe Rockriver can add to this aspect.

 

[TayNinh_66]

LOL, so if someone has guns on their list that they sold years ago and can't remember what dealer or who they sold them to, then they're on the hook?

I live in Boston. A bright red city. They will come with a list.

If I ever thought there was a potential for ERPO, I would obtain a copy of the list. Cheap at $20.
https://www.mass.gov/files/2017-06/Personal Search Request Form for website.pdf

 

[Asaltweapon]

I live in Boston. A bright red city. They will come with a list.

If I ever thought there was a potential for ERPO, I would obtain a copy of the list. Cheap at $20.
https://www.mass.gov/files/2017-06/Personal Search Request Form for website.pdf

I’ve owned guns for a lot longer than any ‘list’. Some were on the old blue cards.

I have an old blank blue card that I might frame as an antique.

 

[Horrible]

I’ve owned guns for a lot longer than any ‘list’. Some were on the old blue cards.

I have an old blank blue card that I might frame as an antique.

Good for life, right? Until it wasn’t

 

[JackOfAllTrades]

So let's say I have been playing with some prototype hand made firearms. I build one, dutifully do my FA10 when it can fire a shot, test, then destroy it. I now have many FA10ed firearms which have all been destroyed per ATF regulations.

So when they want me to hand them over, I can't. There is no provision to un-FA10. The were not sold. They were not lost. They were not stolen. They were destroyed with all the required paperwork (none).

I can't hand over the 20 firearms that I properly destroyed. Now what?

Maybe that is the answer. What is the penalty for doing an FA10 on a work of fiction? If everyone did this for say, 25 extra firearms, then who is to say what did or did not ever exist, or is out of state, or just hidden?

I bet this skews a bunch of statistics that were never supposed to come out of the FA10 system too.

 

[free]

I live in Boston. A bright red city. They will come with a list.

If I ever thought there was a potential for ERPO, I would obtain a copy of the list. Cheap at $20.
https://www.mass.gov/files/2017-06/Personal Search Request Form for website.pdf

That list does not list what you currently own, only. It is a list of your transactions, but does not remove sales from the list, i.e. it is not a net, left in inventory list.

 

[Asaltweapon]

Good for life, right? Until it wasn’t

Ya. No kidding.
Silly us.

 

[milktree]

I live in Boston. A bright red city. They will come with a list.

If I ever thought there was a potential for ERPO, I would obtain a copy of the list. Cheap at $20.
https://www.mass.gov/files/2017-06/Personal Search Request Form for website.pdf

Thought experiment:

You pay your $20 and get a list of what they think you have. (or have had, or something)

You discover there's a bunch of guns in your safe that belong to you that are *not* on that list.

There's no legal obligation to correct the omissions, but it wouldn't surprise me if the fact that you didn't got used against you.

 

[Horrible]

Ya. No kidding.
Silly us.

That’s how I feel about registering firearms. We followed all of the laws and now they are using our compliance AGAINST us!

Gangbangers have no such worries

 

[Granite Guardsman]

I have but three words in response to this:
Eighty Percent Lower

 

[ChevyGuy91]

For a forum full of labya melonning patriots, there is an aweful lot of talk about giving up your guns when the state comes knocking in this thread.

 

[Waher]

This is creating a perverse incentive to not file FA10s. Politicians that think they are immune to consequences overlook the unintended consequences of their poorly written spite filled legislation. Eroding the Rule of Law is never a good idea when one depends on it.

 

[enbloc]

If I had my guns seized...I'd build new ones.

 

[drgrant]

I live in Boston. A bright red city. They will come with a list.

If I ever thought there was a potential for ERPO, I would obtain a copy of the list. Cheap at $20.
https://www.mass.gov/files/2017-06/Personal Search Request Form for website.pdf

I know they will come with a list, I was more discussing the reality of a judge actually screwing a reasonable person acting in good faith WRT a few items that might be listed but one might not remember how or when they were transferred. The records request doesn't cover any of that....

 

[drgrant]

This is creating a perverse incentive to not file FA10s. Politicians that think they are immune to consequences overlook the unintended consequences of their poorly written spite filled legislation. Eroding the Rule of Law is never a good idea when one depends on it.

lol and Maura started that trend on 7/20... a lot of people no longer respect the law at this point because she's basically shown that she sure as hell doesn't....

 

[Asaltweapon]

I have but three words in response to this:
Eighty Percent Lower

What on earth are you talking about?

 

[enbloc]

Have a list of your own...
1) Have a fully-charged cell phone to video the police interaction
2) Primary Lawyer's phone number
3) Secondary Lawyer's phone number
4) Ask for a copy of the ERPO, and who initiated it.
5) If no copy, take a picture of it.
6) Demand the right to have a non-family member who is duly licensed to "secure" your firearms until ERPO is resolved.
7) If "No" to the above, ask where they will be storing your firearms*

* I think somehow it would be great if Gun Clubs and Local Gun Shops could add "ERPO STORAGE FACILITY" to their business model...

 

[drgrant]

Thought experiment:

You pay your $20 and get a list of what they think you have. (or have had, or something)

You discover there's a bunch of guns in your safe that belong to you that are *not* on that list.

There's no legal obligation to correct the omissions, but it wouldn't surprise me if the fact that you didn't got used against you.

my hypothetical is far worse....

kopsch: where is X?
guy: I sold X like 12 years ago, I don't remember who though. It's not in my paperwork here.
kopsch: hirrr!!! durrrr! ooog angry give us gun nooow!!!
guy: " I would but you're not listening, i sold that gun like 12 years ago. "

An unregistered gun on the other hand, there's no direct statement in MGL dictating "maintenance" of registration.

 

[drgrant]

For a forum full of labya melonning patriots, there is an aweful lot of talk about giving up your guns when the state comes knocking in this thread.

Well unless one's got a good plan or overwatch, the state will arrest/kill us if it doesn't get what it wants. The cheap way out is to outfox them, which given the clown car/keystone kops nature of gun control in MA, probably not that impossible to do.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

The advantage of a trust is you can eFA10 up to 4 NFA weapons to someone else in the trust if you suspect an ERPO or 209a is going down. The mechanics of a dealer picking up your guns from the PD or thefthouse might be more complicated in the case of an NFA weapon.

 

[71montess]

The Boston Glob put out an article about the contagion effect of 2 recent celebrity suicides. Mental health officials are concerned about the effects it has on the young populations. Well Da , is this the same effect as young school shooters ???

 

[Horrible]

The Boston Glob put out an article about the contagion effect of 2 recent celebrity suicides. Mental health officials are concerned about the effects it has on the young populations. Well Da , is this the same effect as young school shooters ???

f*** the Glob. Let their self righteous writers come confiscate shit from law abiding patriots themselves or otherwise shut the f*** up and keep going to their f***ing cocktail parties

 

[Horrible]

The Boston Glob put out an article about the contagion effect of 2 recent celebrity suicides. Mental health officials are concerned about the effects it has on the young populations. Well Da , is this the same effect as young school shooters ???

Suicide will have no change. People will move away from guns and just jump off buildings or some shit

 

[Horrible]

lol and Maura started that trend on 7/20... a lot of people no longer respect the law at this point because she's basically shown that she sure as hell doesn't....

Why should anyone respect the lawr after7/20?!

 

[chindogg]

How about a 2 year mandatory sentence for taking out a frivolous ERPO.

How bout a 2.5 year sentence....................

 

[Reptile]

Ok, fine - you have to tell where the guns are...

Are they really going to allow you to travel to different states to collect them?

This seems like a big hassle.

What if they are buried in the ground and only you know where they are?

You MUST comply with the law so you can get the guns back in 12 months or else you'll lose the guns forever.

Will the police accept this idea:

"Officer, I know I must tell you where they are and I will to comply. Some of my guns are buried and I am willing to dig them up. However, it's going to take a couple days. I'll fully comply with your order if you give me time to collect the guns."

That sounds like a reasonable good faith effort to comply this this law which is actually quite unreasonable.

Meanwhile, if they give you a couple days to dig them up from out of state, you can just dig them up and transfer them to keep them from the bonded warehouse.

You can also set up the police for a wild goose chase.

Saw you buy 20 lowers and bury them all over New England.

It would take days or weeks to comply with the order.

 

[amm5061]

Suicide will have no change. People will move away from guns and just jump off buildings or some shit

Point in case, the last two celebrity suicides were by hanging.

Saw you buy 20 lowers and bury them all over New England.

If you buy 20 80% lowers (since that's all you can buy in MA according to Healey, and I'm not quite sure it's legal for gunshops out of state to sell you a lower) and eFA-10 them, you're an idiot.

Also pretty sure they're not going to give you time, but escort your ass around to the nearest jail cell for obstruction or some other made up shit.