Doctors and the guns in the house question...

[H-minus]

Here's what you don't understand. By asking questions that are neither relevant nor any of your business nor an area you're competent in, and documenting that in a medical record, you have already become one link in the chain in "compromising patient information in order to strip someone of their 2A rights".

Today we have HIPAA and private medicine. In 2020 we could have President Maura Healey, HIPAA could be dust, and socialized medicine could be getting off the ground. Do you have the control over those records so that you can destroy them if and when HHS wants them all put in a centralized EMR database? Would you be willing to go to jail to do so?

If you think through some of the worst things that have ever happened in history, do you think they were made possible by people who knew exactly what they were a part of? Or were there just millions of people each doing their individual jobs without taking a second to think about the chain of consequences that could follow as laws change and time passes?

The God complexes of people in medicine are astounding. My lawyer that doesn't try to delve into every aspect of my life where i may be putting myself in legal jeopardy. My mechanic doesn't try to delve into my driving habits when I get an oil change even though it affects my car. They're hired to do a job and they do it competently. Why do you think it's OK for you to dig into every nook and cranny of my life just because it's tangentially related to 'health'?

Ive explained exactly why I ask questions related to these things in previous posts. So Im not going to rehash them for a third time.

Second I dont record any of these things that are discussed in your health record. They are only asked to prompt discussion and questions that my patients may have of me. I sometimes can answer them I sometimes cant and you are under no obligation to answer anything I ask.

What I do have at my disposal are resources and support systems that many patients who may not be as self reliant as you are in need of. I dont know this until I ask.

Do you know of public programs that would install smoke detectors in your home free of charge if you were a senior on a limited income? Do you think this information will magically fall from the sky?

This isnt an oil change nor is it legal advice and conflating the two is fallacious. Its peoples lives that I do my best to improve every day I go to work.

If you dont like it feel free to go to Canada or the UK for your healthcare or dont go at all it makes no difference to me.

You can choose to answer "tangentially related" health questions or you dont have to. Its not like a provider is going to fire a patient for not wanting to discuss certain topics or report you to some sort of gestapo.

 

[namedpipes]

Ive explained exactly why I ask questions related to these things in previous posts. So Im not going to rehash them for a third time.
...

You haven't yet provided a valid answer for why a DOCTOR would ask NON MEDICAL questions...

 

[Picton]

You haven't yet provided a valid answer for why a DOCTOR would ask NON MEDICAL questions...

Define “valid.”

I’d humbly submit that his answers, including the several paragraphs you chose not to quote (hint: smoke detectors and the elderly) represent a guy trying to be honest and up-front about how preventive medicine works. It’s your choice to view them as “invalid,” but he’s not going to be able to get any clearer than he already has. So feel free to choose to ignore him.

He’s also saying you’re free not to answer the Dreaded Question, so guess what that means? If your DOCTOR asks NON MEDICAL questions, just don’t answer.

Again, why does this thread keep resurfacing monthly? It’s never productive. At the end of the day, in interacting with your healthcare people, just do what your conscience demands and quit whining about it here.

 

[Sparky123]

I have only been asked once about guns, it was during my annual physical several years ago. How did I respond ? I answered that question with another question. Doctor, did you know that doctors are the third leading cause of death in this country ? Medical mistakes kill far more people than guns ever will. After a moment of silence she went on to her next question.

 

[RumRunner]

quit whining about it here.

That would cut the post counts in half

 

[bill o]

I have only been asked once about guns, it was during my annual physical several years ago. How did I respond ? I answered that question with another question. Doctor, did you know that doctors are the third leading cause of death in this country ? Medical mistakes kill far more people than guns ever will. After a moment of silence she went on to her next question.

And the entire office started clapping.

 

[namedpipes]

Define “valid.”

I’d humbly submit that his answers, including the several paragraphs you chose not to quote (hint: smoke detectors and the elderly) represent a guy trying to be honest and up-front about how preventive medicine works. It’s your choice to view them as “invalid,” but he’s not going to be able to get any clearer than he already has. So feel free to choose to ignore him.

He’s also saying you’re free not to answer the Dreaded Question, so guess what that means? If your DOCTOR asks NON MEDICAL questions, just don’t answer.

Again, why does this thread keep resurfacing monthly? It’s never productive. At the end of the day, in interacting with your healthcare people, just do what your conscience demands and quit whining about it here.

I'm not whining. I'm bitching. There's a difference.

I don't answer those questions. When they ask (every year like clockwork) I comment that I don't find "those" sort of questions medically relevant and decline to answer.

Still, what is old hat to you or me is brand new to others. Why shouldn't newbs have a safe place where they can ask the questions that would get them funny looks or worse from their coworkers? YOU never had a naive question when you were a young sprout? If not on guns, perhaps one how boy parts and girl parts fit together. Or why doesn't Orange Juice go well in a bowl of cereal?

 

[Picton]

I'm not whining. I'm bitching. There's a difference.

I don't answer those questions. When they ask (every year like clockwork) I comment that I don't find "those" sort of questions medically relevant and decline to answer.

Still, what is old hat to you or me is brand new to others. Why shouldn't newbs have a safe place where they can ask the questions that would get them funny looks or worse from their coworkers? YOU never had a naive question when you were a young sprout? If not on guns, perhaps one how boy parts and girl parts fit together. Or why doesn't Orange Juice go well in a bowl of cereal?

Fair enough.

I just find it ironic when an Actual Medical Professional shows up, provides cogent and well-reasoned responses, and still gets “bitched” at because you don’t seem to like the answers.

 

[allen-1]

Yay for Massachusetts!!!

I wear my gun to my dr's office in Georgia. He doesn't seem to care; which makes sense since he belongs to my local club. He doesn't ask me any questions about guns in my house.

My optometrist up here has asked me not to let her new receptionist see me testing my new script out by checking my sight picture - but she says other than that she's a good receptionist.

 

[Sweeney]

First time asked; Yeah, sure. I have lots of guns in the house.
Next time asked; Not anymore, gave them out to all the kids in the neighborhood to play with.

 

[Roof gunner]

Why should the doctor even ask. Nobody else does. Does that get himself off the hook for asking Incase something goes wrong

 

[Supermoto]

My son's pediatrician asked if I had guns and if they were stored safely. I said yes, she said good, little kids get into everything. Then she asked if I had locks on my kitchen and bathroom cabinets. She wasn't concerned about guns, just that my son was living in a safe environment

 

[H-minus]

Define “valid.”

I’d humbly submit that his answers, including the several paragraphs you chose not to quote (hint: smoke detectors and the elderly) represent a guy trying to be honest and up-front about how preventive medicine works. It’s your choice to view them as “invalid,” but he’s not going to be able to get any clearer than he already has. So feel free to choose to ignore him.

He’s also saying you’re free not to answer the Dreaded Question, so guess what that means? If your DOCTOR asks NON MEDICAL questions, just don’t answer.

Again, why does this thread keep resurfacing monthly? It’s never productive. At the end of the day, in interacting with your healthcare people, just do what your conscience demands and quit whining about it here.

This.

All the way bro.

 

[H-minus]

^^^^ Well Doc, not in the house. I had too many guns for the house so I built a shed over a 30 ft deep circular well with a spiral staircase to store them. Easy access. The lead roof to prevent the aliens from spying on my guns required some engineering though. Oh, you’re not a spy, are you? Of course not, you’re my doctor. There is one issue, though, with the ammo. You see MA only allows 30,000 rounds in the home and I’ve got like 1,000,000 rounds stacked up in case of, you know, when the SHTF. BTW Doc, how are you prepped for the upcoming troubles? The ammo well isn’t working as good as the gun pit though. The problem is that I’ve got it stacked from smallest caliber to largest. Thus the 50 BMG is at the bottom of the well and I have to unpack everything to get to it to feed the Barrett when the bad guys come to get me in an MRAP. I’ve so got to come up with a different ammo plan! Hey Doc, did you ever fire a Barrett? WHAT A RUSH!
Thanks for asking about guns in the home,

An excellent answer.

Id probably ask if you wanted to go grab a beer after the appointment.

 

[eboos]

I would ask him what makes a doctor qualified tell you how to safely store firearms.

Well, the New England Journal of Medicine had determined that the number one cause of firearms injuries and deaths are bullets.

 

[LTCRN]

Just lie when it comes to the firearms question, it's easier than trying to play games with the medical staff. If you haven't noticed, many medical practices are being purchased by companies that have zero interest in medicine or your well being, just profits. The medical staff is being forced to work as quickly as possible under almost near impossible time constraints regarding your care. If they want to keep their jobs, they have to conform. When you play games with them, they end up having less time to treat you for the real problem why you are there. One solution is to politely tell them that you choose not to answer any non related medical questions and you just want to be seen by the doctor ASAP to get treatment for your problem.

 

[mbullism]

Guns in the house?...

only when I'm home-

 

[Shark_Cage]

I always have my questions written down and I ask them right after the handshake. He can then do what he needs to do. Indiscrimate tapping on the chest, finger up the ass and the nut juggeling.

 

[Eugenio.FV]

My son's pediatrician asked if I had guns and if they were stored safely. I said yes, she said good, little kids get into everything. Then she asked if I had locks on my kitchen and bathroom cabinets. She wasn't concerned about guns, just that my son was living in a safe environment

One of my closest friends used to be an anarcho-capitalist (I think), and as soon as he married a Democrat, he turned hard core democrat. My wife is pregnant, and so is his wife. The other day he tells me that before he lets his son play in my house, he will have to have a talk with me about "the gun". I just replied "well, are your knives, scissors, and household chemicals secure? Id want to know before I let my kid play in your house". Awkward silence ensued. I get it when its actually about security, and not just, cause guns.

 

[Len-2A Training]

I used to respond with "I don't care to answer that question", however nowadays I'm asked if I am still working (retired) and I respond honestly that I'm retired but do some part-time work, asked what I state that I'm a Constable and also a firearms instructor . . . so saying no to the gun question won't really work. The reactions I have gotten are usually "that's cool" or "I've shot with a friend/relative once/often" or "I've always wanted to learn to shoot". Surprisingly I've encountered no negative reactions at all.

My former (now retired) endodontist grew up in PA, big time hunter and used to bring all his medical staff in the operatory for me to talk about guns. My current endodontist always wanted to get his LTC and has talked for ~4 yrs now about organizing a class for his entire staff on their day off. He just has never nailed down a date to do it. But one of his nurses has her LTC and wants to learn more so next time in, I may take her aside and ask her to be the ringleader to make this happen. My new PCP grew up in Europe and hunts with Family when he visits them, etc.

In general I don't like answering the question but at my age, no kids/grandkids, two long-time married LTC-holders in the household, they don't make any speeches and it's not an issue on either side.

 

[devldog131]

My 5 year old daughter was the one who told our pediatrician that my wife and I kept guns at home!

And this is exactly why my 3 year-old and 7 year-old have been kept completely in the dark. They have no clue that there are guns in the house, and won't until I determine that their maturity levels are where they need to be.

The last thing I need is a lefty preschool or second grade teacher overhearing one of my daughters mentioning it and siccing the PC police and DCF on my family.

 

[Len-2A Training]

I just replied "well, are your knives, scissors, and household chemicals secure? Id want to know before I let my kid play in your house". Awkward silence ensued. I get it when its actually about security, and not just, cause guns.

My Wife's friend from NJ wanted to stay over at our house with a few of their grandchildren. I had to squash the idea after I explained to my Wife (and she to her friend) that we have poisonous chemicals under our sinks, in the stairwell to the basement, knives in drawers within reach in kitchen, etc. and I'm not securing my house from rug rats. We've been in a restaurant with these animals and they needed to hose down the area with a fire hose after we left. Grandparents are oblivious to their grandkids getting into everything and gooing up everything they touched.

 

[jct61765]

Ive explained exactly why I ask questions related to these things in previous posts. So Im not going to rehash them for a third time.

Second I dont record any of these things that are discussed in your health record. They are only asked to prompt discussion and questions that my patients may have of me. I sometimes can answer them I sometimes cant and you are under no obligation to answer anything I ask.

What I do have at my disposal are resources and support systems that many patients who may not be as self reliant as you are in need of. I dont know this until I ask.

Do you know of public programs that would install smoke detectors in your home free of charge if you were a senior on a limited income? Do you think this information will magically fall from the sky?

This isnt an oil change nor is it legal advice and conflating the two is fallacious. Its peoples lives that I do my best to improve every day I go to work.

If you dont like it feel free to go to Canada or the UK for your healthcare or dont go at all it makes no difference to me.

You can choose to answer "tangentially related" health questions or you dont have to. Its not like a provider is going to fire a patient for not wanting to discuss certain topics or report you to some sort of gestapo.

Or find a doctor that doesn't pry into my life. If I want to know about smoke detectors I'll go to the fire department. What would you do if you brought you car in to get fixed and I asked you if you were wearing your seatbelts? Or you bring a carpenter into your house to build something and he starts asking you about your smoke detectors or if you feel safe in the house all by yourself.

 

[Cowgirlup]

Fair enough.

I just find it ironic when an Actual Medical Professional shows up, provides cogent and well-reasoned responses, and still gets “bitched” at because you don’t seem to like the answers.

I understand your point and the intentions are good. However with that logic I guess you don't mind any so called medical professional asking you whatever questions they want because it's for your own good, might be helpful and just in case you aren't too bright.

It's a slippery slope when you just accept that someone deemed a professional has the right to ask and potentially know anything they want....for your own good.

 

[ILikeGlocks]

Me: "I would like my lead levels tested"
Dr: "We usually only do that for babies"
Me: "I have hobbies that require direct handling of lead"
Dr: "Oh, what hobby?"
Me: "Uh, I, uh... cast figurines..." ** Awkward Face **

 

[Picton]

I understand your point and the intentions are good. However with that logic I guess you don't mind any so called medical professional asking you whatever questions they want because it's for your own good, might be helpful and just in case you aren't too bright.

It's a slippery slope when you just accept that someone deemed a professional has the right to ask and potentially know anything they want....for your own good.

I never said he couldn’t ask. But then, I accept the notion that my kindly old physician is NOT the vanguard of some sort of shadowy UN cabal out to hustle me into an unmarked helicopter some night because he’s a representative of the Vast Anti-Gun Conspiracy.

No. He’s just a guy doing a job. He can ask me whatever the hell he wants. And if I don’t like it, I’ll find someone else without 116 posts’ worth of Internet hand-wringing.

It’s my right not to answer. It’s my right to answer. It’s my right to lie. Those things are all up to me. Why I’d want to come onto NES and start a thread about it is WAAAAY beyond my comprehension.

 

[JohnZ]

Well, I had my annual physical today and got the "Are there firearms in the house?" question. I wanted to say no, but my wife and I see the same doctor and she previously answered yes when she got asked. I reluctantly said yes because I knew the doctor already knew the answer. Then came the follow up questions... are they locked up, is the ammo locked up separate from the guns, yadda, yadda.

I told the doctor I didn't want this added to my medical record, and she said it wouldn't be and that it was for her "own personal notes". I don't believe that, but there's not much I can do about that now. I really wanted to say no and none of your business, but I'm sure she would have called me out on it, especially after my wife saying the opposite.

Moral of the story... don't see the same doctor as your spouse!

In this day and age of computerization it would be easy to link doctor's databases to find inconsistent information. Hey look Bob, we have a "firearms" and a "no firearms" for the same location. Hit the ERPO button...

 

[cams]

H-Minus I don’t know you and you may be the nicest guy around, I don’t know that either, but your posts in this thread about asking those types of questions to your patients comes across (to me anyway) as presumptuous and pompous.

If you’re treating any patient over the age of 15 and thinking that they’re such dolts that they don’t know about smoke detectors, seat belts or what have you, and that they need you to educate them of these newest life inventions and/or how they handle or secure their firearms at home for their own kids safety, outside of what’s ailing them at the moment and what they’re paying you for specifically, I’d have to say you’re fooling yourself about your own self worth in regards to your patients. That’s all I got. Take it with a grain of salt because I can be an ass too sometimes.

 

[JackOfAllTrades]

Me: "I would like my lead levels tested"
Dr: "We usually only do that for babies"
Me: "I have hobbies that require direct handling of lead"
Dr: "Oh, what hobby?"
Me: "Uh, I, uh... cast figurines..." ** Awkward Face **

I said "possible occupational exposure". Lots of old telecom wiring is in lead sheaths.

Some other possible excuses you could try...

Stained glass work still uses solder and lead cane.

Casting pewter. Actually, there isn't supposed to be any lead in pewter, but most people don't know that.

Casting fishing sinkers.

Refinishing old furniture... you never know what is in the old finishes.

Machining metals - free machining brass and steel have lead in them.

Building a pipe organ - the pipes are a tin lead alloy that you pour on a marble slab to make sheets.

 

[greencobra]

my doc knows I have guns. they ask me if i'm happy. I will be when that 2 cases of ammo gets delivered! I seed my read issues of gun magazines throughout the office. beats 3 year old people magazines.