Deputy at Florida school 'never went in' during shooting, sheriff says

And running in a loop through their minds is “F*ck this noise. I don’t get paid enough for this sh/t. “Get home safely” is starting to make a lot of sense.”

Sometimes yes, sometimes no, there’s still a lot of good men and women out there who would’ve entered without hesitating to save those kids. Police and non-police also if given the chance.
 
Can you blame him?

A service pistol versus an AR?

Yeah. With a school full of kids at steak, I don't see why a trained officer with a high cap handgun would hesitate. Since when does a handgun inside a building constitute a handycap or disadvantage against a rifle in a building.
 
I won't feel the slightest sadness if we hear in the next few days that he had a "gun cleaning accident" and washed his own mouth out with a JHP.
 
I won't feel the slightest sadness if we hear in the next few days that he had a "gun cleaning accident" and washed his own mouth out with a JHP.
While we’re on the subject of cops shooting themselves would it be OK if I made a quick run through the Police Serving and Protecting thread and picked out a few cops?
 
He didn’t just resign, he retired.

"As is his right, Scot Peterson chose to resign, because he has the necessary time with the agency and meets the requirements of retirement, he resigned and retired."

"We're not going to disclose the video at this time, and we may never disclose the video depending on the prosecution and the criminal case."
"He Never Went In": Officer On Duty Filmed "Doing Nothing" During Florida Shooting

I’m sure he’ll have a long, peaceful and stress free retirement. After he gets over the pile of dead kids on his conscience of course.
 
... there’s still a lot of good men and women out there who would’ve entered without hesitating to save those kids. Police and non-police also if given the chance.

This ^ So much this ^.
I know in my heart that the men and women that made this country great and would protect it with their lives, are still among us.
Bravery is not lost to Our Past, it is Our Bright Future, Our Birthright.
You have only to look at JrROTC Cadet Peter Wang who did the Right Thing. There are worse things than death...

iu
 
Don't cops have AR's in their squad cars?? Couldn't he have simply gone out to said vehicle and retrieved his AR and THEN gone in and done his F'ing job??

Some do, some don’t. It’s possible his car, if he’s even issued a dept vehicle (he may have to drive to and from the school each day in his POV) was parked a 1/4 mile away, that’s a very large school campus there. I’m not defending him by any means, just trying to paint you a clearer picture.

Edited to add, I’m not familiar with that area, but being a school resource officer is probably akin to a retirement gig in a sleepy community. Sometimes the least likely to take action officers are put in the least likely to need action positions, clearly that is not the case anymore and should’ve been addressed some time ago.
 
Let’s stop the nonsense.

1. It’s not even true. Cops are routinely NOT held responsible for rounds they shoot, even in situations where they shouldn’t be shooting anyways.

2. I doubt a cop actively engaging a school shooter would even be questioned.
Do we even know about how many from the Pulse Night Club shooting were shot by cops yet?



Exactly what I don’t want to happen is a cop hiding allowing someone to murder 17 people without resistance.



Wow.

I’m not arguing past events, I’m stating what I teach and how it should be taught, to not go emptying mags without a clear threat and clear target to mitigate friendly casualties. I’m just one man trying to teach them the right way, don’t ball me up over the entirety of the US state of policing.

My statement about it being a shit sandwich was to say that cops still have to go in and do it the best they can even if it is. Not to hide, not to cower, take your training and your tools and go get it done smartly. I think you may have misunderstood my meaning. Regardless, I’m not the pin cushion for your anger, I’m trying to add some actual experience of responding to these things and clearing up the picture a little for everyone’s understanding of just how f**ked up this was handled.
 
The issue with this is that the officers are responsible for every round that comes out of their firearms. So if you’re joe bag of donuts the cop and you’re emptying mags down a looong school hallway without having a clear and good shot, those rounds have to stop somewhere, and with kids and teachers hunkering down in every room how many of those pistol rounds fired inaccurately down a hallway are going to stop in a child or a teacher.

Exactly what we don’t want to happen and even though they (cops) have only seconds or moments to think, act and fire under a high degree of stress, the DA’s and investigators will have weeks and months to go over every single detail of the ballistics and forensics and God help you if 3,4,5 or any of those victims come back to your service weapon.

It’s a shit sandwich any way you look at it, sometimes you just have to cover it with ketchup and eat the f**king thing.

I've been told by multiple instructors, there's a good chance you're going to hit a kid in this type of situation. You'll have to live with it, as long as you stop the attacker, it's a numbers game.

I know it would get all blown up here, but if one kid gets hit (odds of dieing from a pistol are very low ~4%) and you save 30, I'd call it a 'win'. It sucks, but you saved 30.

edit: I'd call this guy a coward to his face and hope he swung.
 
You’re shitting me.

Not to go all “it’s for the children!” on this, but INNOCENT PEOPLE GOT MURDERED BY AN ANIMAL. While this Dudley Do-right just sat there and listened. Hell doesn’t have a fire hot enough.

If his first thought was to go CYA and worry about blue-on-blue from his service weapon, then he lacks the intestinal fortitude for this work.

Frankly, I hope the memory of the screams never gives him a moment’s peace. “God help you if?” You’ve got to be kidding.

Again I think you’re misunderstanding me, I never said he shouldn’t have gone in, just the opposite in fact, read my other posts where I also condemned him for being a coward

What I stated was what I teach my students, in an effort to remind them to use good trigger discipline and target identification before going in and spraying and praying. That was my only point. Letting them know that yes they’re going to be scared shitless, but even still, swallow down the adrenaline and act SMARTLY, but act you must.
 
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Can you blame him?

A service pistol versus an AR?
Alvin York:
During an attack (Meuse-Argonne) by his battalion to capture German positions near Hill 223 (49.28558°N 4.95242°E) along the Decauville rail-line north of Chatel-Chéhéry, France, on October 8, 1918, York's actions earned him the Medal of Honor.[17] He recalled:[18]

The Germans got us, and they got us right smart. They just stopped us dead in our tracks. Their machine guns were up there on the heights overlooking us and well hidden, and we couldn't tell for certain where the terrible heavy fire was coming from ... And I'm telling you they were shooting straight. Our boys just went down like the long grass before the mowing machine at home. Our attack just faded out ... And there we were, lying down, about halfway across [the valley] and those German machine guns and big shells getting us hard.

Under the command of Sergeant Bernard Early, four non-commissioned officers, including recently promoted Cpl. York,[19] and thirteen privates were ordered to infiltrate the German lines to take out the machine guns. The group worked their way behind the Germans and overran the headquarters of a German unit, capturing a large group of German soldiers who were preparing a counter-attack against the U.S. troops. Early's men were contending with the prisoners when machine gun fire suddenly peppered the area, killing six Americans[20] and wounding three others.[21] The fire came from German machine guns on the ridge. The loss of the nine put Corporal York in charge of the seven remaining U.S. soldiers.[22] As his men remained under cover, guarding the prisoners, York worked his way into position to silence the German machine guns. York recalled:[23]

And those machine guns were spitting fire and cutting down the undergrowth all around me something awful. And the Germans were yelling orders. You never heard such a racket in all of your life. I didn't have time to dodge behind a tree or dive into the brush... As soon as the machine guns opened fire on me, I began to exchange shots with them. There were over thirty of them in continuous action, and all I could do was touch the Germans off just as fast as I could. I was sharp shooting... All the time I kept yelling at them to come down. I didn't want to kill any more than I had to. But it was they or I. And I was giving them the best I had.

During the assault, six German soldiers in a trench near York charged him with fixed bayonets. York had fired all the rounds in his M1917 Enfield rifle,[24] but drew his M1911 semi-automatic pistol[25] and shot all six soldiers before they could reach him.[26]

German First Lieutenant Paul Jürgen Vollmer, commander of the First Battalion, 120th Landwehr Infantry, emptied his pistol trying to kill York while he was contending with the machine guns. Failing to injure York, and seeing his mounting losses, he offered in English to surrender the unit to York, who accepted.[27] By the end of the engagement, York and his seven men marched 132 German prisoners back to the American lines. Upon returning to his unit, York reported to his brigade commander, Brigadier General Julian Robert Lindsey, who remarked "Well York, I hear you have captured the whole damn German army." York replied "No sir. I got only 132." [bow]
 
The issue with this is that the officers are responsible for every round that comes out of their firearms.
Really? Seems they will fling lead around everywhere when theres no one to shoot back. Nothing really happens to them, towns and cities taxpayers may get hammered with paying off the lawsuits, but for the actual cops, nothing.

I really dont think that was why he wouldnt go in.
 
ftr...I didn't say I wouldn't do my best to thwart the attack...I was saying that 95% of people would probably say 'eff this, above my paygrade.'

i know nothing of the situation, but if he was told to hold fast for backup than he probably did the right thing. two sets of eyes on any situation is probably better than 100% of an advantage over a single person.

i haven't seen so much as a news clip on this whole thing I care so little...so please excuse my ignorance.

all you washed up middle aged keyboard warriors out there feel free to flame 'me' for being a coward (even though I wasn't talking about ME) when you've probably never done a damn heroic thing in your life either...and would VERY likely do the same damn thing this sheriff did. I forget how tough all you guys are here (sarcasm).

some of the guys on this site are REAL bad asses...me, i've never even had a chance to prove myself in a situation that would require me to act one way or the other...so I won't pretend like I would automatically go into BAMF mode and B-line for the shooter and tear his jugular out with my teeth. I would HOPE that I would fall back on training and wouldn't even have to think about anything. but then again, one never knows until faced with a situation like that.

i think a lot of you guys out there would learn a lot about yourselves the next time you're at the range...put your pistol down on the firing line and back up 10 paces...do side straddle hops (jumping jacks) for 1 single minute...no rest time, step up to your pistol and try to get a round on paper...not so easy anymore with all that adrenaline in your body is it? lost some acute motor function in your extremities, did you?

yes...I'm a Marine...a 7+ year reservist POG with no time in combat and a single 'deployment' to Japan. I don't pretend to be anything I'm not...but i'll let those of you here that think of yourself as bad asses continue to live your pipe dreams (does NOT apply to everyone, obviously).
 
Don't cops have AR's in their squad cars?? Couldn't he have simply gone out to said vehicle and retrieved his AR and THEN gone in and done his F'ing job??
Is that really his "job" though. It always appears to me its containment then clean up. Could be wrong. How long did it take for LEO to get into the Florida night club? The conflicting times for Los Vegas ,
No one really knows what they will do until faced with danger.
My great uncle said many lined up to die in WWII with little fight and many fought knowing they would die. Only you can decide what you will do when faced with such things.
 
I've been told by multiple instructors, there's a good chance you're going to hit a kid in this type of situation. You'll have to live with it, as long as you stop the attacker, it's a numbers game.

I know it would get all blown up here, but if one kid gets hit (odds of dieing from a pistol are very low ~4%) and you save 30, I'd call it a 'win'. It sucks, but you saved 30.

edit: I'd call this guy a coward to his face and hope he swung.

Sure it’s possible, but personally I’d never tell them that during training. I’d rather teach them to suck it up, get inside, be smart, communicate, use their body armor properly (it can be used wrong) use good trigger and target discipline to avoid that as your rounds may go through a wall and hit innocents if they’re not hitting the threat, there is no spray and pray here, make sure you can hit what you’re shooting at or keep moving toward the threat until you can, even if you’re hit, doesn’t mean your dead, deal with that later, keep closing the distance and do your job.
 
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Sure it’s possible, but personally I’d never tell them that during training. I’d rather teach them to suck it up, get inside, be smart, communicate, use their body armor properly (it can be used wrong) use good trigger and target discipline and remember that we’re not in Iraq, this is America, there is no spray and pray here, make sure you can hit what you’re shooting at or keep moving toward the threat until you can, even if you’re hit, doesn’t mean your dead, deal with that later, keep closing the distance and do your job.

To each their own.
 
i think a lot of you guys out there would learn a lot about yourselves the next time you're at the range...put your pistol down on the firing line and back up 10 paces...do side straddle hops (jumping jacks) for 1 single minute...no rest time, step up to your pistol and try to get a round on paper...not so easy anymore with all that adrenaline in your body is it? lost some acute motor function in your extremities, did you?

Your first comment was somewhat understandable but there is really no excuse for inaction in this situation.

One thing you can be certain of is that deputy likely never boasted if he were present at a school shooting he would cower until it was over.
 
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I’m not arguing past events, I’m stating what I teach and how it should be taught, to not go emptying mags without a clear threat and clear target to mitigate friendly casualties. I’m just one man trying to teach them the right way, don’t ball me up over the entirety of the US state of policing.


I liked your first post and that’s what I gathered from it. Your second post seemed like you were bringing up possible reasons for him acting how he did. One of which being afraid to hit others because he’s responsible for all rounds fired. That’s demonstratably not true.

My statement about it being a shit sandwich was to say that cops still have to go in and do it the best they can even if it is. Not to hide, not to cower, take your training and your tools and go get it done smartly. I think you may have misunderstood my meaning.

I did misunderstand. Thanks for clarifying.

Regardless, I’m not the pin cushion for your anger, I’m trying to add some actual experience of responding to these things and clearing up the picture a little for everyone’s understanding of just how f**ked up this was handled.

I do appreciate your insight.
 
Really? Seems they will fling lead around everywhere when theres no one to shoot back. Nothing really happens to them, towns and cities taxpayers may get hammered with paying off the lawsuits, but for the actual cops, nothing.

I really dont think that was why he wouldnt go in.

I don’t think that’s why he didn’t go in either, I think he was a huge pussy is his only excuse.

I guess I didn’t explain my post so well, I’ll take the heat for it as a couple others commented on it also and all seemed to have misunderstood what I was saying when I’m fact I agree with them.

My intent was not to give him an excuse for not going in, but to try and teach the students that I have to not just start shooting every f**king which way like a bunch of undisciplined clowns because the place is filled with kids and teachers and they have to keep in mind that if they start emptying mags they may be helping this a**h*** shooter do his job, so be smart about it and make sure you can hit him when you fire or if not then use your training and armor and keep closing the distance until you can.

Maybe here’s a better example, I teach quite a bit of prior service folks, and in the service we’re taught to use suppressive fire at times to help with flanking and closing distance, and that CANNOT be used here, you can’t go into a school full of kids suppressing hallways to get across the danger zones. Hopefully have corrected what I thought was a clear post but caused some confusion on what I was getting at.
 
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I liked your first post and that’s what I gathered from it. Your second post seemed like you were bringing up possible reasons for him acting how he did. One of which being afraid to hit others because he’s responsible for all rounds fired. That’s demonstratably not true.



I did misunderstand. Thanks for clarifying.



I do appreciate your insight.

I was absolutely not making excuses for this a**h***. He should suck start a shotgun as others have said. I’d load it for him. My post must have been confusing as it got the opposite effect of what I meant. All good here.
 
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