Thats actually what I plan on doing this Friday. I have an eotech on my ar right now, but I'm going to throw a 16x scope on it and see what kind of accuracy I can get. Should be fun, I'm going to bring 5-6 different types of ammo.
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Degraded Ballistics with a Scratched Bullet?
- Thread starter SubieGuy4
- Start date
![[laugh]](/xen/styles/default/xenforo/smilies.vb/012.gif "Laugh [laugh]")
Even if scratches affected the accuracy of the bullet, it wouldn’t be enough of a change to cause a problem in a self defense situation. With a SHTF get home situation I still can’t fathom a scenario where you need to take 250 yard shots. If the situation did arise where you did have to make distance shots, the fact it’s a combat situation and stress is involved, scratches on the bullet are the least of your accuracy problems.
Why not just test it the way you normally use it? If the ammo makes a difference, you should still see it.
I practice with my AR at distances of 10-250 yards. If I only ever planned on needing to defend myself inside 30 yards, it's stick to a pistol or use a shotgun, which is more effective with fewer shots.
My reason for posting this was mostly academic. To everyone saying it doesn't matter at strictly-self-defense distances, of course it doesn't. It doesn't matter anywhere inside 100 yards. I'm curious if it matters at 250-500. There are hundreds of weapons that work well inside 100. Part of why I like ARs is that they're good from 10-500, so if I'm going to pose an academic question about accuracy, I'm thinking on the farther end of that.
I only have access to 100 yards but in ther name of science I will sacrifice a few rounds in testing this weekend.
I want to try some different bullets in my "varmint" build. I will do a 3 shot group test between the 3 loads I want to try if I have time...... or I will damage 3 fromt the best group out of the test groups.
Im trying 75gn Amax and 75gn MatchKings out of this rifle along with some 55gn FMJ. If I can get out to 200 yds this weekend I will try it at 200....just for the heck of it.... Of course I will be testing from a rifle rest as I can not shoot 1" groups with out it. I figure you can get a good Idea of whats going to happen to the bullet as you go further out with the 100 yard results.
Update: Ok so I decided to load 10 rounds of a known 1moa load for my varmint rifle. I I weighed out the cases,bullets and powder to as tight as I could get.
10 LC 11 nato cases within +/- .2 grains...... not easy with this lot of brass
10 Nosler Custom Comp 77gn all spot on.
weighed out each powder charge to 22 grains of varget.
Not the most comprehensive test but im short on time and its going to be cold and very bright on the range with all the snow.
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OK I think I matched your damage and then some... going out in the AM running the K31 in the cmp shoot then the ARs. I will do the test right away.
it does not show well but I dinged the tips up a bit also
it does not show well but I dinged the tips up a bit also
MisterHappy
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Shoot twice. If the first bullet has degraded accuracy, then the second will do better, as it's pristine.
Ok so I did my test, I will start by saying after shooting the CMP match my eyes where burnt! man was it bright out there. I use a shooting Rx so no sunglasses for me today. I dont need them for scope work but by then burnt out, cold fingers numb so I did the best I could. 3 shots 3 groups from lower left going clock wise
lower left good ammo , upper left scratched ammo,upper right good ammo. The lower right is a group from a friends kid I let him shoot some 55 plinkers he put 2 shots over on my test group before he figured out what right lower is. I was watching through the spotting scope so I knew which shots where which.
I shot the test groups 1 shot each into each target going around clock wise. May not be the best test but being tired cold and eyes not 100% might mimic your scenario a bit better.....my short conclusion....aint gonna really matter much if your trying to fight your way home still minute of hit on target I think is the best most of would even do under any kind of "battle" stress. I doubt most of us would even focus on the front sight correctly or even be able to have a breath pause in anything but match conditions.
heres a few more groups with other loads I tried....... some really sucked today.
lower left is my standard load for this rifle. The scope has yet to be truley dialed in. Im waiting on some other bullets to come in. eventually I will have this set up for some ballistic tip varmint bullets.
Lower left 75gn match....little verticle stringing there.... by this time I was really cold.
top left 75 amax loaded .020 off the lands...... sucked as I test more for the AR with wylder chamber im finding loading long doest work well
top right amax loaded to Hornady load data little better but I think the Amax like to be pushed faster. same barrel on my service rifle I shoot these a bit hotter and they group nice 1" groups.
lower right 55gn hornady FMJ loaded with varget to hornady max....not to shabby for FMJ.
My conclusion for today. Amax bullets seem to like to be pushed fast out of ARs
A few scratches and dents are not going to show much degradation especially under stress.
I need to work on loads in nicer weather.....im now going to try and recover from the snowblindness
I hope to get a better scope for target work by end of the summer, built this gun to go out coyote hunting so the hunting scope stays for now.
lower left good ammo , upper left scratched ammo,upper right good ammo. The lower right is a group from a friends kid I let him shoot some 55 plinkers he put 2 shots over on my test group before he figured out what right lower is. I was watching through the spotting scope so I knew which shots where which.
I shot the test groups 1 shot each into each target going around clock wise. May not be the best test but being tired cold and eyes not 100% might mimic your scenario a bit better.....my short conclusion....aint gonna really matter much if your trying to fight your way home still minute of hit on target I think is the best most of would even do under any kind of "battle" stress. I doubt most of us would even focus on the front sight correctly or even be able to have a breath pause in anything but match conditions.
heres a few more groups with other loads I tried....... some really sucked today.
lower left is my standard load for this rifle. The scope has yet to be truley dialed in. Im waiting on some other bullets to come in. eventually I will have this set up for some ballistic tip varmint bullets.
Lower left 75gn match....little verticle stringing there.... by this time I was really cold.
top left 75 amax loaded .020 off the lands...... sucked as I test more for the AR with wylder chamber im finding loading long doest work well
top right amax loaded to Hornady load data little better but I think the Amax like to be pushed faster. same barrel on my service rifle I shoot these a bit hotter and they group nice 1" groups.
lower right 55gn hornady FMJ loaded with varget to hornady max....not to shabby for FMJ.
My conclusion for today. Amax bullets seem to like to be pushed fast out of ARs
A few scratches and dents are not going to show much degradation especially under stress.
I need to work on loads in nicer weather.....im now going to try and recover from the snowblindness
I hope to get a better scope for target work by end of the summer, built this gun to go out coyote hunting so the hunting scope stays for now.
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Thanks for the very cool write up. I love posts like these.
What app are you using to measure group sizes?
It's the free version of on target http://www.ontargetshooting.com/download1.html
It's easy to use. One thing though is you need to set the "reference" when you do a a group.
I place something of a known size on the target or draw a 1/2" line. I found smaller reference to be better. 1/2" or so does fine for my needs.
If you do not set the reference you get strange results.
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