Dagger with no guard, thoughts?

[Mass-diver]

Unsafe, stupid design or totally fine as long as you have a strong grip and good technique?

Winkler Tactical Dagger - Walnut Sculpted - Ridgerunner Blades

The WK Tactical Dagger was designed by an active member of an US Tier 1 Military Unit to do what double edged blades are intended to do. This is a no frills tool, created for professionals who know how to use it. *Sculpting not available on rubber handles Knife Specifications Blade steel...

ridgerunnerblades.com

 

[Sterg]

Usually there is something for a guard, whether it’s integral or soldered on. So many custom knife makers to choose from these days.

 

[Mass-diver]

Usually there is something for a guard, whether it’s integral or soldered on. So many custom knife makers to choose from these days.

Ya, I own a winkler hawk and it’s nice, but I’m just not sure about their daggers.

 

[ReluctantDecoy]

How you supposed to parry a rapier with that?

 

[not new guy]

Pass

 

[Mountain]

Ya, I own a winkler hawk and it’s nice, but I’m just not sure about their daggers.

View attachment 715215

My take is dumb idea to skip at least some sort of minimal guard or grip design that keeps fingers off the blade if it might ever be used for self defense. Based on cleaning a lot of game once you start poking flesh and guts things get slippery. Could have at least put a little flare at the blade end of the handle.

 

[June4th]

Is it a common occurrence that stabbers often cut themselves? No guard seems to just beg to cut yourself.

 

[not new guy]

A guard will also help prevent the knife from going too far in, particularly for a dagger.

 

[whatluck]

i see this design occasionally. its the knife equivalent of carrying a .32 hold out pistol. you can't really fight with it, but as a deep concealment last ditch weapon it works. i usually carry 2 knives, one for utility and one no-compromise design for fighting, and don't see a void to fill with this. At least it has a heavily textured handle, unlike the Randall guardless dagger, which is beautiful and slippery.

Model 24 - Guardian

4" blade of 3/16" stainless steel stock. 7/8" width. Blade sharpened approximately 2 1/2" with 1" of thumb notches standard on top and bottom. Nickel silver reduced hilt. Approximately 3 3/4" black Micarta handle - 3/4" thick. Micarta handles are also available in maroon, ivorite, or green...

www.randallknives.com

usually knives with no handguard are made to be used with a shield. you're not parrying, you're not carrying a shield, so this only works as a 'don't touch my gun' knife. i like the karambit for this better

 

[chopper_man]

How's it any "less safe" than any pocket knife or double edge OTF knife?

 

[Randy Lahey]

I have these in my collection, they're pretty cool but the lack of guard and sharp edges make you think. I'd go with the Fairbairn-Sykes or Gerber Mk2 if I had to use a dagger for some reason. I do like Winkler knives though. Wish I could find a rubber handled Operator (ETA: okay, yeah that sounds wrong).

Entrek Bullet

SOG Pentagon

 

[ReluctantDecoy]

How's it any "less safe" than any pocket knife or double edge OTF knife?

I think by virtue of self-classifying as a dagger, it is implied to be a thrusting weapon, where a hilt would be useful as a handstop. But if you were just using either side of the blade for craft work or daily chores, it is probably no more dangerous to the user than any other pocket knife. It would, however, then be an unusual pick for that type of work. So this is kind of a blade with no distinct function.

 

[Sterg]

Ya, I own a winkler hawk and it’s nice, but I’m just not sure about their daggers.

View attachment 715215

Daniel Winkler is one of the better or more reputable makers. He’s been at it for a while. I had a Winkler collaboration once. It was a Damascus, slightly Persian style boot knife. The sheath was a pocket sheath that looked like a glasses case. If I remember right, there was nothing in the form of a guard. Yes I kick myself for trading it away.

 

[greencobra]

i had a gerber boot knife back in the day in this style. it's only as good as the grip for the design to work.

 

[whatluck]

How's it any "less safe" than any pocket knife or double edge OTF knife?

If it's a fighting blade it needs a guard so you can parry. It's a core technique to close distance or make space. I would have to retrain to fight with a knife with no guard. If you were to parry a club strike with that it would almost certainly result in a broken hand. Same against another knife and you'd lose some fingers. If you stab and hit something hard the knife will stop and your hand continue, cutting your hand mixing the person's blood whom you just stabbed with your own.

 

[Mass-diver]

In

If it's a fighting blade it needs a guard so you can parry. It's a core technique to close distance or make space. I would have to retrain to fight with a knife with no guard. If you were to parry a club strike with that it would almost certainly result in a broken hand. Same against another knife and you'd lose some fingers. If you stab and hit something hard the knife will stop and your hand continue, cutting your hand mixing the person's blood whom you just stabbed with your own.

Ya, that’s what makes this knife so strange. Winkler makes stuff for SEALs and claims this was designed for SOF, but the design just seems to make no sense as it clearly is designed solely for stabbing

 

[Sterg]

More of a shiv than a dagger

 

[Mountain]

More of a shiv than a dagger

I was thinking the same.

 

[Mountain]

How's it any "less safe" than any pocket knife or double edge OTF knife?

The Gerber Applegate Fairbairn at least has the heavily grooved cut outs for a secure grip and a means to keep your jand from slipping onto the blade.

 

[Sterg]

i had a gerber boot knife back in the day in this style. it's only as good as the grip for the design to work.

I had one of those. I loved it. The tip was serrated. They used the larger ones in Viet Nam if I remember right.

 

[Sterg]

The Gerber Applegate Fairbairn at least has the heavily grooved cut outs for a secure grip and a means to keep your jand from slipping onto the blade.

View attachment 715333

I’ve always liked those. They’re on my list for future purchases.

 

[cams]

Ka-Bar EK44 Ek Commando Model 4 - Knives for Sale

Ka-Bar EK44 Ek Commando Model 4. Made with 1095 Cro-Van steel it has a 6 5/8" parkerized double-edged spear point blade and an 12 5/8" OAL.

oldetownecutlery.com

Here’s a nice one for fairly short money.

 

[Andy in NH]

The Scottish Sgian-Dubh (skee-ən-DOO) "Black or Hidden Knife" is a dagger with no guard that was designed for concealed or low profile carry.

Typically it is worn tucked into the top of the kilt hose (tall socks) on the same side as the dominant hand, but they have also been concealed in the armpit.

Tradition and etiquette in Scotland called for leaving longer weapons (Claymore, axes, pole arms, spears, etc.) at the door when visiting or being a guest inside a home.

Carrying a Sgian-Dubh allowed one to still be armed and unnoticed while sitting at a table while enjoying whisky and haggis.

(Today we might do the same thing with our rifles and shotguns; leave them nearby, but still have a pistol on our person.)

Most of today's Sgian-Dubhs are ceremonial in nature; they are just mock ups or drones (pointy, but with a dull edge).



My Sgian-Dubh is a custom by Ken Brock and I really like it.

It has some contour to the grip, but no guard really to speak of.

I haven't had the chance to carry it with my kilt yet, but I look forward to doing so soon.

 

[Sterg]

Ka-Bar EK44 Ek Commando Model 4 - Knives for Sale

Ka-Bar EK44 Ek Commando Model 4. Made with 1095 Cro-Van steel it has a 6 5/8" parkerized double-edged spear point blade and an 12 5/8" OAL.

oldetownecutlery.com

Here’s a nice one for fairly short money.
View attachment 715435

Not too many years ago they were selling Eks all over the place. They’re probably worth some collector value now.
* edit* I just went to the Ek website. I guess Kabar either bought them out or they were collaborating for a while if I remember right. They have some special editions of the commando with the wooden handles. One of the manufacturer, either Ek or Applegate had little compartments in the scales when you unscrewed them you could stash fishing line and hooks and stuff.

 

[cams]

These look just like the Scottish Sgian-Dubh I think. Pretty small too.

 

[cams]

Not too many years ago they were selling Eks all over the place. They’re probably worth some collector value now.
* edit* I just went to the Ek website. I guess Kabar either bought them out or they were collaborating for a while if I remember right. They have some special editions of the commando with the wooden handles. One of the manufacturer, either Ek or Applegate had little compartments in the scales when you unscrewed them you could stash fishing line and hooks and stuff.

I never had an EK, they do look nice, that one actually popped up in an email right after I read this thread so I had to post it. Hoping somebody else will buy one and I can live vicariously thru their knife pics here. lol

 

[Randy Lahey]

Ek One (not mine sadly)

 

[BTSDOG]

This bit off of their site explains it...........

"This is a no frills tool, created for professionals who know how to use it."