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Crypto currency discussion

Discussion in 'Off-Topic' started by Olympus Racing, Nov 26, 2017.

  1. Olympus Racing

    Olympus Racing

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    Anyone investing in this?
    Do you guys think this the future or a great scam?
     

  2. Reptile

    Reptile NES Member

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    I'd be afraid to invest in BitCoin.

    What if there is some quantum leap in computers that lets hackers crash the system?

    That said, I SURE wish I did buy BitCoin a long time ago...

    But not that long ago...

    BitCoin wallet Mt. Gox was hacked and $400,000,000 was stolen.

    That is worth over a Trillion dollars now.

    Will crypto currencies be the future?

    Your guess is as good as mine.

    Funny how the major banks say it's all a scam - yet the have invested hundreds of millions in it.

    Early adopters like WikiLeaks are laughing all the way to the bank.
     
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  3. JJ4

    JJ4 NES Member

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    Bitcoin uses too much power. It will need to evolve or it will die. They have tried to fork it already but no success so far. There are too many competing other coins out there so if it dies the whole idea will be fractured.

    Gamble with it if you want. Don't "invest". That said, I wish I had bought some at 500 and sold them today.

    http://www.businessinsider.com/bitcoin-mining-electricity-usage-2017-11
     
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  4. CRSIII

    CRSIII

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    What? The old scam not good enough?
     
  5. GM-GUY

    GM-GUY NES Member

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    1 BTC = $9790 as of this post

    I wish I would have gotten in when it launched in 2009 with $100, that would be about $100,000,000 today. With that said, if I invested $100 today and the price goes to $100,000 each I would have $1000. In order to get to $1,000,000, BTC would need to trade at $100,000,000 each.

    Gold is at ~$1300/oz and Silver is about $17. I could buy (and hold in my hand) 2 grams of Gold or 6 oz of Silver) for that $100.

    I think BTC (and the rest) are a great idea to take control away from the central banks and governments - which is why they won't survive imo.

    If BTC gets to those lofty values - what does the world look like? What do real assets value at?
     
  6. Spanz

    Spanz NES Member

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    it has Ponzi scheme written all over it. that said, i wish i had bought some coin a month ago!
     
  7. Prepper

    Prepper NES Member

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    I got some back in 2013 personally from Roger Ver ("the bitcoin Jesus") when it was $30. Unfortunately, I didn't get very much. Wish I had spent a few hundred more at the time so I could pay off my mortgage. Although, it's getting to be a decent amount thanks to the rise. Now I'm wondering what to do... I don't want to pay taxes so the best way to "convert" it is to spend it. But, I don't really need to buy anything now. So I keep holding. Gift cards maybe? Still, that's a lot of gift cards.
     
  8. Prepper

    Prepper NES Member

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    Ponzi scheme really isn't the right term, although it could all collapse because everyone moves to a newer better cryptocurrency. Ponzi schemes require new investors at the bottom, forever, and it falls apart as soon as new investors stop coming. Bitcoin doesn't have that problem... if the new investors just level off, it'd be fine.
     
  9. Prepper

    Prepper NES Member

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    The main thing that distresses me about bitcoin is that they haven't evolved the algorithm properly. Not long ago, you could buy a cup of coffee with bitcoin using your phone, and pay a 3 cent fee to get the transaction through. Now the fee is $25. No one is going to use it now except to hold onto it, or to do giant transactions with. One side of the bitcoin war thinks all you have to do is double the block size. They act like this just magically solves bitcoin growth problems and all is well. I'm just baffled how a group of people that once was super smart, can be so effing dumb. Doubling the block size doubles the transactions that can get through. That's it. BFD!! For bitcoin to be usable for day to day transactions, it needs to scale to thousands of times the transactions it can do now. And, you can't make the block size thousands of times larger... that's just absurd. Every node of the bitcoin network needs to keep an entire copy of the blockchain all on its own. I mean really... just imagine if you had to store every transaction ever made by every person in the world, how big it would be. It only worked up until now because the transactions in bitcoin was small relative to government-approved currencies.

    I guess the other side is this segwit* stuff... and that I can't say I understand. The fork attempt failed. I'm guessing that would have scaled better but I haven't really looked into it.
     
  10. Squib308

    Squib308 NES Member

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    i am a fan of bitcoin in so much as the people should have the right to create their own currencies outside of government. the blockchain technology is likely here to stay, whether it survives in the form of bitcoin or other currencies. i do find it rather comical how every bank out there is poo-poo'ing it for the average investor while they buy it in bulk.

    now that it's pushing $10k per BTC, i'm less inclined to keep buying it.

    the reports of BTC fraud are propagated by the media to do a little favor for big government. GMAFB...look how often there's $$ fraud going on. probably 1000x more prevalent.
     
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  11. NH_Realtor

    NH_Realtor NES Life Member NES Member

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    Yes, I think it's the future. Personally I started out with Ethereum back in June and after some ups and downs have moved in to alt coins. I currently own OMG, Salt, Strat, Bitb, UBQ, Safex, Neo and a tiny bit of Bitcoin, Eth, and BCC. The BCC is so small I can't even sell it, I got it via airdrop during the fork.
     
  12. Reptile

    Reptile NES Member

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    Keep in mind there are no banking safe guards.

    If you lose your "passwords" you can say goodbye to your fortune forever.
     
  13. Pyromancer

    Pyromancer

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    Think block chain technology is great, have serious doubts about the actual coin offerings. Applying a price to an investment asset that has no intrinsic value (versus housing, stock, metals) has sketchy written all over it. Reminiscent of the tulip mania of the 17th century. Especially when a new coin offering is released every few weeks.

    Fun coin facts:
    -big investors are snapping up all the available GPU/ASICS from dealers, chartering private jets, and building mining operations in low electricity cost countries.
    -it's no longer profitable to mine bitcoin with off the shelf gpus. ASICS have taken over.
     
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  14. Spanz

    Spanz NES Member

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    if it is so "fine" how come a bitcoin that i bought today could drop $2000 value over night, or rise $1000 too, on no reason at all?
     
  15. 42!

    42! NES Life Member NES Member

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    Or you could have lost it all, with no protection or recourse.
    https://www.theguardian.com/technol...-on-trial-japan-embezzlement-loss-of-millions
     
  16. Win

    Win NES Member

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    I don't understand all the people buying bitcoin. Originally bitcoin was supposed to be a digital currency but now I've read a couple of articles that bitcoin transactions are too slow to scale to any legitimate use of currency. So folks are now buying bitcoin as an investment rather currency. That's where I get lost. What exactly is the investment in?
     
  17. Prepper

    Prepper NES Member

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    The prices are due to market fluctuations. Big ones. People still haven't figured out where all this is headed so it makes for a bumpy ride. Of course this makes it less useful as an actual currency and more useful as a speculative investment. I would prefer to see a cryptocurrency stabilize (or at least increase gradually at a rate that can be relied on). That way it would have a better chance at displacing central banking. But we will have to wait and see. No one has ever done this before.
     
  18. Tarsook

    Tarsook

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    The same reason the stock market can do the same.
     
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  19. Prepper

    Prepper NES Member

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    I'm actually not sure why it keeps going up, given that it is no longer useful for transactions, or other block chain stuff like signing contracts, etc. And I am not aware of any effort that has a chance to modify bitcoin to make it scalable. Perhaps people are hopeful such an effort will succeed soon, but please tell me what that is. Increasing block size is effing retarded. Some major changes are needed and they don't seem to be getting any traction. A few months ago I was hopeful but it all seems to have fallen apart.
     
  20. Spanz

    Spanz NES Member

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    i am not buying THAT at all. When i buy a stock, i see a building, a market, employees, tangible assets, good will, earnings predictions, past performance, and can evaluate them and form an opinion on what their underlying value was, and THEN decide if it is a wise investment or not to buy that stock.

    With bitcoin...i do not even get a piece of paper. Just some lines of code that unlock the value of the "coin" at some later date. HOW can you evaluate its value?
     
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  21. Tarsook

    Tarsook

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    Which is all well and fine, but your statement was "if it is so "fine" how come a bitcoin that i bought today could drop $2000 value over night, or rise $1000 too, on no reason at all?".

    I can show you plenty of stocks that have had just as similar spikes and dips for no tangible reason what so ever.
     
  22. Reptile

    Reptile NES Member

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  23. MisterHappy

    MisterHappy NES Member

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    On the 16 yard line, shootin' for the Lewis!
    It's going up, because there are two (or more) people that want it.

    FFS, Robbie the Robot (movie prop from Forbidden Planet, for you young 'uns), just sold for more than $5 million.

    It's like Art collecting (especially the modern crap)....it's worth $$$$, because the people that buy it, all agree that it's worth $$$$. And, they know that next time it's sold, it will be $$$$$

    Emperor's New Clothes comes to mind.
     
  24. endus

    endus NES Member

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    LOL.

    You don't really think the stock market is tied to things like assets and performance anymore, do you? It's driven 100% by perception, nothing else. That and computer programs/high frequency trading.
     
  25. richc

    richc NES Member

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    It's the greater fool than I theory. It's all speculative. Everyone buying today hopes to flip it for a big profit. Last person in the pool loses.

    It's reminiscent of the DotCom fiasco of 1999-2000. Companies with no revenues, no customers and dumb ideas were getting tens of millions in funding and valuations. It all came crashing down. As will Bitcoin.

    It's no different than Beanie Babies and Pokemon cards. Or the tulip bulb craze, or the South Seas trading bubble. Irrational exuberance. All driven by greed.

    At some point there will be an event that brings things back to reality. Since I'm already shocked it has reached these lofty levels I can't and won't hazard a guess at how long this will last.

    But... there are risks. Obvious and not so obvious. What happens to bitcoins if the internet goes down? What happens if the US and other governments decide that Bitcoin is a risk to the government and bans possession? Don't think that's possible? Remember when the US decided citizens could not own gold? Or the NSA or other government entity breaks the code and that info gets out?

    Governments by necessity have to be very protective of their currencies. To be sure Bitcoin is a fiat currency, as is the US currency systems, and most others. But it's a threat as it gets larger.

    And would any of us be surprised to learn that this entire new currency was created by some government? Would the NSA do something like this to follow payments for illicit goods and services? Or some other major intelligence agency? You think Putin would do something like this and laugh all the way to the bank? Or the Chinese? That the creators of Bitcoin will ultimately yank their money and leave everyone else in poverty? You betcha! They'll make Bernie Madoff look like a petty criminal.

    And if and when Bitcoins and other cybercurrencies do crash and burn watch the price of gold and silver skyrocket. There's plenty of speculation that many of the dollars historically used to buy precious metals have instead gone to purchase these new fangled currency schemes.

    Just think long and hard... do you really think sending someone your hard earned money in return for a unique string of numbers make much sense?
     
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  26. NH_Realtor

    NH_Realtor NES Life Member NES Member

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    There are currently 7 or 8 business here in Portsmouth that accept multiple different forms of cryptocurrency. I have bought things using cryptocurrency, and would certainly accept crypto as a payment for something I'm selling.

    It's understandable that people are skeptical of a new form of currency that has no "backing", but what is backing those hard earned pieces of paper you're walking around with in your pants pocket? The full faith of the United States government? Cool, I'll take my chances with a long line of code carried out on a secured USB stick in my pocket over a corrupt government that's 20 trillion in debt that we know of.

    Are governments scared of it? Of course they are. It's human nature to be scared of things we don't understand. But how do they stop it. Outlaw it? Ok how do you outlaw something that doesn't exist tangibly? They gonna kick in people's doors and take their bitcoin that exists in cyperspace somewhere? Regulate it? I'm sure they'll try to figure that out too. Reality? They'll figure out a way to tax it and move forward.

    What happens to bitcoin if the internet goes down? If the internet went down the entire economy would come to a grinding halt, nevermind all the clueless schmucks in the street unsure of what to do with themselves when they can't go on facebook and instagram (and NES) to validate themselves via "likes".
     
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  27. 42!

    42! NES Life Member NES Member

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    Bitcoin is secure, unless you were holding some of the 850k Bitcoin or $28m lost when Mt. Gox went criminal.

    Bitcoin could disappear tomorrow, the USA not so much risk.

    You try to make a point that there is nothing backing our paper money. But that's not true, the gov backs it. And even if there were to be a financial collapse, maintaining or returning value to the money would be an absolute priority.

    On the other hand, if something happens to Bitcoin it's just gone.

    I think it's been a fun ride, but without a gov backing it it will eventually fall. Just be sure to get out before that happens and you'll be fine.
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2017
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  28. Gidge

    Gidge

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    I vote for "great scam".

    Bitcoin Nears $10,000 Milestone; These Crypto Stock Plays Are Moving

    · APARNA NARAYANAN - Investor's Business Daily

    ·

    · Bitcoin's astonishing ascent appeared set to continue Monday, with the world's largest cryptocurrency poised to breach the key psychological barrier of $10,000. Meanwhile, several stocks with cryptocurrency or blockchain ties were moving sharply as well.

    ·

    XBitcoin rose to a record $9,732.76 in early New York trade before trimming gains to $9,599.54, up 2.9%. It's up more than 900% so far this year, according to Bitcoin Price Index.


    The 10,000 milestone would come just a week after bitcoin crossed $8,000, although the price action for the virtual currency has been marked by sharp slumps and strong rallies this year. Many skeptics warn of a bitcoin bubble, but even Wall Street stalwarts are warming to the technology.


    CME Group (CME) hopes to launch bitcoin futures in December, and Goldman Sachs (GS) and Citigroup (C) are exploring cryptocurrencies and the underlying blockchain technology — JPMorgan Chase (JPM) reportedly is mulling letting its customers bet on Bitcoin futures even though JPMorgan CEO Jamie Dimon has warned Bitcoin is a "fraud" doomed to failure.


    As bitcoin rose Monday, the Bitcoin Investment Trust (GBTC), an exchange traded note backed by Bitcoin, leapt 24%. GBTC gives investors a way to trade Bitcoin easily over the counter, but is also seen as an expensive and potentially dangerous investment.


    Marathon Patent Group (MARA), an IP licensing company set to acquire Global Bit Ventures, a cryptocurrency miner, rose 9.4% to 6.51 but that was after skyrocketing to 10.03 intraday. Marathon Patent shares fell to about 6 in late trading ahead of a planned 4:30 p.m. ET conference call regarding its recent cryptocurrency mining acquisition.


    Among other Bitcoin plays, Overstock.com sank 9.3% on the stock market today, Square (SQ) tumbled 16% and Riot Blockchain (RIOT) sank 34%. But all three stocks are up sharply in recent weeks, at least in part due to Bitcoin buzz.


    Overstock has invested in blockchain technology. Square recently started trials in which some Square Cash app users can buy and sell Bitcoin, though BTIG downgraded the stock on Monday, saying the Square's Bitcoin-related rally was overdone. Riot Blockchain, which recently changed its name to reflect its new focus, provides exposure to the blockchain ecosystem.
     
  29. PennyPincher

    PennyPincher NES Member

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    Yes. Exactly. The .gov has already seized millions of $ worth of bitcoin (probably worth billions now) and they have started regulating it already.
     
  30. Prepper

    Prepper NES Member

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    Ironically by seizing bitcoin, they only further limit how much is left in circulation and help drive up the price of it further.
     

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