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Crowd funding 80% lowers

So far they sent me the jig and the mills. I've been watching their fb page but who knows when/if we'll get our lowers. I only chipped in the for one but may buyout other investors if they let us do so at the crowdsource pricing after they start shipping.

also - supposedly I'm supposed to get the 2nd production lower and complete build kit, they drew my name for the that during the crowd sourcing, but again i'm not holding my breath on that one either since i'll have to neuter the kit they show on their site for marsha to be happy.
 
I am currently in the Pebble Peak rocket hub buy (that is a total loss and will never produce anything. I am also in the fealty arms Rocket hub buy. This on has some positive light to it. They are producing lowers and have shipped out about 75 so far but the progress is oh so slow. We will see.... we are coming up on the one year anniversary of the campaign being funded.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using Tapatalk
 
Most of the crowd funding opportunities are scams. They prey on peoples greed and longing for a real good deal. If a legit company needed 50K for a viable new product a bank would most likely loan them the money.
 
Chet0729 said:
Most of the crowd funding opportunities are scams. They prey on peoples greed and longing for a real good deal. If a legit company needed 50K for a viable new product a bank would most likely loan them the money.
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I disagree with this statement. I've been in a number (at least seven) of kickstarter projects and not one has failed to deliver as expected. Some times it takes longer than expected, but it depends on the company/person/people. Some have been individuals, small groups, a company with a good reputation that was on the verge of going under, and a brandy new company with a good ceo that has driven the project very well.
 
I just sent Joe an email, asking to be put on the 'refund' list.

The last straw was the email he just sent out, offering to generously sell us a poly 80% lower for half price ($50), in exchange for our interest in a billet lower. In the email, he kept referring to the lowers that they are making as 'forged', when in fact they are cast. I've seen enough.

I hope that you guys do get something that will work, especially chaser001 who should be getting a full rifle kit.
 
Oi - I saw his email this morning too. But I'm not going to drop another $50 to get a poyl lower when I was supposed to get a real lower for $35 or less depending on quantity. Of course he's not going to lose out on anything with that deal because he'll just turn around and sell the alluminium ones people bailed on.

So much for his FB post about having people buy-out other funders. I might consider it after he starts shipping but right now no way am I sending him any more $$.
 
mclina said:
I just sent Joe an email, asking to be put on the 'refund' list.

The last straw was the email he just sent out, offering to generously sell us a poly 80% lower for half price ($50), in exchange for our interest in a billet lower. In the email, he kept referring to the lowers that they are making as 'forged', when in fact they are cast. I've seen enough.

I hope that you guys do get something that will work, especially chaser001 who should be getting a full rifle kit.
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"Class Action."
 
Is this the Gun Vault, Battleborn Tactics or the NorthWest Precision Rockethub startups. I have received very little but expect to get something in about 5 months.
 
ewaybevinn said:
I have been waiting over a year now for my lower from Fealty Arms. You just have to be patient.
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If it was just the time, I wouldn't mind it. My real complaint is that they sold us on billet lowers, and are now producing cast lowers. Not even forged. If I thought I would have my four billet lowers, even in another 6 months, I'd be fine with it. It's the fact that it would be at least a year, and the final product is not close to what was promised that really bugs me.
 
mclina said:
My real complaint is that they sold us on billet lowers, and are now producing cast lowers. Not even forged. If I thought I would have my four billet lowers, even in another 6 months, I'd be fine with it. It's the fact that it would be at least a year, and the final product is not close to what was promised that really bugs me.
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...and their remedy is that if you don't want a cast lower, you can get in line until someone else buys your lowers - which may or may not ever happen. Complete horse$#!+ as far as I'm concerned. Refund in full immediately is the only acceptable remedy.

Would this rise to the level of a false or deceptive business practice under 93A (MA Consumer Protection)? If they don't make up for it, it's triple damages plus legal fees, and the process is heavily tilted towards the consumer.

Any NES legal beagles feel like chiming in?
 
OnTheRoad said:
...and their remedy is that if you don't want a cast lower, you can get in line until someone else buys your lowers - which may or may not ever happen. Complete horse$#!+ as far as I'm concerned. Refund in full immediately is the only acceptable remedy.

Would this rise to the level of a false or deceptive business practice under 93A (MA Consumer Protection)? If they don't make up for it, it's triple damages plus legal fees, and the process is heavily tilted towards the consumer.

Any NES legal beagles feel like chiming in?
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Who wants to expain to Martha Coakley the difference between billet and cast AR15 receivers? Think she would be sympathetic?

I think the real issue is that this company is pretty much broke. They are scrambling to produce anything that might make them a buck. If they are forced to make good on the original deal, I'm afraid they would just go belly up.
 
Sweet thing about 93A is that the AG's doesn't get involved, it's you (your attorney if you go that route) and the business in front of a judge. I am probably going to scratch out some sort of refund demand letter since the product was significantly inferior in quality and not as described and send it along; if there is no response or reasonable counteroffer it's filing time.
 
The problem is that this is not a sale transaction. You basically make a donation and hope to get a gift from it. There is no contract here.
Its a gamble, that's why i contributed a small amount. I had the attitude of it being gone as soon as i hit submit and will call it a bonus if i get something.

Question is, can you write it off as a lost investment???

If we ever get the lowers, i have a strong suspicion they will be crap. Bonus crap if the buffer tube area is not threaded.
 
They solicited the funding based on the very specific fact that these were going to be billet/ forged and now are trying to give us cast paperweights, that should meet the level of deceptive regardless of their intent at the beginning. If the whole project had just failed, then I could see it as a lost investment - but if you buy Exxon stock and get a certificate that says Solyndra, someone was bullshitting you and that's where the consumer protection angle comes into play.
 
Just got home from the bar. Spelling may be questionable and I apologize for the rant.

Yea I am in this cluster **** too. That ass hat Joe can go take it in the kiester from the business end of a Barret for all I am concerned.

The email sugesting we give him an extra 50.00 to convert our shitbox cast lowers in to bigger shitbox poly lowers. We signed up for billet. Why on earth would people who wanted billet be remotely interested in poly. If there is a 93a suit I can see that going to shit too. Just waiting to take a trip down south so I can drop a flaming bad of dog shit at his shop door.
 
I agree this whole Cluster F of a situation is infuriating. Hell i would feel better if he just disappeared with the funds as we would have closure.

The only angle i can think of is calling amex and report it as fraud. Whats interesting is i cannot find some sort of legal statement of the terms of the "pledge". Either on rockethub or the emailed receipts.
 
Yea I looked through the legal bull also. At this point I am ready to do the same and report it to my card company as fraud. Even if these end up shipping I dont want a cast lower. These were intended to be placed in the SHTF pile thats why I wanted billet.

The biggest insult was him asking for an extra 50.00 for a poly lower that isnt worth the box it would be shipped in.
 
If poly is a step up from the cast, I have to wonder what the cast units are made of, like scrap and cans or something?

Buckhunter156 said:
Just got home from the bar. Spelling may be questionable and I apologize for the rant.

Yea I am in this cluster **** too. That ass hat Joe can go take it in the kiester from the business end of a Barret for all I am concerned.

The email sugesting we give him an extra 50.00 to convert our shitbox cast lowers in to bigger shitbox poly lowers. We signed up for billet. Why on earth would people who wanted billet be remotely interested in poly. If there is a 93a suit I can see that going to shit too. Just waiting to take a trip down south so I can drop a flaming bad of dog shit at his shop door.
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I am feeling like getting a soda can would be the best out come at this point. Atleast it would be a .05 cent return [smile]

I just get a kick out of how quickly my facebook comments get deleted from their page. If they spent half the time producing lowers as they did playing NSA on FB we would not even be in this situation.
 
Last edited:
Today's FB update:
Moving forward.
While we wait for the ATF determination, here is what we will be doing: first, the programs will be cloned to the other faces of our tombstones, and the other vise jaws will be cut. This will speed up production significantly.

Now, a few housekeeping items.
First, we are instituting a new comment policy. The following comments will be allowed: honest, well-mannered questions relevant to the post; good job, keep it up posts; and new product suggestions. The following comments will be deleted: questions previously answered; rude or inflammatory posts; angry criticisms on how we should run our company; and other posts as we see fit. We do not post our criticisms of how you run your life on your Facebook page, and we expect the same.

Also, as a point of correction, the blanks we are using are technically forged blanks. The casts were not of sufficient quality and took too much machine time to clean up. So we switched to forged blanks. They are, as we stated, lab verified 7075 T6 aluminium alloy.

On refunds, your options are to take the polymer credit offered via email, to wait for your gift lowers, or to wait until your lowers are sold. We are not considering any other options currently.
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I just saw their update. They are being pricks, but if the lowers really are forged and not cast, I am willing to wait for them. They really aren't giving us much of a choice.

I just wonder how many little ears are going to snap off as I install the trigger guard roll pins. I plan on doing that as my first step, before even finishing the lowers. That way I can send them back before putting too much work into them.
 
Well, I have had enough. Just got off the phone with the credit card company, and filed a dispute. My account will be credited in the mean time, and good old Joe will be getting a call from his bank.

I refuse to deal with a company who so blantantly decidved investors/customers. And the. Procedes to delete their comments questioning their actions.

If any one else is planning on doing the same I explained that they were metal machine parts for a hobby project, and they were called 80%lowers. The guy was clueless and was more than happy to help.
 
I can vouch for Battle Born Tactics rockethub deal. He is shipping and the product looks good. A relative of mine just got a few in the mail. Nice looking. The Gun Vault I cannot seem to get a reply from them.
 
I've been following them on facebook. Among the recent untruths they have fessed up to, they are not producing any lowers while the ATF wait is in progress. They were originally going to be cranking out 100 per day during the waiting period, and they would ship them immediately upon receiving the letter. Now, they are not producing crap until they get approval.

I have a feeling, that since they are now buying forgings, that they are out of money. I don't think they can afford to buy all of the forgings until they can start selling product.

I think that if they had a huge pile of these forgings ready to go, they would be eager to show them off. They aren't showing us anything, which makes be believe they don't have anything to show us.
 
mclina said:
I've been following them on facebook. Among the recent untruths they have fessed up to, they are not producing any lowers while the ATF wait is in progress. They were originally going to be cranking out 100 per day during the waiting period, and they would ship them immediately upon receiving the letter. Now, they are not producing crap until they get approval.

I have a feeling, that since they are now buying forgings, that they are out of money. I don't think they can afford to buy all of the forgings until they can start selling product.

I think that if they had a huge pile of these forgings ready to go, they would be eager to show them off. They aren't showing us anything, which makes be believe they don't have anything to show us.
Click to expand...

That poor "bastid" had no idea what he was getting into with this. He apparently knew very little about CNC machines and that home made trash can blast furnace was a riot. There should be TLC cameras following this guy and his business around.

At the end of the day, its crowd funding, no-one to blame but ourselves for a poor investment choice.
 

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