Court Decision re: Storage and Heller

[terraformer]

Walk in to your average gun store and you see the same. How are they any different?

(the big-box stores do lock their guns because their area is not attended)

Same with ammo and this always pissed me off about the storage laws. Any shoplifting punk would be happy to snag a box of federals off the shelf.

 

[Another_David]

Same with ammo and this always pissed me off about the storage laws. Any shoplifting punk would be happy to snag a box of federals off the shelf.

I don't find fault with the stores. I just think the law is wrongly applied to some people and "more fair" with others (credit to NES for the "more fair" concept). I believe the correct legal terms are "arbitrary and capricious".

 

[Half Cocked]

The answer is simple, but is in three parts:

Part 1.

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

Source: Constitution of The United States of America"

SCOTUS holds that RKBA is an individual right, not a collective right.

Another one who clearly does not understand the Heller ruling......

 

[Bill Nance]

Guys, I hate to break it to you, but Scrivener and others have pointed out before that Heller was a very limited ruling.

What Heller does is exactly what Roe vs. Wade did. It opens up a giant can of worms to be decided by future cases.

It was a giant victory for us, but it's the beginning, not the end.

Keep your powder dry and your checkbooks open. This is going to be a long and bitter fight.

 

[TomH]

The answer is simple, but is in three parts:

Part 1.

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

Source: Constitution of The United States of America"

Part 2.

Main Entry: in·fringe
Function: verb
Inflected Form(s): in·fringed; in·fring·ing
Etymology: Medieval Latin infringere, from Latin, to break, crush, from in- + frangere to break — more at break
Date: 1513
transitive verb
1: to encroach upon in a way that violates law or the rights of another <infringe a patent>
2obsolete : defeat, frustrate
intransitive verb
: encroach —used with on or upon<infringe on our rights>
synonyms see trespass
— in·fring·er noun

Source: http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/infringe


Part 3.

SCOTUS holds that RKBA is an individual right, not a collective right.

SCOTUS / Heller http://www.supremecourtus.gov/opinions/07pdf/07-290.pdf


Summary:

If 2A affirms the right to keep and bear arms, without infringement, and if Heller affirms that right is individual, then clearly anything that violates that right is unconstitutional.

Keeping and Bearing encompasses storage and carry, obviously. Placing restrictions on those are clearly infringements.

I'm a bit handler by trade, not a lawyer, so I'm sure someone will pop up with a reason why this clear logic isn't correct, even though it is.

Now, since I'm a bit handler, I'm off to handle some bits.

What he said. You can argue that Heller does or does not cover certain things. But the fact is we shouldn't need Heller, we have the Constitution if anyone would bother reading it.

 

[drgrant]

Same with ammo and this always pissed me off about the storage laws. Any shoplifting punk would be happy to snag a box of federals off the shelf.

Again, the regulations for storage of ammunition are not even in the same ballpark as those pertaining to firearms. The "ammo must be locked up"
crap is a piece of fun obscurity in CMR that is never really enforced. It's really a fire safety reg and has nothing to do with the firearm-based safe
storage laws we've come to loathe.

-Mike

 

[KilgoreTrout]

Anyone know if this guy will appeal? Does he have a legal defense fund? (Fingers checkbook)

What's with the first footnote?


Quote:
The defendant is also charged with possession of an infernal machine. That count is not the subject of the instant motion.

There is more to this story, obv. Did the guy have his place booby trapped or something? That probably ain't helping things.

Personally, I'd hold off writing checks until I knew the rest of the story. No replies to my other post.

 

[center442]

Correct, unless that gun is on your person and under your direct control. It is the opinion of this judge that if you take your shotgun out of the safe, carry it to your kitchen to clean it, place it on the table, then walk back to your safe to retrieve your cleaning kit, you are now in violation of MA storage laws.

OMG, I just violated 5 MA storage laws! (Cleaning some of my guns from the Athol shoot and I stopped to get a cup of coffee)

There's probably a pile of dead kittens as a result. Gotta love MA laws....

 

[Blitz1]

OMG, I just violated 5 MA storage laws! (Cleaning some of my guns from the Athol shoot and I stopped to get a cup of coffee)

There's probably a pile of dead kittens as a result. Gotta love MA laws....

Let's not turn this into a cat thread now.

 

[RI_John]

Let's not turn this into a cat thread now.

Did someone mention shooting cats????

 

[Blitz1]

Did someone mention shooting cats????

Run Puffin!!!!

 

[Half Cocked]

Summary:

If 2A affirms the right to keep and bear arms, without infringement, and if Heller affirms that right is individual, then clearly anything that violates that right is unconstitutional.

Keeping and Bearing encompasses storage and carry, obviously. Placing restrictions on those are clearly infringements.

Not really..... the term "infringe" in the constitution means to take away. They cannot take away the individual right to keep and bear arms.

Heller specifically stated that "reasonable" restrictions are allowed.

The right to keep and bear arms is not granted by the constitution. The constitution only states the right is not to be infringed.

 

[namedpipes]

Not really..... the term "infringe" in the constitution means to take away. They cannot take away the individual right to keep and bear arms.

Heller specifically stated that "reasonable" restrictions are allowed.

The right to keep and bear arms is not granted by the constitution. The constitution only states the right is not to be infringed.

The fact you quoted/responded to the same post twice in 4 hours would indicate you either thought about it (great, that was my intent) or it ticked you off (which, if you knee jerked, is ok too).

Not to pick nits, but 2A, as I stated, AFFIRMS the right to keep and bear arms. That is not the same as saying that 2A grants that right.

Also, since IANAL, it would be surprising if I DID fully understand the Heller decision and its long term effects. However, *I* hold that RKBA is individual and that is more than sufficient for me. That there exist some educated opinions that SUPPORT my position is affirmation enough for debate in this forum.

 

[Half Cocked]

The fact you quoted/responded to the same post twice in 4 hours would indicate you either thought about it (great, that was my intent) or it ticked you off (which, if you knee jerked, is ok too).

Don't read too much into it. I just missed something the first time.

But yes..... ignorance in general does sometimes tick me off.

However, *I* hold that RKBA is individual and that is more than sufficient for me.

You are right but the laws are not that simplistic.

 

[namedpipes]

Don't read too much into it. I just missed something the first time.

But yes..... ignorance in general does sometimes tick me off.




You are right but the laws are not that simplistic.

.

 

[GSG]

Think outside the box here. He is disabled. For you and I who have full use of our extremities, the storage laws are an ineffective PITA dreamed up by idiots. For this guy they are onerous and he probably could have made a AWDA defense that he needed to store these in such a manner.

How true.

Kind of like that Ron White joke about drinking in pub-lic. They dragged him out of his home.

I get that it's in line with the Mass. laws, Heller ruling, blah blah blah, but it's simply wrong when anyone, especially one confined to a wheelchair, can get in trouble for how they defend their own home.

Again, the regulations for storage of ammunition are not even in the same ballpark as those pertaining to firearms. The "ammo must be locked up"
crap is a piece of fun obscurity in CMR that is never really enforced. It's really a fire safety reg and has nothing to do with the firearm-based safe
storage laws we've come to loathe.

-Mike

What really bugs me about that law is if you don't know about the CMR's you'll never hear it. Thankfully, even before I knew about the law I kept all guns, ammo and mags in a safe, but if I hadn't, I'd be screwed.

When I wanted to learn about Mass. gun laws I read everything I could find in the MGL, and sadly I've since learned that it wasn't enough.

You need to be a serious student of the law to not break any of the Mass. gun laws.