Controversial XS Big Dot sights.....Whose got or used them?

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Okay.....My collection is very "mission" specific. There are no safe queens.

For my EDC I am picking up a Hk45c on Friday. It has the stock luminescent sights on it with the rears blacked out. My previous EDC had 3dot TruDot NS. I felt the 3dots were over kill.

Looking at how I have been practicing and using my EDC pistols I am gravitating towards XS Big dot sights.

90% of my EDC drills are point blank to 10yds. Then mostly 10-20yds with very little beyond 20yds. Targets are usually IDPA, Fullsize BG, 8" Steel, etc.

I also use my EDC for a ladder or 2 in the monthly bowling pin match.

The XS system just seems very logical to me. When I think about my current EDC flash sight picture, I really only ever look for the front sight.

I have extensive time shooting bullseye with std sights. Thus I am not trying to compensate for lack in learning that system. Just looking for the best system for this EDC role.

So come on guys.......don't be afraid to admit the use of the "lollipop" sight [wink]

Spending $120+ for these is an expensive experiment. So I would love to meet up and try them if possible.
 
J

Jose

The tacticool guys at m4carbine.net hate them.

I have them on a S&W 915 and have Ameriglo Defoor sights on a Glock 17. The Big Dot is easier for my presbyopic eyes to pick up.
 

M1911

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I have an XS big dot front sight on one of my guns. I really don't like it. Specifically, I don't like the round upper edge. I prefer the top of the front sight to be flat. I find that the round top makes it harder for me to get the elevation correct -- it often leads me to have the front sight up too high, resulting in shots impacting high. I dislike it enough that I may have it changed out.

These things are very much a matter of personal preference, so YMMV.
 
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Sadly, there seem to be a whole bunch of conflicting opinions on them that probably come down to personal preference and eye strength. Personally, I don't think they're precise enough outside of distances where I could shoot without sights.

Big exception: I think they're great for snub-nosed revolvers, or guns of similar size.
 
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I just picked up a 1911 with them on it, and I can't stand them. I'm 100% sure it's because I'm not used to them, but I definitely prefer three dots.
 

stinx

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I have nothing bad to say about them,but I can acomplish he same task by indexing on my weapon: If my shoulder,arm and wrist are strait and my weapon in hand fits within the sillouette of my target I will get a combat acurate hit as long as I dont mash the trigger. This works for me from 10 yards and in. YMMV.
 
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Big exception: I think they're great for snub-nosed revolvers, or guns of similar size.

My Kahr K40C has the BigDot sights. For that gun, I love them. They definitely aren't target sights, but they're quick to line up, and they put lead on target at the ranges I expect to use that gun at.

ETA: You're welcome to try out my K40, if you'd like.
 
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drgrant

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I don't like them at all. I would suggest trying a gun equipped with it before blowing $120. you may be disappointed.

I've ever met anyone that that gave these things an "eight and a half" kind of rating. You will either love them or hate them.

-Mike
 

M1911

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I like the way they look. If I had the opportunity to get them installed when my pistol was in the shop, I would have. Had to settle for Heine Straight 8's instead.
I have both. I greatly prefer the Heinies.

Flyer007, where are you in Metrowest? If you are near Wayland, I could meet you at the club and you can take a look at mine. Note, however, that I only have the Big Dot front sight -- my rear sight is a Heinie Slantpro.
 
J

Jose

Note, however, that I only have the Big Dot front sight -- my rear sight is a Heinie Slantpro.

That's probably why you have such elevation issues with it. The big dot is an express sight. It is designed to be used with a rear shallow V notch sight.
 
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Wow.....just as I have found on the interweb. It's a love/hate world for these.

Cpl of comments on the replies.....

M1911::: I'm surprised that you mention missing the flat sharp edges and top around the ball. To me the system is supposed to be setup so those are not needed. Put the center of the ball where you want the hole <25yds. 25> put the imaginary hole just above the ball.

To clarify on your last post. Your running a big dot front with Heine rear? interesting and also might be reason for elevation issue. (edit....I was writing this and saw Jose thinks the same)

Stinx.....I agree on indexing......and so much of my drills are on indexing and point shooting. But it also is nice to flash on a front blade (or big dot) for confirmation. Or when having a little more time to be a little tighter.

Jose......WoW.....your input is kind of what is inline with my thoughts. From your previous posts, I can respect your knowledge on many types of sight systems and that you recognize each have their roles.

Update on my thoughts: I just came back from lunchtime trip to range. My buddy let me use his glock 22? (midsize .40) This was setup with a larger single white dot on front blade and blacked out rear. When shooting it I applied the big dot picture in my head. Centering the white dot on a B3 at 30' covered the black (9,10, x) rings. It also allowed all shots in black. What I found was that the extra black on the front blade was distracting. I tried to imagine a vertical bar on the rear and how that would be. Needless to say.......I think I'm ordering the XS 24/7's.

Keep the comments coming though....it will prod me to do a range report.
 

M1911

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M1911::: I'm surprised that you mention missing the flat sharp edges and top around the ball. To me the system is supposed to be setup so those are not needed. Put the center of the ball where you want the hole <25yds. 25> put the imaginary hole just above the ball.
That only works at close distances and only for moderate accuracy. Just looking at the front sight alone, your eye can't judge whether the gun is properly aligned with the target. You can only judge that by comparing the location of the front sight with that of the rear sight, and then with the target. If the front sight appears above the top rear sight, you will hit high. If the front sight appears below the top of the rear sight, you will hit low. If you are using a traditional rear notch sight, a flat front sight is easier to line up accurately than a rounded front sight.

To clarify on your last post. Your running a big dot front with Heine rear? interesting and also might be reason for elevation issue. (edit....I was writing this and saw Jose thinks the same)
A rear express sight does work a bit differently than a rear notch sight, but most everything I've read about express sights is that they give up accuracy as well.

I don't find that the XS is any faster for sight acquisition. The sights that give me the fastest acquisition are the standard black on black target sights on my Wilson, but they are a bit large for concealed carry.

Back when I took LFI-1 or 2, Ayoob said that he did a "study" of the XS big dot sights over at Sig's facility in Exeter. He got two identical handguns, one with XS sights and one with standard sights. He recruited a group of shooters of different experience levels and timed them through a course of fire, using both sights. He found no speed difference for the XS and slightly worse accuracy at longer distances.

But, as I said, this is really a personal preference issue. Some folks like them, some don't. I'm in the don't column.
 
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When I've shot them, it seemed similar to Ayoob's results: no measurable speed difference and 25 yard " -0" hits become slightly more difficult. But it wasn't a gun I really liked, either, so your mileage may vary.

Sounds like you're determined to try them; I hope they work for your eyes. I suggest comparing the two systems on a timer or otherwise with a quantifiable comparison, and not red lock-tighting them on[smile].
 
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Ughhhh......it might be easier to layout what I don't seem to be liking for action shooting / EDC scenarios

1. Not so happy with small fiber optic front sight. I find too much contrast between tiny fiber and rest of blade
2. Not so happy with three dot NS. Seem busy to me.
3. Narrow cut rear takes to long to align to front blade
4. Plain front blade has me concentrating on it like a bullseye sight picture and I shoot low.

Okay....plan is:
1. Get gun
2. Shoot it
3. Shelve the sight decision ;)
 
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I use the x-press big dots on both of my M&P's they work well for my vision. These are not target guns, they are defensive guns, so shooting x's is not my concern. shooting bad people in the face is.

I would definatly try any new sights out before installing them, when I was at the National Tactical Operators conference last month I saw an M&P with the rear sight replaced with a red dot. As soon as safariland makes a holster for that set up I will look at that option hard
 
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I use the x-press big dots on both of my M&P's they work well for my vision. These are not target guns, they are defensive guns, so shooting x's is not my concern. shooting bad people in the face is.

I would definatly try any new sights out before installing them, when I was at the National Tactical Operators conference last month I saw an M&P with the rear sight replaced with a red dot. As soon as safariland makes a holster for that set up I will look at that option hard

Your comment on purpose match my thoughts on this.

I have a lot of time with my M&P with a fiber optic front. Any chance I could try yours out? This would be a good comparison.
 
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I bought a Glock 17 with the big dot already installed. I was surprised at how much I liked them. I had been assuming that I would swap them out but my opinion changed once I got out to the range with it. It took about 100 rounds for me to really get the feel of them but then I started getting very nice results. I think I echo what many people have already said.

>> I think the system works very well for self defense distances and situations.

>> They are not well suited for long distance or high accuracy.

>> Using the front big dot without using the rear sight it was designed for would likely lead to elevation issues.

>> I think that they allow for quicker target acquisition.

-MS
 
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I put them on my 1911 only I have the std dot ones. I feel I can aquire the sight picture a bit faster, but my mind isn't used to that sight picture, there for I stall for a second before firing. I feel they will be awesome, and speed up my acquisition time once I get used to them, that being said, they're a bit slow on sights at the moment. Accurate as all hell though.
 

stinx

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I do have one on my snubbie, but also have CTC Grips. If they work for you get em and enjoy.the indexing techniques also works well.
 

mousegunfan

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I put them on my M&P9c. I like them a lot. Plus if you only have standard sights, this will be an upgrade to night sights. You have to change both front and rear, otherwise it won't work properly.
 
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