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Connecticut Gun Theft Victim Gets Rest Of His Guns Taken By Police

drgrant

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There is nothing illegal about keeping your property in another state. And MA has zero recourse if you do so. Saying you don’t know where they are may be a problem.
Depends on what the situation is and how "froggy" they want to get. Currently because an ERPO isn't PP bs yet, it can't propagate beyond state
lines. If it's a 209A whatever free state is going to rubber stamp a warrant to steal your shit from your vacation home,
because that propagates via lautenberg. That assumes of course that "they know" .

-Mike
 

drgrant

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That's not how I read 308's original post, however if we're talking about guns brought into the State when he moved here, I stand corrected. And I still don't think it's a great idea to post that you have a bunch of unregistered guns in MA regardless of their provenance.
Having "unregistered guns" in MA is not, by itself, a crime. "Failure to report a transfer" is a crime, but there are numerous arguable circumstances where you're not obligated to report. There's also a statute of limitations as well on "paper crimes" in MA, I believe it's 5 years but I have to double check, might be 6. So all those people whose dad that lives across town sold them a shotgun 10 years ago without papers shouldn't really be sweating bullets, unless they violated some other law (like federal ones, which I'm unsure if/any statute of limitations exist on). It's difficult to know how MA courts analyze this issue because I've literally never seen or heard of a case based off S128A/B. Probably has something to do with the fact that it's annoying for them to prove all the elements of the crime unless the accused serves that stuff up on a silver platter. Of course there's always the "who wants to be the test case" reasoning, although even
then I can't see them using that law.... when there's like 10 other things they can charge people with, often times just making shit up on the fly... this state has proven it is willing to do that on numerous occasions, when someone "offends the crown" etc.. too many numerous incidents to list.

-Mike
 
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AHM

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If it's a 209A whatever free state is going to rubber stamp a warrant to steal your shit from your vacation home,
because that propagates via lautenberg. That assumes of course that "they know" .
And that they can find the stuff at your vacation home.

If it's there to find. Maybe you mistrust cabin break-ins,
and keep the guns in Farmer Brown's root cellar just down the road.
Maybe the best part of time in the mountains is trading a flask of bourbon
for your load of clanky canvas sacks every time you roll in to town...

There's also a statute of limitations as well on "paper crimes" in MA, I believe it's 5 years but I have to double check, might be 6. So all those people whose dad that lives across town sold them a shotgun 10 years ago without papers shouldn't really be sweating bullets, unless they violated some other law (like federal ones, which I'm unsure if/any statute of limitations exist on). It's difficult to know how MA courts analyze this issue because I've literally never seen or heard of a case based off S128A/B. Probably has something to do with the fact that it's annoying for them to prove all the elements of the crime unless the accused serves that stuff up on a silver platter. Of course there's always the "who wants to be the test case" reasoning, although even
then I can't see them using that law.... when there's like 10 other things they can charge people with, often times just making shit up on the fly... this state has proven it is willing to do that on numerous occasions, when someone "offends the crown" etc..
Indeed.

If my reading of NES archives is statistically valid,
the "statute of limitations" wallhack to (e)FA-10
seems a comparatively recent development on the site.

Maybe all of our rock star gun lawyers would always have known to trot that out,
and awareness only gradually dawned on the amateur gun law cadre.

Or maybe one of our lawyers realized it in a flash some few years ago,
or at least only recently tried it on for size in a trial.

Hence, inquiring minds want to know™.
 

drgrant

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Yes, inquiring minds want to know™.

If my reading of NES archives is statistically valid,
the "statute of limitations" wallhack to (e)FA-10 is a comparatively recent development.

Maybe all of our rock star gun lawyers would always have known to trot that out,
and awareness only gradually dawned on the amateur gun law cadre.

Or maybe one of our lawyers realized it in a flash some few years ago,
or at least only recently tried it on for size in a trial.
It's always existed, there's a thing in MGL about statute of limitations on paper-type gun law violations... I just have to look it up
again. It's less obvious because it's a derivative thing, one of those "everything under this section is subject to blah" or similar. Nobody
ever talks about it because it's really only relevant in a handful of circumstances, most of which never seem to attract prosecution attempts.

I think it's derivative from this.... 6 years... basically "all other crimes" outside of the ones mentioned specifically, are 6 years... and unless there's something I'm missing, an old "failure to report" would be toast 6 years after it was committed....

https://malegislature.gov/Laws/GeneralLaws/Partiv/Titleii/Chapter277/Section63

Side note: The reason other gun laws are different is because something like, "unsafe storage" for example, is witnessed by a LEO as having occurred in that moment. On the other hand an S128A/B violation, in reality, is not a "perpetual state of existence or violation" but rather an event that had occurred sometime in the past if someone was obligated to register and failed to do so....

-Mike
 
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AHM

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... there's a thing in MGL about statute of limitations on paper-type gun law violations... I just have to look it up again. It's less obvious because it's a derivative thing, one of those "everything under this section is subject to blah" or similar.
I sympathize with how MGL can hide laws in plain sight.
It'd be awesome if there is explicit language to that effect, no matter how obscure.

No rush, but don't neglect to come back and post it if and when you trip over it.
 

drgrant

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I sympathize with how MGL can hide laws in plain sight.
It'd be awesome if there is explicit language to that effect, no matter how obscure.

No rush, but don't neglect to come back and post it if and when you trip over it.
I sort of bumped without bumping, but it's in there... (like Prego) refresh the page (I edited my post to include a link)

 
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dcmdon

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Change the law or go home and put your guns away and then go to lunch
Or do what I do. I drive a very very uncool sedan in my gun nut circles. Part of the reason is I actually like to drive, rather than guide a land barge around.

The other reason is that once I disable the remote trunk release, the only way to get into the trunk is to crowbar it open.

My trunk meets the requirements for all transport in every state including federal FOPA requirements. I don't even own a locking gun case other than the one I fly with.
 

dcmdon

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Change the law or go home and put your guns away and then go to lunch
Careful. You will hurt the feelings of the Millennials who were never taught that they are responsible for their actions.

With that said, If the guy has no history of problems, cut him loose. Trust me. He will be the most conscientious gun storer in the state from this point on.
 

AHM

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I drive a very very uncool sedan in my gun nut circles. ... once I disable the remote trunk release, the only way to get into the trunk is to crowbar it open.

My trunk meets the requirements for all transport in every state including federal FOPA requirements.
Very impressed that my Civic Si has a locking remote trunk release,
and the rear seats can only be folded down to expose the trunk portal
by pulling handles located inside the trunk.
 

Broccoli Iglesias

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Another mistake this guy made was keeping all of his guns in his home, especially with all of this "red flag" hysteria going on nationwide. Keep a few inexpensive workhorse guns at home for regular home defense, hunting and other sporting purposes. Family heirlooms and other valuable firearms should be cached elsewhere; preferably out of state.
So, like owning a second property and leaving those guns alone for weeks or maybe months at a time?

That sounds like a bad idea.
 

Roadglide

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Or do what I do. I drive a very very uncool sedan in my gun nut circles. Part of the reason is I actually like to drive, rather than guide a land barge around.

The other reason is that once I disable the remote trunk release, the only way to get into the trunk is to crowbar it open.

My trunk meets the requirements for all transport in every state including federal FOPA requirements. I don't even own a locking gun case other than the one I fly with.
I get you. Personally, I don’t care what the law says. Even if it is legal to do so I think it’s a gamble to leave weapons in a car and I never do it. I mean I hear people on here constantly harping about not inviting the man into our lives. I personally see it as a quick way of doing so. Don’t need the headache
 

dcmdon

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I get you. Personally, I don’t care what the law says. Even if it is legal to do so I think it’s a gamble to leave weapons in a car and I never do it. I mean I hear people on here constantly harping about not inviting the man into our lives. I personally see it as a quick way of doing so. Don’t need the headache
I agree with you.

I try not to ever stop on the way home. But sometimes my wife wants me to stop for groceries, or I need to pick the kids up at an activity. I do what I can to be safe. I park near the end of a lane, in front if possible or near an entrance far away, and I drive a car that would realistically need to be stolen to have them get at my guns.

My car is a silver 13 year old Volvo S80 sedan. If ever there was a car designed to not draw the eye of law enforcement or thieves, this is it.

I used to drive a flashy sports car. I'd have friends say "hey, I saw you at walmart yesterday at 9:45". It sucked.

Now, I pass a friend, honk, wave, flash my lights and they still don't notice me.

Oh. And it's rated to tow 1600 KG. Or about 3500 lbs. With my 5 x 8 foot trailer, I can haul more than most pickup trucks.
 

assaultknifle

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If by reporting a crime, you end up incriminating yourself, then you should be protected by the 5th amendment and not have to report that crime.
We have 2 different crimes committed here. He shouldn't have told the police anything beyond what they needed to know. Car was broken into, gun was stolen. That's it.
 

Varmint

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Vaultek, in every room and vehicle. They work great, takes me a tenth of a second to access it. They aren’t “cheap” but neither is my life and status as a law abiding citizen. Well worth it and doubly so when I have little kids in my future. If you wake up in the middle of the night with a gun to your head, whether your sidearm is under your pillow, one in the pipe, cocked and off safe, you still aren’t getting to it in time. Vaultek in the nightstand is plenty peace of mind while also protecting your ass from storage laws.

Not trying to argue or nitpick just saying there are simple solutions to being in “compliance”.
I have a Vaultek in my Ebay wishlist for when they come back with 15% coupons. (Ebay seems to have stopped that) I have a single handgun safe (Ft Knox) but want a second one.

Your fists and feet (teeth etc) are for fighting your way to your handgun. :)
 

Roadglide

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What if you leave guns unattended at home and they get stolen. Do you also deserve to be slapped?
Maybe. I don’t agree with the law but until we change it, certain avoidable situations are a crapshoot. Why put yourself in a potentially shitty situation if you don’t have to.
 

Broccoli Iglesias

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Maybe. I don’t agree with the law but until we change it, certain avoidable situations are a crapshoot. Why put yourself in a potentially shitty situation if you don’t have to.
So, what you are saying is people cannot own guns and leave them in a safe at home while they go to work because they are unattended.

So, I guess your solution is to always carry all your guns or, people should have someone stay at home 24x7.
 
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If you didn’t do anything wrong you should complain via an attorney. If you f***ed up by leaving Guns unattended in a vehicle and they get stolen. Then you deserve to be slapped.
If you think it’s okay for someone who’s a victim of a crime to have the rest of their guns stolen by the state and be charged with multiple crimes then I think you have questionable morals.

He left his property in his car. That’s completely normal and I’ve never met someone who ensures their car is stripped of all possessions to prevent criminals with bad intentions from victimizing them.

He doesn’t deserve to have stuff stolen, and certainly doesn’t deserve to further have his rights violated and be charged as a criminal himself.

Having his gun stolen is punishment enough there’s no valid or moral reason for the state to punish him more. That’s unethical, immoral, perverse, and a genuinely f***ed up thing to do.
 

Roadglide

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So, what you are saying is people cannot own guns and leave them in a safe at home while they go to work because they are unattended.

So, I guess your solution is to always carry all your guns or, people should have someone stay at home 24x7.
No. Safe is where I put mine. I thought by unattended you meant out in the open where anyone has access.
 

drgrant

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If you didn’t do anything wrong you should complain via an attorney. If you f***ed up by leaving Guns unattended in a vehicle and they get stolen. Then you deserve to be slapped.
Lol and this makes you part of the problem- by thinking its "cool" for people to eat criminal liability for a bogus paper crime while simultaneously being a victim of theft.

-Mike
 

Roadglide

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Lol and this makes you part of the problem- by thinking its "cool" for people to eat criminal liability for a bogus paper crime while simultaneously being a victim of theft.

-Mike
Having your guns stolen out of your car is a bogus paper crime? Cool is your word not mine.
 

drgrant

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Having your guns stolen out of your car is a bogus paper crime?
No, the idea of criminally prosecuting someone for losing a gun via SOMEONE ELSE's criminal act, is a bogus paper crime.

Cool is your word not mine.
Well, if the shoe fits...

If you didn’t do anything wrong you should complain via an attorney. If you f***ed up by leaving Guns unattended in a vehicle and they get stolen. Then you deserve to be slapped.
The shoe fits pretty well...


-Mike
 
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