Comm2A files an Amicus in NRA backed suitability challenge at the SJC

[JohnZ]

Yes, trained, equipped, and ready if the need arose. The free "State" was not necessarily the individual states, (it could) be) but it also meant the country as a whole.

There was a video someone posted a while back where the guy said that "free state" has nothing to do with states (or any .gov) but the state of someone being free. Given the level of intelligence of the framers and what they were trying to accomplish at the time, my opinion is that this interpretation is the correct one. Too bad they never planned for the mental midgets we have today.

 

[Billsail]

There was a video someone posted a while back where the guy said that "free state" has nothing to do with states (or any .gov) but the state of someone being free. Given the level of intelligence of the framers and what they were trying to accomplish at the time, my opinion is that this interpretation is the correct one. Too bad they never planned for the mental midgets we have today.

I hadn't thought about "Free State" that way, but it is a possible interpretation.

 

[Cero]

OK, so now that the lunatics who think they can take down the entire system in one shot have had their day and ****ed us all royally, now it's time for the adults to get to work. This case was so ill-advised and reckless as to be basically a gift to the anti-gunners. These people may as well have been trying to make our lives miserable.

I was reading this and thinking the same thing. This ruling allows for any un-convicted or charged criminal activity to be grounds for denial of 2A rights.
Also very strange to rule that since it's presumptively lawful to restrict carry outside the home it's definitely ok to revoke someones license because that's less of a burden on 2A. Not understanding that you can't own a firearms at all if you don't have a license in Ma

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Yes, the Mass SJC is a bunch of retards.

Nope. They are a smart group who know how to use their position to impose their view of how society should be run on the public, and realize that there is nothing that can be done to penalize them for decisions that fly in the face of the law.

 

[PaulD]

Yes, trained, equipped, and ready if the need arose. The free "State" was not necessarily the individual states, (it could) be) but it also meant the country as a whole.

It doesn't f***ing matter what the prefatory clause says. It states a reason. Not the only reason. Not a reason that excludes other reasons but one, possibly main, reason. The simple ability to parse the language and apply logical set analysis to this would state that to be true, but these halfwits can't do that.

- - - Updated - - -

Nope. They are a smart group who know how to use their position to impose their view of how society should be run on the public, and realize that there is nothing that can be done to penalize them for decisions that fly in the face of the law.

And there's that interpretation as well, which is really saying they have complete contempt for you and I.

 

[Chevy 2 65]

Now what??

 

[swatgig]

Now what??

Go time?

 

[Chevy 2 65]

Go time?

Can it be appealed?

 

[Rob Boudrie]

Can it be appealed?

Only to SCOTUS.

Even if an appeal is filed, SCOTUS will most likely deny cert - which is their way of not rocking the boat without taking any position on a case (though the side that likes the status quo will generally refer to a denial of cert as "SCOTUS siding with them").

 

[terraformer]

What next is we start picking away at this the right way. We already have a case that attacks one section of that decision in the pipeline.

 

[Knuckle Dragger]

What next is we start picking away at this the right way. We already have a case that attacks on section of that decision in the pipeline.

And we have to sharpen and re-focus our avenues of attack. This was never going to be easy and it just got a great deal harder. But we're still in the game. We're still committed. We just need to pick away at the minutia. This is not a sprint (although we might have thought so at one time). This is a marathon and we continue to need the sustained support of people who care.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

this. Holden wasn't anywhere close to a plausible case.

It would have been if gun rights cases were like other cases.

The courts routinely make rulings in favor of dirtbags on technical issues like warrants, interrogation procedure, diameter of rubber hose used in questioning, etc. without regard to "will a ruling against the system help some d-bag who really deserves to get screwed over". The principle of let 10 guilty people go free to avoid screwing over one innocent seems pretty well established.

But, when it comes to gun rights, courts frequently operate according to a different set of rules. The operative principle is "deny 10 people who are not a problem their gun rights if it will prevent one truly unsuitable person from being armed."

------------------

One thing that is frustrating in the Comm2a work is having to run damage control - worrying about ill advised cases; semi-competent attorneys trying to make a name for themselves or running hail mary passes for a plaintiff with a checkbook; and reluctance to accept any advice from people who specialize in this arena and know what they are doing. Some attorneys can be as damaging to the cause as pro-se plaintiffs.

When the SJC takes a case sua sponte, it's often because they don't want the appellate court to issue a well reasoned opinion that is contrary the public policy desired by the justices.

 

[GlockJock]

Yes, the Mass SJC is a bunch of retards.

"The prefatory clause of the Second Amendment ("well regulated Militia") anticipates some regulation."

- - - Updated - - -

This is not good for NH either. We have suitable person language. The NHSC could decide to use this case when another suitability case comes before them.

Retards, indeed... But aren't we (pro2A Massachusetts residents) just as "retarded" as the members of the Mass Supreme Judicial Court.

After all, we stay in this completely effed-up backwards thinking hellhole, we adibe by the law, we work jobs and own businesses, and pay ridiculously outlandish, exorbitant taxes... the proceeds from which are used to handsomely reward these pin-headed, nitwit, moonbat-inspired retards (judges AND legisltors) for making and upholding ridiculous laws, rules and regulations..
They're "retarded"?... Every time another ruling like this comes down, I look in the mirror and wonder who the bigger fool is.

Woops, it's getting late.. gotta stop typing now and head off to work. The CommonPuke of LiberChusetts needs my tax $$$$$.

 

[bobalama]

Not really "on-topic" but thanks for the effort COMM2A - monthly 15.00 dollar donation coming your way.

 

[rickinma]

It's been a while since I've read this thread, but this case was NRA funded right? Does anyone know who to provide feedback to on that? I want to tell them I'm not happy that they didn't do their homework and that they hurt the cause

 

[soloman02]

Retards, indeed... But aren't we (pro2A Massachusetts residents) just as "retarded" as the members of the Mass Supreme Judicial Court.

After all, we stay in this completely effed-up backwards thinking hellhole, we adibe by the law, we work jobs and own businesses, and pay ridiculously outlandish, exorbitant taxes... the proceeds from which are used to handsomely reward these pin-headed, nitwit, moonbat-inspired retards (judges AND legisltors) for making and upholding ridiculous laws, rules and regulations..
They're "retarded"?... Every time another ruling like this comes down, I look in the mirror and wonder who the bigger fool is.

Woops, it's getting late.. gotta stop typing now and head off to work. The CommonPuke of LiberChusetts needs my tax $$$$$.

You make a good point. NH isn't perfect either though it does seem like we have a better ability to make positive change here.

 

[mark056]

Not the poster child you wanted.

Would someone please explain what this means, emphasis highlighted by me: Page 21 " where the Commonwealth has not totally banned the open carrying of firearms but has subjected such activity to licensing the question becomes not whether any regulation is permissible under the Second Amendment but whether the particular regulation is permissable." Is this tacet acknowledgement by this court that open carry is indeed legal to those holding a MA LTC, is it something that could be used lest someone get jammed for OC? I note they then refer to Hightower. What's the deal?

I know that for years people say that OC in Mass is legal and some claim they have done it, others don't want to risk losing their LTCs. Just curious...

 

[jtnf]

@maro056 - The whole gist of the original case was to challenge suitability... A judicial footnote doesn't carry the weight of a directed, on-topic decision: I doubt that the highlighted footnote would let some other schmuck off the hook when his CLEO pulls his ticket for OC.

 

[Whutmeworry]

What next is we start picking away at this the right way. We already have a case that attacks one section of that decision in the pipeline.

Yes, but won't this new case just end up going either through the MA SJC again, or the MA District Court that just "affirmed" that the MA AG can unilaterally keep any presently-produced handgun model she wants to from being sold in MA for basically no reason at all???

We're living in something even worse than a banana republic now. At least in an actual banana republic, most the people realize they're at the mercy of the state. Here the people just don't give a f*ck. That said, I'll still continue to donate to Comm2a, at least until the government finds a way to ban that too!

 

[mark056]

Yes, but won't this new case just end up going either through the MA SJC again, or the MA District Court that just "affirmed" that the MA AG can unilaterally keep any presently-produced handgun model she wants to from being sold in MA for basically no reason at all???

We're living in something even worse than a banana republic now. At least in an actual banana republic, most the people realize they're at the mercy of the state. Here the people just don't give a f*ck. That said, I'll still continue to donate to Comm2a, at least until the government finds a way to ban that too!

Well the good thing about banana republics is that they frequently have lots of revolutions and overthrow the government. They might replace one dictatorship with another but at least they express their displeasure with the status quo in a meaningful way. The people on top are always slightly in fear of a revolution.

 

[Whutmeworry]

Well the good thing about banana republics is that they frequently have lots of revolutions and overthrow the government. They might replace one dictatorship with another but at least they express their displeasure with the status quo in a meaningful way. The people on top are always slightly in fear of a revolution.

Touche!!!

 

[Squire]

Progressive Statism is causing a degeneration back to oppression of Individual Rights which a Revolution was fought over.
Rather than a King, the Tyrannical Dictator is the Will of the Majority, and it does not care about Individual Civil Rights.
At this moment, the Will of the Majority tends to champion these "Progressive" principles, hallmark of a "Civilized Society", they claim, which, regardless of their intent, result in Dependence on the State, even for Security.
The Will of the Majority, at the moment, seems to prefer an Impotent Republic, and a powerful Executive, contrary to the Separation of Powers established by the Constitution.
As long as the Executive behaves as a Benevolent Dictator (or at least non-Malevolent, to the Majority and their Interests), this will remain desirable as Progress which "Does the Most Good for the Most People".
Until the Malevolent Dictator emerges that has all the Power and is equally Malevolent to the oppressed Minority and baffled Majority.
The champions of Individual Rights will have been silenced, disarmed, and if they are still alive, will look at the Majority and ask Why did you forsake me?
At that moment, who will have the power to Revolt against that Tyrannical Dictator, who came to Power through the Will of the Majority, but no longer has to answer to them?

 

[GlockJock]

You make a good point. NH isn't perfect either though it does seem like we have a better ability to make positive change here.

That you do.
But, then again, the fine residents of Beijing probably "have a better ability to make positive change" in their land than we law abiding, honest, hard working taxpaying family men and women in Massachusetts do...

 

[GlockJock]

Well the good thing about banana republics is that they frequently have lots of revolutions and overthrow the government. They might replace one dictatorship with another but at least they express their displeasure with the status quo in a meaningful way. The people on top are always slightly in fear of a revolution.

In Massachusetts??

DeLeo and his minions, along with justices who have lifetime appointments are in fear of NOTHING in this wingnut liberal, "only cops need guns" moonbat state. A state where a POLICE CHIEF is allowed to arbitrarily decide who can and cannot protect themself with lethal means.

Like, you know, the police chief in Waltham who routinely denied LTCs to law abiding applicants, while citing the "suitability" rule.
Then he went home and beat the living piss out of his wife in front of her friends, punching her in the face and head while slamming her head against (if memory serves) a refrigerator door, etc....I always wonder why these FACTS aren't raised when the "Police Chief Suitability" crap comes up in court.

Oh, I know why. Cuz cops are part of the establishment here, and cops are good. Better than me. And only cops should own guns. ..And, for the umpteenth time in this forum, I'll mention the "list". You remeber my "list" no? Couple years ago I made a list of the ten most F*CKED UP guys I know. Spousal abuse/domestic violence/suicidal/alcoholism/drug addiction/rage/steroids/depression etc etc etc.

Seven out of the ten names on the list are cops. One is a captain. Two are lieutenants. And among the remaining three, one is an alcoholic and cocaine addicted assistant district attorney (who carries his Sig p229 or his G17 with him at all times. Especially when he's out with us at the restaurants and pubs, etc etc).

Only cops need guns. Period.

 

[mark056]

In Massachusetts??

DeLeo and his minions, along with justices who have lifetime appointments are in fear of NOTHING in this wingnut liberal, "only cops need guns" moonbat state. A state where a POLICE CHIEF is allowed to arbitrarily decide who can and cannot protect themself with lethal means.

Like, you know, the police chief in Waltham who routinely denied LTCs to law abiding applicants, shile citing the "suitability" rule.
Then he went home and beat the living piss out of his wife in front of her friends, punching her in the face and head while slamming her head against (if memory serves) a refrigerator door, etc....I always wonder why these FACTS aren't raised when the "Police Chief Suitability" crap comes up in court.

Oh, I know why. Cuz cops are part of the establishment here, and cops are good. Better than me. And only cops should own guns. (And, for the umpteenth time in this forum, I'll mention the "list". You remeber my "list" no? Couple years ago I made a list of the ten most F*CKED UP guys I know. Spousal abuse/domestic violence/suicidal/alcoholism/drug addiction/rage/steroids/depression etc etc etc.

Seven out of the ten names on the list are cops. One is a captain. Two are lieutenants. And among the remaining three, one is an alcoholic and cocaine addicted assistant district attorney (who carries his Sig p229 or his G17 with him at all times. Especially when he's out with us at the restaurants and pubs, etc etc).

You sure went off the track with that one. Hone your critical reading skills Dude. You wasted some valuable time and wasted mine by reading it. That's why Massachusetts isn't a banana republic. Irony and sarcasm are usually lost on fools and Glockjocks who tell us nothing we already don't know.

Based on what I've read of your combined literary efforts subtlety and penetrating insights are not your strongest areas. You have a good heart when it comes to the 2A and that is to be commended. Including the fact that you have an unrestricted Mass LTC is nothing special, it means that you probably live in a Green Municipality or that your lord and masters took pity on you, humble serf and gave you an unrestricted LTC. It doesn't make you special. I have one of those too, as do the majority of Mass LTC holders, surprise, surprise. I have a NH Non-Res too...and what does that mean exactly? I paid 100 dollars so I can carry concealed and have a loaded handgun in my vehicle. Doesn't make me special or you special. You like Glocks, I surmise, great, probably means you spent way too much money to buy a used one here in Massachusetts. Yeah I'm a dick or a pissy old man (my preference these days), call me names if you want, I've already saved you the trouble, truth is I don't much care one way or the other. Don't try to be master of the obvious. Most of us know what the deal is with regard to Firearms Licensure in Massachusetts. You don't need to explain it to us at the Mass Gun Law 101 Level.

 

[GlockJock]

You sure went off the track with that one. Hone your critical reading skills Dude. You wasted some valuable time and wasted mine by reading it. That's why Massachusetts isn't a banana republic. Irony and sarcasm are usually lost on fools and Glockjocks who tell us nothing we already don't know.

Based on what I've read of your combined literary efforts subtlety and penetrating insights are not your strongest areas. You have a good heart when it comes to the 2A and that is to be commended. Including the fact that you have an unrestricted Mass LTC is nothing special, it means that you probably live in a Green Municipality or that your lord and masters took pity on you, humble serf and gave you an unrestricted LTC. It doesn't make you special. I have one of those too, as do the majority of Mass LTC holders, surprise, surprise. I have a NH Non-Res too...and what does that mean exactly? I paid 100 dollars so I can carry concealed and have a loaded handgun in my vehicle. Doesn't make me special or you special. You like Glocks, I surmise, great, probably means you spent way too much money to buy a used one here in Massachusetts. Yeah I'm a dick or a pissy old man (my preference these days), call me names if you want, I've already saved you the trouble, truth is I don't much care one way or the other. Don't try to be master of the obvious. Most of us know what the deal is with regard to Firearms Licensure in Massachusetts. You don't need to explain it to us at the Mass Gun Law 101 Level.

I'm not gonna call you a dick OR a pissy old man. I'll save the name calling and stupid sh*t like that for the next time I attend 2nd grade.

It's posts and replies like yours that make me wonder why I bother participating in this FORUM (i.e. "exchange of ideas/thoughts/views/etc") in the first place. Guys and gals who "know it all" or are older and wiser and have been on NES longer than others, therefore their views are tantamount and everyone else who posts is potentially a "fool", etc etc.
Whatever. You're right (obviously) and I'm wrong. I'm "a fool", cuz YOU say so.
I've been married to a Sicilian for 30 years. I'm used to it.

"See ya".
(signing off now too see if I can find some Continuing Education classes at some community college near Fitchburg or Leominster. If I do, I'll sign on again...When I'm "wicked smart" and no longer a "fool").

 

[Knuckle Dragger]

The irony is that Holden is not prohibited by law from obtaining an LTC and I'm very certain that there are a few chiefs out there that would issue him a license if Holden were a resident. Holden just needs to figure out where to move to.

Wouldn't that be poetic FU to the system?????

 

[JohnZ]

The irony is that Holden is not prohibited by law from obtaining an LTC and I'm very certain that there are a few chiefs out there that would issue him a license if Holden were a resident. Holden just needs to figure out where to move to.

Wouldn't that be poetic FU to the system?????

And then move back to the old town. By certified mail, baby.

 

[Coyote33]

Top state court backs Worcester chief on suspended gun license

Rejecting a constitutional challenge to Massachusetts' gun licensing law, the state's highest court ruled today that Police Chief Gary J. Gemme was legally justified in denying a license to carry a firearm to a Shrewsbury man who was charged with domestic violence, but not convicted.

16 comments so far... ;-)

 

[Coyote33]

Also heard them talking about this on the radio. They were saying how it upholds suitability now with case law.