C&R FFL not recognized by dealer in NH

[Broc]

I just brought this back up to show what everyone is dealing with. I have this archived in my word folder for just such occasions. As far as I am concerned this guy is just on a power trip. Good thing he isn't a cop.

This was posted April 27, 2019 on Northeast Shooters Page #8 about Shooters Outpost opening a new store in Amherst, NH

FID & buy all the Ammo in the place. No FID/ no ammo. It does prevent ammunition from my store to be on your streets by the people that you wouldn’t want to be in public with your family. It has little to do with your AG. To prevent the accusations of profiling, we ask everyone to see the FID/or LTC. There has been more than you could ever imagine. No card holder has ever left without ammunition or compliant long guns they’ve wanted. You folks think it’s about you, it’s about the ones that can’t get what you have. If I just sold to everyone without asking, you’d be more pissed off if one of those “bad” sales ended up with it being unlawful to shop on this side of the border or your family were victimized by one of those scum. Come work for a week, I’ll show you some that would scare the shit out of you!

Shooters-Hooksett, Monday at 10:37 PM Report

#225/242

So what would he do if MA became constitutional carry and no license was required?

I tell you what, he would sell to people, and some scumbag that wanted ammo would still get it.

I get his point, but you can't worry about sh*t like that, you need to follow Federal law and your State law. As long as you don't suspect, or are aware, the person will use it to commit a crime, sell the product.

With that mentality, why sell guns to ANYONE? ... even someone that can purchase a gun can go crazy and shoot a bunch of people. A NH resident that doesn't need a license could be getting a gun to shoot a bunch of kids. A MA LTC holder could be getting a long gun to go shoot someone. But that doesn't matter to him because he is following NH and Fed laws. So why care about MA?

Get the f*ck out.

I wish he would just say something like "I sell a sh*t ton of guns, AG from every State in NE would love to get a piece of me, even if they can't do anything they can cost me thousands in legal fees, so I do what I do to protect my business, sorry if you are not comfortable, you are free to open your own FFL" ---- that, I would respect.

The FFL near my house won't transfer frames, I asked why and he was very honest, he said it was a pain in the a** to open, they tried to go at him from every angle and they are paying attention, he is not going to risk his business for a frame. I respect that and because I respect it, you don't see me posting sh*t about them.

 

[Amputee Marksman]

The bottom line with Shooters or any other place is, their store, their rules. If you don't like them then shop some other place. I personally don't shop at Shooters. I used to spend a lot of money there years ago and then I got more educated and knowledgeable on the laws and NH gun stores and I took my business elsewhere. That said, sometimes I will till get stuff at Shooters if they have something I want for a decent price or if I happen to be with someone else who wants to go there.

Funny thing, I have been treated better at Bass Pro in Hookset than at Shooters. I've bought ammo, magazines and other stuff, always on sale, and never been asked a single question. Of course I always pay cash but I have gone into shooters and attempted to pay cash and still been asked for my LTC.

 

[bostonasphalt2]

This shop is in NH, so what you experienced was a healthy dose of NH freedom

with a dose of stupidity attached to it, however. "We don't recognize C&R's"...go ahead, alienate part of your customer base. Go right ahead. They are free to do what they want, doesn't mean they aren't being morons about it.

 

[Blackmore]

I'm not saying a C&R license shouldn't be accepted, but perhaps if you could check the validity of a C&R on FFL eZ-Check (you can't), dealers like Jim and others wouldn't be so hesitant to accept them.

 

[Len-2A Training]

I'm not saying a C&R license shouldn't be accepted, but perhaps if you could check the validity of a C&R on FFL eZ-Check (you can't), dealers like Jim and others wouldn't be so hesitant to accept them.

That would expose home addresses of all collectors. The media would love this, they'd publish the info in a heartbeat. So for privacy reasons, this is a non-starter.

I remember many years ago, KTP had a wholesale arm located upstairs (IIRC) and to the back of the building. KTP back then would not accept C&R FFLs either. From what I can gather, after they closed the wholesale operation, the policy changed. From what I recall Lew Horton's also didn't accept C&R FFLs and they likewise had a wholesale operation. My guess is that these companies didn't want to cut their customer base out of the sale of C&R guns.

Each company gets to decide their own policies within the law and operates accordingly. However, they should be upfront and honest that it is policy and never lie by telling customers that it is the "law".

 

[HKPB]

This isn’t new. It’s a policy they’ve had for some time now. They wouldn’t sell me a C&R gun about 8-10 years ago when I tried to purchase. Basically they don’t accept them.

Odd. They sold me a C&R handgun three years ago with no issues. So either they keep changing their policy or else it depends on which store employee you deal with.

 

[greencobra]

This shop is in NH, so what you experienced was a healthy dose of NH freedom

probably owned by a massachusetts transplant

 

[appraiser]

The bottom line with Shooters or any other place is, their store, their rules. If you don't like them then shop some other place. I personally don't shop at Shooters. I used to spend a lot of money there years ago and then I got more educated and knowledgeable on the laws and NH gun stores and I took my business elsewhere. That said, sometimes I will till get stuff at Shooters if they have something I want for a decent price or if I happen to be with someone else who wants to go there.

Funny thing, I have been treated better at Bass Pro in Hookset than at Shooters. I've bought ammo, magazines and other stuff, always on sale, and never been asked a single question. Of course I always pay cash but I have gone into shooters and attempted to pay cash and still been asked for my LTC.

I have been at Shooters Outpost with a NH resident who was paying cash and had to show a NH DL to buy a ten round magazine for a 43X

And up until then I thought NH WalMarts asking for NH ID or a MA LTC to buy ammo was the dumbest thing I ever saw

You don't have that problem at a shop like 619DW

 

[Broc]

I have been at Shooters Outpost with a NH resident who was paying cash and had to show a NH DL to buy a ten round magazine for a 43X

And up until then I thought NH WalMarts asking for NH ID or a MA LTC to buy ammo was the dumbest thing I ever saw

You don't have that problem at a shop like 619DW

Let's not forget many NES members DEMAND a NH resident have a gun license when doing a private transaction.

 

[appraiser]

Let's not forget many NES members DEMAND a NH resident have a gun license when doing a private transaction.

a NH P&R license covers the sellers backside legally

Yes you can sell FTF in NH to a Resident that is "personally known to you" and the definition of that is open for debate.

There have been many FTF transactions between NES members based upon just their interactions with each other on this forum.
That is because we "personally know" each other based upon years and years of interactions and in some cases transactions.

If a NH seller chooses not to do a FTF because they are not comfortable with the "personally known" thing, then the buyer is free to pay a FFL to do the transfer.

I can't force a seller to sell to me, nor can a buyer I don't know very well, or is not known to the forum ( low post count, not green, short time member, etc) expect me to take it on faith that they are not a PP or otherwise unable to own a firearm

As with every transaction, everyone has to be comfortable with the terms of the sale.

Now that being said, NH is still a better environment than MA for gun owners

 

[Broc]

a NH P&R license covers the sellers backside legally

Yes you can sell FTF in NH to a Resident that is "personally known to you" and the definition of that is open for debate.

There have been many FTF transactions between NES members based upon just their interactions with each other on this forum.
That is because we "personally know" each other based upon years and years of interactions and in some cases transactions.

If a NH seller chooses not to do a FTF because they are not comfortable with the "personally known" thing, then the buyer is free to pay a FFL to do the transfer.

I can't force a seller to sell to me, nor can a buyer I don't know very well, or is not known to the forum ( low post count, not green, short time member, etc) expect me to take it on faith that they are not a PP or otherwise unable to own a firearm

As with every transaction, everyone has to be comfortable with the terms of the sale.

Now that being said, NH is still a better environment than MA for gun owners

So why the big deal when a store asks for ID?
Or doesn't want to sell to someone?

 

[appraiser]

because a magazine is not a controlled item, except in communist states like MA


Same with ammo, and even in NH there is no LAW saying MA residents can't buy ammo, unlike MA where non resident LTC holders can not purchase ammunition

Cripes since NH is Con Carry a MA resident can carry here even if in the pre Bruen days MA issued them a T&H LTC, or "B Rammed"them as Medford was known to do

It is about Shooters IMHO being scared about getting a letter from Maura or whomever is sitting in that chair these days, or getting sued if someone in MA shoots someone with a bullet bought in NH.

If some Manchester gang banger walked into that store, and had a NH ID, they would sell them cases of ammo. Granted they might dime them out after the sale but they would do it. They have no way to know if the person is a PP either, all they know is it is OK to sell ammo to them because they have a NH ID.

 

[M1966]

Just another of many reasons Shooters hasn't seen a dime of mine for many years. My money, my rules...

 

[Christian]

Did you tell your friend to tell the NH Deli ticket emporium to ship to the MA Deli ticket emporium?


This could be as good as the prank of calling two Chinese food restaurants and have them speak with each other over the phone. Maybe better than the prank.

Listen to this while thinking about the 2 employees having a conversation about shipping a gun.


View: https://youtu.be/5yoiud5VTQA

Genius!

 

[Qwikdraw45]

Let's not forget many NES members DEMAND a NH resident have a gun license when doing a private transaction.

Because some of us have 1) taken a course taught by a NH lawyer who specializes in Federal and State law, and he highly recomends 1) an ID 2) proof of clean background - due diligence and 3) a bill of sale. Also, some of us have dealt with the A-F-T when a firearm has ended up where it didn't belong.

 

[drgrant]

This is all just institutional laze. Large shops can't be bothered to verify C&R status/age of the gun they're outbounding. It's lazy and stupid but it's an LCD path.

 

[drgrant]

Senseless.

If you're selling a C&R piece on GB, then not honoring 03 FFLs nukes the lion's share of your market. The 03 is most of the reason TO post old guns on GB, in fact.

Doubt. C&R holders are extremely rare in relative terms. We have a bias in MA because they're frequently used as a device to bypass shit laws and bad pricing. Most people in free states can't even be bothered to get an 03.

 

[AFAR/PFAR]

Let's not forget many NES members DEMAND a NH resident have a gun license when doing a private transaction.

Maybe because it is NH law for private sales, but feel free to keep showing your dumbf*** ignorance on the subject.

 

[drgrant]

I have been at Shooters Outpost with a NH resident who was paying cash and had to show a NH DL to buy a ten round magazine for a 43X

And up until then I thought NH WalMarts asking for NH ID or a MA LTC to buy ammo was the dumbest thing I ever saw

You don't have that problem at a shop like 619DW

It's pretty simple, imo..... this is just "box" vs "non box." Box stores are set up to sell to the bottom 98%. The loss of the 2% at the top is not really a huge loss to them. They (rightly or wrongly) perceive compliance burden as exceeding the value of that 2%. Business decision. Not hard to figure out. Don't like box store BS? Don't shop at box stores. Box stores are always gonna "box"....


View: https://youtu.be/Z8zNsUTWsOc



View: https://youtu.be/7o3WGvRHpyA

 

[Broc]

Maybe because it is NH law for private sales, but feel free to keep showing your dumbf*** ignorance on the subject.

Did I mention anything about a gun or did I only say "transaction"?

As far as I am aware that only applies to handguns.

 

[AFAR/PFAR]

Did I mention anything about a gun or did I only say "transaction"?

As far as I am aware that only applies to handguns.

The only reason one would ask for a PRL in NH is for a firearm.

As far as you're aware?

I linked the f***ing law guy.

 

[Broc]

The only reason one would ask for a PRL in NH is for a firearm.

As far as you're aware?

I linked the f***ing law guy.

You are very upset. Relax.

 

[AFAR/PFAR]

You are very upset. Relax.

Not hardly.

I do have a low tolerance for anti 2A shitburglers though.

You keep doing you.

 

[Broc]

Not hardly.

I do have a low tolerance for anti 2A shitburglers though.

You keep doing you.

Anti 2A, LOL. Go cry to your NH buddies. There is an entire thread for that.

 

[Thirwell1216]

Yeah, private business, their choice. They are printing money there. Don't want to even risk a Channel 5 news truck pulling up and getting accused of skirting some made up law by the psychotic Governer in MA. For every big fish such as this, there are 10 smaller fish in NH willing to work with you as they understand the C&R rules.

 

[drgrant]

Lol @ NH vs MA purse fights.... really?

 

[Mesatchornug]

Lol @ NH vs MA purse fights.... really?

It's been what...3...weeks since the last one? We were due.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Yeah, private business, their choice. They are printing money there. Don't want to even risk a Channel 5 news truck pulling up and getting accused of skirting some made up law by the psychotic Governer in MA. For every big fish such as this, there are 10 smaller fish in NH willing to work with you as they understand the C&R rules.

True.

When I ran a business, if I got the impression that a potential client was a bit sketchy or asked me to do something that I suspected might be unlawful, I made a business decision not to deal with that person/company. Jim gets to do the same thing. People may not like the result but having the media camped outside and threats by an AG or Gov'r is really not good for business. Everyone has to make their own judgement on their tolerance for those sort of potential problems, and modify their business practices to reflect said tolerance.

 

[heck ya beaches]

Lol @ NH vs MA purse fights.... really?

Ahem. It's a tactical bug out bag (designed by elite operators), thank you.

 

[heck ya beaches]

Doubt. C&R holders are extremely rare in relative terms. We have a bias in MA because they're frequently used as a device to bypass shit laws and bad pricing. Most people in free states can't even be bothered to get an 03.

Yep. I wanted to see if I could guess what it was before just googling for the answer. I thought maybe it was a "Commerce and Recreation" form of MA permission slip for carrying.