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Buying Legal Pot Will Get You On The Federal Database

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Reptile, Nov 17, 2018.

  1. drgrant

    drgrant Moderator NES Member

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    No it's not easy- it's only "easy" if someone is stupid enough that they have to remember how to breathe.

    The entire pot thing is "transient" per federal law if you actually read the 4473. I doubt they're going to bother fleshing this out much
    more, so none of this matters outside of a few corner cases (which really suck if you're in one of those corners, but I digress. )

    -Mike
     
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  2. Rob Boudrie

    Rob Boudrie NES Member

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    It is not "really clear" and you demonstrate a lack of actual understanding of the issue by making such a declarative false statement.

    The question is "Are you an unlawful user....", not "Have you ever been an unlawful user". The ATF does not consider persons who have used drugs in the distant past (I think it may be 6 months) to be prohibited persons, not does it require an affirmative answer to this question in order for it to be truthful. This is also demonstrated in the job applications of many armed federal agents who admitted to smoking weed in their youth.

    By your inapplicable standard, I would have to answer "yes" to "Are you a user of penicillin" because I was given some for strep throat as a child.
     
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  3. Woodsy

    Woodsy NES Member

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    The point is everyone is an unlawful user if you use it since they do not discern between prescription pot and that bought on the corner near your house. Frankly I don’t give a shit if someone smokes or not, I just choose to follow the law as it is written and until it changes. As for Governement work you are incorrect, as depending on the agency and clearance it is have you ever used it and many of the drug tests go much beyond 6 months.

    So smoke away dude, Hand over your license so they can track you. I’ll pass.
     
  4. Rob Boudrie

    Rob Boudrie NES Member

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    True, but you use "use it" in the present tense. You previous error was use of the term "at anytime".
    I never made the claim that 6 months was the standard for all govt jobs, so I was not incorrect. My point is that many armed federal positions do not require a lifetime of abstinence from the heathen devil weed.
     
  5. smokey-seven

    smokey-seven NES Member

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    Smiles.... [laugh2] [cheers] [slap]
     
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  6. Woodsy

    Woodsy NES Member

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    9BC76EB2-00A1-4325-9E47-953D4D9B5C02.jpeg
    I really don’t care if you want to get stoned all day. The fact is I choose not to lie on federal forms and if you choose to, that’s your choice. Federal positions are one thing and actual position where you need a secret or above clearance is much different. So here we go again with the devil weed comments etc. As I’ve said a 100 times I don’t give a shit if you smoke, really not one shit. I have many friends that smoke it and eat it, I don’t care. I do choose not to lie on federal forms, and if that is what you have an issue with, then you have that choice to put down false information.
     
  7. Rob Boudrie

    Rob Boudrie NES Member

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    A person who smoked years ago and answers no to "Are you a user of" rather than "have you ever been a user of" is not lying or putting down false information.

    You seem to have difficulty grasping that concept.
     
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  8. Woodsy

    Woodsy NES Member

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    I’m guessing You can put down what you want if you smoked in the past day or month or year.
     
  9. crispnipz

    crispnipz

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    Operative word is "they" since the only entity that might be "tracking" is the dispensary, not MA.

    Full text of Question 4 from 2016 begins on Page 14 of this: https://www.sec.state.ma.us/ele/elepdf/IFV_2016.pdf

    So really it's up to the dispensary whether or not they retain your information, but MA isn't doing it. At least, they're not admitting to it and I can't find anything in this text nor in the 2017 amendment to this law that suggests MA knows who bought what from a recreational dispensary.

    I'm sure some dispensaries keep personal information and others don't. It doesn't hurt to ask!
     
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  10. Woodsy

    Woodsy NES Member

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    Sorry I can’t reply to a non green Member
     
  11. crispnipz

    crispnipz

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    ...but you just did? And I am planning on becoming green (not talking about pot of course)
     
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  12. Woodsy

    Woodsy NES Member

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    Sorry I can’t reply to a non green Member
     
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  13. Super99Z

    Super99Z NES Member

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    The people that fall over themselves to be honest to an entity whose agents and various elected officials are constantly lying to those same people, are quite humorous.
     
  14. rcwhat

    rcwhat

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    As boy genius does it again.
     
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  15. namedpipes

    namedpipes

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    [rofl]
     
  16. Woodsy

    Woodsy NES Member

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    Actually it’s an auto reply my little girl genius
     
  17. rcwhat

    rcwhat

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    Is this an auto reply too? Lol
     
  18. Woodsy

    Woodsy NES Member

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    Yes! I have several for people with moths in their wallets that are not green members.
     
  19. orgcandman

    orgcandman

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    Without having read the thread, I just wanted to chime in to ask whether your ID is scanned regardless of whether a purchase is made. Meaning, do they scan at the door even if you've decided you aren't purchasing anything? At the register when just before you make your purchase? Is a purchase recorded and tied to your ID?

    If the ID scan is required for entry, then the only thing gov't will prove is that you were present. After all, you can always decide *NOT* to purchase.
    Let's assume that a camera IDs you and sees you make a purchase. Still the only thing gov't can prove, at best, is temporary possession. And that isn't the same as using.
    Even if you go out to your car and smoke from there, and it's all captured on video, the gov't can only prove a one time use and my understanding is that one time use doesn't meet the federal definition of 'user'.

    All that said, I wouldn't want to be in a position where I would be facing all this evidence. I think there's likely to be probable cause to search your house if your ID is recorded - even at the door (unless they tie purchases to IDs and you don't have a purchase record, then it might be tougher). Still, it's probably difficult to prove that someone is a 'user' all said and told.

    IANAL, though.
     
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  20. crispnipz

    crispnipz

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    That depends on the dispensary but from what I've seen, the answer is yes.

    Way in the beginning of this thread I believe someone specifically references the dispensary NETA and being told by them that they only store your information for a day to enforce their daily purchase limit per-person. As I said before, to get a definite answer just call and ask the dispensary, but whether they retain records of who bought what is up to them as a company.
     
  21. kelton

    kelton NES Member

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    The news story I caught was at one of the first few that opened, they said they would scan your ID at 3 points
    1 Entering the store
    2 When the salesperson assists with products
    3 Pay at the register
     
  22. Kevin_NH

    Kevin_NH NES Member

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    Only checking for age at the entrance is required by Mass Cannabis Control Commission, unless they're showing a medical card (e.g. to save on the ~20% sales tax), any further ID check would just be the store collecting data for the heck of it.
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2019
  23. kelton

    kelton NES Member

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    The story/report didn't mention the MMC, only they wanted to verify age via ID at the 3 points of your visit to the shop
     
  24. durask

    durask

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    Let's say someone was an unlawful user of some kind of substance, how long do they have to be clean for in order for ATF to consider them clean?
     
  25. namedpipes

    namedpipes

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    It isn't defined.
     
  26. KBCraig

    KBCraig NES Member

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    "Current user"? Nope, I quite about five minutes ago. "Addicted"? Nope, can't get addicted to cannabis.

    I always caution people about the ways to get trapped in this. If someone was addicted to legally prescribed painkillers, never using them off schedule or acquiring any of them illegally, they're still a prohibited person. And under the 12 Step theory, once you're addicted, you're an addict for life, even in recovery. That would make someone a lifetime PP over some post-surgery Vicodin used 30 years ago.
     
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  27. Kevin_NH

    Kevin_NH NES Member

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    The more states come into conflict with the Feds on this, the more opportunity for somebody to unwittingly volunteer to be our first real test case for 18 USC § 922(g)(3).

    OTOH, "12 Step theory" isn't Federal law, isn't codified in 21 U.S.C. 802.
     
  28. powerman

    powerman NES Member

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    The term “addict” means any individual who habitually uses any narcotic drug so as to endanger the public morals, health, safety, or welfare, or who is so far addicted to the use of narcotic drugs as to have lost the power of self-control with reference to his addiction.

    easy fix, make MJ not a Narcotic on the list. also seems like a hard bar to get over using MJ
     
  29. namedpipes

    namedpipes

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    So what you're saying is, if I ever develop a drug addiction problem, I should kick it on my own and NOT leverage official or unofficial resources to stop, like the 12-step, for fear the government could later use that to define me as a PP. That's alarming because it discourages people with problems from SEEKING help, which seems counterintuitive. Shouldn't our priority be to help people that desire help, to stay healthy in all ways?

    Oh, I know that's not what you were promoting, but it's a logical takeaway from "once an addict, always...". The state should not have that much knowledge about or control over our lives...
     
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  30. crispnipz

    crispnipz

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    They seem to be looking the other way until marijuana is either exempted from that statute via the STATES Act or removed from CSA entirely via some other law. There is statistically no chance that, given it is legal in 10 states (20% of states!), that hundreds, if not thousands of people have not already violated this statute.
     
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