Building you own walk-in style safe

[cory ashe]

I am looking for ideas on securing the walls, floor and ceiling for a walk in style safe. I have the door, door frame, and locks covered. I am mostly looking for ideas on materials for walls and ceiling. I have welding equipment and access to metal. The area I am considering using is a 8x6 area with a solid concrete floor, two conventional walls and a suspended ceiling. I was considering a conventional wood structure with a welded 12 Ga. steel lining, but I am looking for comments and suggestions.

I am not looking for the end-all, be-all "dream safe" here. Rather something adequate for safe storage of 20 or more inexpensive firearms and ammunition to keep them away from children and the average breaking and entering. My budget without the door and door casing is between $500 and $1000.

 

[Timberwolf]

You could go with a cinder block wall, with rebar inside. The rebar is drilled into the floor and cemented, the blocks threaded over the bars into position and cemented plus the space inside the block are filled too.

Don't forget about ventilation lest you will get rusting.

 

[MassHack]

I would be concerned about the suspended ceiling. The walls can be reinfoced, the floor should be sufficent, and you say you have the door covered. What do you have in mind for the door, that would be the most common point of attack?

 

[cory ashe]

What do you have in mind for the door, that would be the most common point of attack?

I have an industrial metal door that I hollowed out and cut the top layer off of. I welded in 1" sleeves on the top, bottom and three on the side and constructed my own cam lock with a handle similar to my sentry safe in my bedroom. Next I will be buying an electronic key pad dead-bolt style lock and integrating it into the cam lock on the door. I then will be welding the door panel back on and plating it with another sheet of 12 ga. and fully welding it to the door. It's not impenetrable, but it will keep out most of your average criminal element, and I plan to hide the door so that most people don't know it is there.

The door case is made from 4" c-channel with sleeves welded in to accept the locking pins from the door, and 1/2" x2" HRS "Home made" hinges that swing from the inside.


I like the block or brick idea, and as simple as it is, I hadn't thought of that. I guess that's why it helps to ask like minded people for ideas!

 

[Timberwolf]

Concider the door swinging outwards.

Inwards swinging door is easier to kick/ram open but swing it outwards, you now have the stops on the door jamb coming into play. An extra level of security.

Install a redundant ararm system - wireless, ultrasonic type - the ones that when removed set off the alarm. One at the rear of the room and one above the door or just to the side.

 

[Titan]

You probably already know this, since you have welding experience, but be especially careful when welding any metal that abuts other flammable surfaces.

Many fires are started when sufficient care isn't taken with blowtorches and welding equipment within a wood frame structure, due to unanticipated heat transfer.
.

 

[cory ashe]

Yeah, I would have to make it in my garage and piece it together in the house. I think I'm back to the liner idea. A buddy talked me out of blocks yesterday by breaking several different types of block with a framing hammer. He said it would be tougher to get into plywood than block.

I wonder what the logistics of pouring your own concrete walls out of a mixer would be?

 

[Titan]

Yeah, I would have to make it in my garage and piece it together in the house. I think I'm back to the liner idea. A buddy talked me out of blocks yesterday by breaking several different types of block with a framing hammer. He said it would be tougher to get into plywood than block.

I wonder what the logistics of pouring your own concrete walls out of a mixer would be?

Take a look at the concrete backer board used under tiles and in tub surrounds. It's about the thickness of sheetrock, but consists of cement with embedded mesh just below both front and back surfaces. I think it would be very strong backed up by sheet steel.
.

 

[Ripach]

Yeah, I would have to make it in my garage and piece it together in the house. I think I'm back to the liner idea. A buddy talked me out of blocks yesterday by breaking several different types of block with a framing hammer. He said it would be tougher to get into plywood than block.

I wonder what the logistics of pouring your own concrete walls out of a mixer would be?

Fill each course of cinder blocks with quick-crete, they're much tougher to break when they're made solid.

 

[Timberwolf]

Fill each course of cinder blocks with quick-crete, they're much tougher to break when they're made solid.

Which is what I said in my post.

Breaking the blocks without the fill is easy except they change strength when filled.

 

[Robert J]

Block walls after they are properly mortared in place are surprisingly strong, especially if the correct rebar is laid in every horizontal course as would be specified in a security wall. They also offer very good fire resistance when compared to plywood or cement board. I would not want to loose the space though. Consider a lamination of 3/4” plywood, sheet metal then another lam of ¾” plywood, with fire stop blocking every 2 feet in the stud cavities. You would not have to weld and most crooks don’t have the patience to spend an hour replacing blades on a saw. Another thing to consider is a trick from the banks, bury n/c supervised alarm wiring in the walls so if it cut while making a hole or shorted the alarm triggers.

 

[farmboy]

last year my brother and i worked for a small (4 people) custom cabinet company and one of our jobs was a full wall of built-in cabinets. the lady that owned the house wanted one wall of her office entirely covered with mahogany cabinets...and we did it. the only problem was that there was a closet door smack dab in the middle of the wall. my brother randomly threw out the idea of a secret-door cabinet and she loved it! long story short, i was planning on building a secret-door cabinet for myself for my bathroom closet and then i realized it might be a good place to keep my guns because the door hardware locks. ill try to post photos of the mahogany cabinets if i can figure out how

 

[mac1911]

Im not sure if it is cost effective, Have you thought about haveing concrete walls shot in? Like they do with gunite pools. http://www.cement.org/HOMES/ch_bs_shotcrete.asp.

 

[farmboy]

 

[Harleynut]

I maybe wrong but I think that the ammunition and guns are supposed to be stored seperatly. That may just be a Massachusetts thing though.
I really want Charlton Heston's basement safe complete with guns and range.

 

[M1911]

Block walls can be strong, but you'd better have a proper foundation underneath them.

I really want Charlton Heston's basement safe complete with guns and range.

Don't we all.

 

[farmboy]

 

[M1911]

I maybe wrong but I think that the ammunition and guns are supposed to be stored seperatly. That may just be a Massachusetts thing though.

There is no MA law requiring that.

 

[farmboy]

if anyone is interested in a secret-door cabinet, let me know. we can make basically anything to fit your needs. we build stand-alone cabinets where they still function as a china or book cabinet and have a latch that swings open and reveals the hidden storage compartment or we can do full custom built-ins as shown above. i apologize for the shameless self promotion but these are great units and we dont have any other advertising available yet.

 

[gillis51]

If you use CMU make sure the foundation is adequate to support the additional weight. 8" block filled solid will weigh about 85 lbs each. for a 7'-6" high wall that will add approx 740lb per linear foot of wall plus if you frame the ceiling into the wall even more weight. If it's slab on grade and is at least 4" thick you will probably be ok. If it's adjacent to a lally column and the lally is not sitting on a foundation, usually they are just embedded in the slab, you could run into some settlement of the house. If it's not slab on grade don't even consider using block with out first checking with an engineer.

 

[namedpipes]

if anyone is interested in a secret-door cabinet, let me know. we can make basically anything to fit your needs. we build stand-alone cabinets where they still function as a china or book cabinet and have a latch that swings open and reveals the hidden storage compartment or we can do full custom built-ins as shown above. i apologize for the shameless self promotion but these are great units and we dont have any other advertising available yet.

There is a thread from a month or so ago of workers and craftsmen showing their stuff.

I think there is also a tradesmen thread somewhere here for your "business" card.

 

[farmboy]

There is a thread from a month or so ago of workers and craftsmen showing their stuff.

I think there is also a tradesmen thread somewhere here for your "business" card.

thanks, much appreciated

 

[Manomet]

There was a link here somewhere showing most of that basement/ safe collection. It did not belong to Heston but to a collector in Pa. I believe. It went to auction.