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Brady Campaign attacks Starbucks

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http://www.examiner.com/x-4525-Seat...res-war-on-Starbucks-time-for-a-cup-of-coffee

The Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence has declared war on a Northwest institution, and in the process perhaps the public will discover the extremes gun prohibitionists will go in an effort to push their radical agenda.
The Brady Bunch has Starbucks squarely in its crosshairs, hoping to browbeat the coffee giant into refusing service to an evidently growing clientele of law-abiding firearms owners. In an e-mail message sent out this week, Brady Campaign President Paul Helmke laments that, “Starbucks is refusing to prohibit open carrying in its stores, despite protests from loyal customers."
UPDATE: My colleague, David Codrea, weighs in here on this nonsense.

Over the past few months, more and more gun owners have been gathering at restaurants and coffee shops like Starbucks with guns strapped to their hips--Paul Helmke

This was after Helmke acknowledged that his campaign of social bigotry against legally-armed citizens was launched because, “Over the past few months, more and more gun owners have been gathering at restaurants and coffee shops like Starbucks with guns strapped to their hips, intimidating fellow patrons.”
So, let me see if I have this straight. Because Starbucks is attracting increasing numbers of gun owners – presumably becoming the kind of loyal customers about whom Helmke writes – he wants the coffee chain to ban these people, in deference to his own ilk of hoplophobes.
In reaction, even more gun owners are declaring a sudden thirst for Starbucks blend and heading to their local coffee stand.
Is this not the same kind of nonsense I wrote about here last Friday, in reporting the angst demonstrated by Washington CeaseFire’s Ralph Fascitelli over the perfectly legal appearance at a public hearing in Olympia by several open carry activists?
The Brady camp has teamed up with CREDO Action, a self-proclaimed progressive activist organization that uses mobile phones to affect social change.
Helmke’s e-mail diatribe further complains that, “The practice of packing heat in places like Starbucks is intimidating and could be potentially dangerous to our families and communities -- and it must be stopped.
“It’s everyone's right to sit in a restaurant or coffee shop with their families without intimidation or fear of guns,” he says, “either concealed or openly carried.”
Intimidating to whom? This may come as a culture shock to Helmke, but it is equally everyone’s right – if they choose to exercise it – to sit in a restaurant with family or friends and not be concerned (because they are prepared) about criminal attack, or an incident on the scale of the Luby’s Massacre in October 1991, in which 23 restaurant patrons, disarmed at the time by Texas statute, were murdered. It might just be that Americans took a lesson from another incident two months later at a Shoney’s restaurant in Anniston, Alabama, in which a legally-armed citizen prevented a massacre by shooting two robbers who were herding people into a food locker.
I wrote about this incident with Alan Gottlieb in America Fights Back: Armed Self-Defense in a Violent Age.

Thomas Terry, the hero of Anniston, was discreetly but legally carrying a .45 caliber handgun when the robbers took over the restaurant. Facing two armed thugs, Terry shot one dead and severely wounded the other. None of the other patrons was harmed, other than Terry, who sustained a grazing wound to the hip.—Timothy Wheeler, MD

Helmke also argues that “Under the law, Starbucks has the right to adopt a gun-free policy, with an exception for uniformed police officers.”
Guess what, Paul. Starbucks also has the right as a business to allow patronage by anyone it damn well pleases, including legally-armed citizens. Their money is just as good as yours, and so far, there has not been a single reported incident involving any of these gun owners, including the robbery of a Starbucks while an armed citizen happens to be standing at the counter.
Social bigotry against gun owners is just as insidious as bigotry against any other group. What would the public reaction be if someone demanded that a private business refuse service to, say African-Americans, Hispanics, Asians, Jews, Arabs, Native Americans, Samoans, disabled people, overweight people, gays or women? Got a tattoo? Stay out!
Helmke rants about intimidation, yet he has no reservations about trying to intimidate a business over some of the people it serves. His kind of demagoguery has one significant trait: Hypocrisy.
If Helmke and other gun prohibitionists don’t want to be around other citizens because they are legally armed, that is a problem, but it is their problem. Perhaps they should start drinking tea.
 
Oh God, I have a number of issues with this one!

- First, they specifically stated "law abiding citizens"....all I can say to that is WTF! The Brady Campaign is "supposedly" about keeping guns out of the hands of criminals.

- Second, they want such people prohibited who are carrying open or concealed.....again WTF!

- Third, they feel that customers should be able to come in and feel comfortable, not intimidated. Uhm, I know many liberal people who are actually quite racist (quietly of coarse) and are nervous about black people being around. As the writer points out, should we ban them too to satisfy their prejudices??? A bunch of retards!

- Finally, I think allowing open carry is a very good thing. If these lemmings were more exposed and used to guns being carried, perhaps they wouldn't be so intimidated. These people have gotten too used to their soft lives and their f'ing "Snuggies" of ignorance and now they want everyone to live like the lemmings that they are. No thank you, not on my watch.
 
you know, you spend some time watching some 'i gots me a gun!' youtube videos, and you can start to kind of understand where anti-self-defense activists get their weird ideas. however, the language used here is so asinine, i don't even know what to say. law-abiding citizens with guns are too intimidating? people having coffee in the same room with you, not even interacting with you? how about tall people, they're so... big! they might hurt me! in fact, since they have a longer reach, there's no tellling when they might just start punching people for no reason!
i demand our government mandate a standard arm length, and have zero-tolerance enforcement!
think of the children!
 
Oh God, I have a number of issues with this one!

- First, they specifically stated "law abiding citizens"....all I can say to that is WTF! The Brady Campaign is "supposedly" about keeping guns out of the hands of criminals.

- Second, they want such people prohibited who are carrying open or concealed.....again WTF!

- Third, they feel that customers should be able to come in and feel comfortable, not intimidated. Uhm, I know many liberal people who are actually quite racist (quietly of coarse) and are nervous about black people being around. As the writer points out, should we ban them too to satisfy their prejudices??? A bunch of retards!

- Finally, I think allowing open carry is a very good thing. If these lemmings were more exposed and used to guns being carried, perhaps they wouldn't be so intimidated. These people have gotten too used to their soft lives and their f'ing "Snuggies" of ignorance and now they want everyone to live like the lemmings that they are. No thank you, not on my watch.

This just goes to show the cockroaches in the Brady campaign (and similar groups) feel they are in such a bold position that they can show their *real* intention: absolute destruction of the rights of gun owners and to diminish the right to self-defense. American gun owners and pro-rights groups should be making the Brady campaign a radioactive turd-in-the-punchbowl to anyone Brady wants to support. *ANY* politician, business, group, or person that is associated with them in any way should be boycotted, shunned, and made a public example of.

Let's face it, they are better organized and more vocal than we are. They have nothing to lose as they are giving up nothing, we have everything to lose as once rights are compromised away they are gone forever. The AWB sunset was a fluke, that would never happen today. Until we start beating them at their own game and using our numbers, time, and money to fund a pro-rights movement that is based on no compromise we will be screwed and lose to these maggots.

I have heard local groups say "we gotta stay under their radar, or we will get crushed. They have more people and money than we do." Guess what folks, it is not going to get any better or easier. We need to start swimming or we will surely start drowning... the sharks be damned.
 
I have heard local groups say "we gotta stay under their radar, or we will get crushed. They have more people and money than we do." Guess what folks, it is not going to get any better or easier. We need to start swimming or we will surely start drowning... the sharks be damned.

I agree!
 
You know something? I just checked out the Brady Campaigns website and viewed their so called "facts" page. Talk about a bunch of horse shit! 50% of permit holders have a criminal background? hahahahaha... I say we put together a giant packet of all the real facts including all the FBI crime stats and flood their offices with them
 
You know something? I just checked out the Brady Campaigns website and viewed their so called "facts" page. Talk about a bunch of horse shit! 50% of permit holders have a criminal background? hahahahaha... I say we put together a giant packet of all the real facts including all the FBI crime stats and flood their offices with them

Even if that were true, they are probably including the most rediculous crap. Nothing that is a disqualifier in the strictest of states....even then, I can't buy it
 
Even if that were true, they are probably including the most rediculous crap. Nothing that is a disqualifier in the strictest of states....even then, I can't buy it

Ya my guess is they prob included a juvenile case where the applicant was 11 and beat up another kid in his class, or was caught smoking dope or anything else which shouldn't be criminal and have any bearing on the applicant's suitability to own a firearm. I got even more pissed when I read the quote on their sight from Obama regarding his take on concealed carry (he doesn't believe in it cuz he feels people carrying guns will INCREASE the number of innocent people shot during an altercation). I guess he doesn't realize armed citizens are what would prevent a "bad guy" from shooting everybody. Their logic, or lack thereof, is totally flawed in the worst way. And the worst part is there are so many sheeples that believe every word they say...all the more reason we need to stay together and keep pushing our rights forward.

And for the record...I don't drink coffee, but if Starbucks shoves this back in their face and continues the right to carry in their shops I will go out of my way to give them business, even if I need to choke down a cup o' joe
 
Ya my guess is they prob included a juvenile case where the applicant was 11 and beat up another kid in his class, or was caught smoking dope or anything else which shouldn't be criminal and have any bearing on the applicant's suitability to own a firearm. I got even more pissed when I read the quote on their sight from Obama regarding his take on concealed carry (he doesn't believe in it cuz he feels people carrying guns will INCREASE the number of innocent people shot during an altercation). I guess he doesn't realize armed citizens are what would prevent a "bad guy" from shooting everybody. Their logic, or lack thereof, is totally flawed in the worst way. And the worst part is there are so many sheeples that believe every word they say...all the more reason we need to stay together and keep pushing our rights forward.

And for the record...I don't drink coffee, but if Starbucks shoves this back in their face and continues the right to carry in their shops I will go out of my way to give them business, even if I need to choke down a cup o' joe

Oh, I always loved the mother of all Brady statistics. It's something like a child is killed by a handgun in this country ever 4 minutes, usually surrounded by pictures of grade school children. Yeah, what they don't tell you.....their definition of a child includes anyone under the age of 21!!! Oddly enough, that includes the ages of the most violent criminals in the country involved in the drug trade. That is something I like to use against them.....hey, that war on drugs really worked to curb drug use....same attitude should work for guns, right?
 
Oh, I always loved the mother of all Brady statistics. It's something like a child is killed by a handgun in this country ever 4 minutes, usually surrounded by pictures of grade school children. Yeah, what they don't tell you.....their definition of a child includes anyone under the age of 21!!! Oddly enough, that includes the ages of the most violent criminals in the country involved in the drug trade. That is something I like to use against them.....hey, that war on drugs really worked to curb drug use....same attitude should work for guns, right?

And since they're over 21 many are teenagers and other young men and women struggling with life so they decide to off themselves. Since when was that the fault of the gun? If the gun wasn't there they'd just jump in front of a train or poison themselves anyway.

I wish every member of the Brady Campaign decides to go get hit by a bus once we start fighting back even harder with TRUE UNBIASED facts and send them all into a deep depression :)
 
You know, it's perfectly reasonable to be against gun violence and not be against guns. I'm against gun violence. I'm against all violence. That's why I own a few guns. So I can stop violence.
 
You know, it's perfectly reasonable to be against gun violence and not be against guns. I'm against gun violence. I'm against all violence. That's why I own a few guns. So I can stop violence.

If they were truely against gun violence....they would ask states and major cities why the minimum sentances for gun control are not being followed? Why are X cases pleaded out when sufficient evidence exists? Why are habitual violent offenders getting early parole? Why aren't we cracking down more on shops that do straw sales? Why aren't the distributors that are unable to track cases of guns spending a minimum of 15 years in jail? THIS is effective against gun violence, not stripping your law abiding citizen of his means of protecting their life and the lives of their family. I have seen almost no movement from the "Brady Bunch" on these types of issues. It's always more infringements on our rights.
 
Should we open a coffee shop called "Shooters" where concealed and open carry is perfectly fine. And coffee sizes are 9mm for small, .40S&W medium and .45acp for large and 10mm for extra large. the only music played is country/ country rock .
 
If they were truely against gun violence....they would ask states and major cities why the minimum sentances for gun control are not being followed? Why are X cases pleaded out when sufficient evidence exists? Why are habitual violent offenders getting early parole? Why aren't we cracking down more on shops that do straw sales? Why aren't the distributors that are unable to track cases of guns spending a minimum of 15 years in jail? THIS is effective against gun violence, not stripping your law abiding citizen of his means of protecting their life and the lives of their family. I have seen almost no movement from the "Brady Bunch" on these types of issues. It's always more infringements on our rights.
What he said.
 
Let's face it, they are better organized and more vocal than we are.

I disagree. Brady/VPC/etc is a barking, ankle biting chihuahua that tries to make itself look like they have a bunch of people supporting them. They don't. If they had real grassroots support then we'd all be either fighting a war right now or reduced to being rock owners. I've often said that if I had a few school buses full of people I could push into the grand canyon, I could probably put 95% of the movers of the gun control movement in that 6 or so buses. The rest would just basically give up and go home. (Look what happened to the MMM, for example.... completely demolished, no more inertia...... soros/brady had to bail them out! )

Brady/VPC etc only gets their power from a few things:

-A few wealthy moonbat investors (like George Soros, some hollywood types, etc. )

-A few handfuls of sympathetic moonbat politicians with untouchable seats wrapped around their finger..

Without this second point, they are nothing. They are completely inconsequential without having that. The reason these pols maintain a relationship with brady/vpc/etc is because they only lose a handful of votes by doing so, and likely gain more than they lose. If we could upset the balance of that somehow, the game would be over.

I agree that RKBA groups need lots of improvement, no doubt. The sad thing is too is it would only take 20% of the gun owner population in the US to do it, too. As it is now, we can't get what... 5% of them to join a weeble wobble org like the NRA....

They have nothing to lose as they are giving up nothing, we have everything to lose as once rights are compromised away they are gone forever.

This is true. All they lose is money... mostly money that has come from George Soros, so it's not even theirs. (The antis
are so poor at fundraising, any income they get is from large wealthy beneficiaries).

The AWB sunset was a fluke, that would never happen today.

I disagree. The makeup of the house and senate right now is such that anti gun bills can gain no traction. A dem majority is no longer a rubber stamp for gun control, at least not with the present makeup of the two sides. Even at the beginning of Obama's term it would have been impossible. Politically speaking gun control has become a gigantic land mine that those with vulnerable seats want to stay away from. Look at the feeble attempts to renew the AWB... only full on moonbats with untouchable seats signed on as cosponsors. Even Pelosi didn't want to be attached to it! This is because even among moonbats, gun control is a political loser of an issue, lacking mainstream support.

This doesn't mean they won't try it again in the future, but right now the moonbats are on the run- trying to salvage their
attempt at socialized medicine, never mind gun control. If something national regarding gun control is coming out, it won't be during the next election cycle or so, at least.

Until we start beating them at their own game and using our numbers, time, and money to fund a pro-rights movement that is based on no compromise we will be screwed and lose to these maggots.

It won't take much. The problem is getting even 10% of the gun owners in this country to give a rats ass. It would only take 20 or 30% to completely annihilate them. Sad thing is we can't even mobilize 10%. Potential is there it just needs to be motivated and harnessed. There is plenty of fuel, someone just needs to build the reactor....

-Mike
 
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Y'know, I'm a Dunkin Donuts man through and through, but I think I might just pay a little visit to my local Starbucks and explain to the manager why I'm choosing to patronize their store (if Starbucks Corporate pushes back on this, that is) [smile]
 
If they were truely against gun violence....they would ask states and major cities why the minimum sentances for gun control are not being followed? Why are X cases pleaded out when sufficient evidence exists? Why are habitual violent offenders getting early parole? Why aren't we cracking down more on shops that do straw sales? Why aren't the distributors that are unable to track cases of guns spending a minimum of 15 years in jail? THIS is effective against gun violence, not stripping your law abiding citizen of his means of protecting their life and the lives of their family. I have seen almost no movement from the "Brady Bunch" on these types of issues. It's always more infringements on our rights.

When I wrote to my state rep regarding H2259, I mentioned that rather than us having the strickest gun control laws, instead we should have the most draconian violent crimes sentencing in the nation. Commit a crime with an illegally possessed gun? See you in no less than 10-15 years MINIMUM.
Legislators are so quick to test out new laws that benefit the newest and trendiest minority; instead they should experiment with putting CRIMINALS behind bars for a substantial amount of time and see if that don't just put a huge dent in the amount of violent crime
 
more and more gun owners have been gathering ..., intimidating fellow patrons.

...

Starbucks has the right to adopt a gun-free policy, with an exception for uniformed police officers.

So, if the sight of a gun being openly carried is intimidating, what happens to the " right to sit in a restaurant or coffee shop .. without intimidation or fear of guns, ... openly carried" when the police come in?

It's the same object -- and we've heard horror stories about "only ones" to boot.

Whatever right BradyCampaign is talking about seems quote flimsy.

BTW, what's with the "with their families"? Starbucks is not a family destination. [image: second grader drinking a "venti expresso".]
 
FWIW I'm against even using the term "gun violence". It's just as weaselly as "assault weapon". It was invented to prop up the BS notional that somehow or another, an innocent person that gets shot is "special" compared to someone stabbed a bunch of times, hacked with a machete, or beat to death. The antis invented it so they could focus people's attention on banning guns.... the term "gun violence" itself is living proof of the fact that antis have no real interest in actually reducing violent crime in general.

Let's think about it for a minute... When someone gets stabbed, nobody calls it "knife violence". When someone gets hit with a bat, nobody calls it "bat violence". So why should firearms be any different? The only reason the term "gun violence" exists is to demonize guns and gun owners
specifically- as if there is something about a gun that makes someone more violent )

-Mike
 
And another thing:

and could be potentially dangerous

Who writes this stuff?

According to them:

It's not dangerous.

It's not potentially dangerous.

But it could be potentially dangerous.

For its intention of fear-mongering, that couldn't be more lame.
 
Should we open a coffee shop called "Shooters" where concealed and open carry is perfectly fine. And coffee sizes are 9mm for small, .40S&W medium and .45acp for large and 10mm for extra large. the only music played is country/ country rock .

I was sold until you got to the soundtrack... now not so much
 
Should we open a coffee shop called "Shooters" where concealed and open carry is perfectly fine. And coffee sizes are 9mm for small, .40S&W medium and .45acp for large and 10mm for extra large. the only music played is country/ country rock .

Could you bring in your own travel cup and get a discount with a "Reloader's Card".
 
FWIW I'm against even using the term "gun violence". It's just as weaselly as "assault weapon". It was invented to prop up the BS notional that somehow or another, an innocent person that gets shot is "special" compared to someone stabbed a bunch of times, hacked with a machete, or beat to death. The antis invented it so they could focus people's attention on banning guns.... the term "gun violence" itself is living proof of the fact that antis have no real interest in actually reducing violent crime in general.

Let's think about it for a minute... When someone gets stabbed, nobody calls it "knife violence". When someone gets hit with a bat, nobody calls it "bat violence". So why should firearms be any different? The only reason the term "gun violence" exists is to demonize guns and gun owners
specifically- as if there is something about a gun that makes someone more violent )

-Mike

Well said. +10000000000000000
 
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