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Bad day at the range with the 357

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by gulfmp, Aug 4, 2018.

  1. greencobra

    greencobra NES Member

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    yes! my bad! :oops:
     

  2. 1919FAN

    1919FAN NES Member

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    Looks like its been fractured long before breaking away the break has signs of flame cutting I'm with Sweeney on the stretch fracture. I hope all turns out fine dont blame yourself there's no way you could have known that would happen.
     
  3. fencer

    fencer NES Member

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    Who else clicked on the thread and thought " I bet it was a Ruger "? I was surprised that it was an older gun.

    OP - I am glad no one was seriously injured. Hope you get your gun replaced.
     
  4. Zappa

    Zappa Road Warrior NES Member

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    I was thinking it was a Taurus or a Charter Arms.
     
    amm5061 likes this.
  5. greencobra

    greencobra NES Member

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    boycott ruger! oh, wait, we already are!
     
  6. Peicemaker

    Peicemaker

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    Call Ruger. If they they tell you to get forked, tell them that if they won't replace it, you and your buddy will be having your attorneys contact their legal department. You should have a prepaid shipping label in your email inbox within a half hour.
     
    Oldarmy likes this.
  7. Horrible

    Horrible NES Member

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    Wow you would think that a good strong Ruger revolver would be as tough as they come. Really surprised with this
     
  8. gulfmp

    gulfmp NES Member

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    I’m going to hold off on additional commments until I get an answer from Ruger. I will keep you all posted.
     
  9. one-eyed Jack

    one-eyed Jack Manufacturer Dealer NES Member

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    If you are not the original owner, ask what the barrel length was when made. I still wonder about possible stripped threads. Jack.
     
  10. Sweeney

    Sweeney NES Member

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    The threads are intact...they just aren't attached to the barrel anymore.
     
  11. drgrant

    drgrant Moderator NES Member

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    If that gun was a 340PD (or one of its kin) the gun likely blew up on its own, no "doubling" required. There have been at -least- 2 other people on NES that have had theirs blow up, plus a guy I know off the forum who had it happen to him, too.

    They probably replaced the gun because they didn't want to get sued. People have had them blow with factory ammo.

    -Mike
     
  12. straightshooterjake

    straightshooterjake

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    I have several thoughts on this issue.

    First, as others have mentioned, Ruger no longer does any repair service on the Six Series revolvers. However, I do not know what their policy is on providing replacements for revolvers that have failed due to factory defect. And I have little doubt that this gun has failed due to a manufacturing defect, most likely due to over-torquing the barrel during assembly. The way this barrel failed is not at all typical of how revolvers look if they are blown up by overpressure or a squib. My only concern about calling this a factory defect is that if we don't know the complete history of the revolver, then it is possible that someone removed and replaced the barrel after the revolver left the factory. In that case, the factory would not be responsible. Please keep us updated on how Ruger responds to this issue.

    I also want to mention that even in its current state, that "paperweight" has some value. It is still a complete parts kit for a stainless Security Six, except for the barrel. Numrich gun parts would charge $125 for the cylinder in that revolver, if they had any in stock, which they don't. There is a complete parts kit for a blued gun on Ebay for a more modest price, but I did not see any stainless kits at the moment. Since these guns were discontinued 30 years ago, and lots of people still like them, the parts are somewhat desirable. If you were to sell off all the parts as a complete kit, be aware that the bolt that locks the extractor, and its spring, are still attached to the broken barrel, and those parts should be included in a complete kit.

    Based on the nature of this failure, I feel like some discussion of the similar failures on Redhawk revolvers is required. There was an issue in the early 80's when a number of Redhawk revolvers failed in a similar way. This issue is pretty well known for two reasons. First, there were a number of failures where Redhawk barrels broke off, and it got some publicity. And second, Redhawk revolvers are pretty overbuilt, so the failure is surprising. Supposedly, the issue was eventually traced to one assembler who was over-torquing the barrels instead of cutting back the barrel face properly. Improper lubricants used while attaching the barrels was also involved.

    Here is a link about some similar failures on S&W revolvers. Half way through the article is a section about the Redhawk issues. Google can provide more articles on this subject.

    Revolver Liberation Alliance

    Of course, I do not know what was really happening at the factory when the defective Redhawk revolvers were produced. But I do know that the issue was resolved, and the Redhawk re-earned its reputation as an overbuilt gun that can take hot loads that would not be recommended for other large frame revolvers. Similarly, I consider the Security Six to be a pretty robust .357 magnum that can take lots of full loads without shooting loose. They are much tougher than the similar sized S&W K-frame magnums. I am sorry to see what happened to your revolver, but I still think it is a rare anomaly. I wish you luck on getting some resolution.
     
  13. Matt-CZ

    Matt-CZ

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    I wouldn't threaten legal action unless you have exhausted the customer service angle and are actually willing to get a lawyer involved. Once you mention legal action, most of these big companies kick the problem over to their legal department and won't talk to you anymore.
     
    jaypap and Mountain like this.
  14. bmac10

    bmac10 NES Member

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    makes sense
     
  15. AMV

    AMV

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    I believe it would have bulged the barrel if the bore was obstructed
     
  16. bmac10

    bmac10 NES Member

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    not if the barrel popped off first- whichever was the weakest link. Quite scary in any case!
     
  17. one-eyed Jack

    one-eyed Jack Manufacturer Dealer NES Member

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    I agree. Jack.
     
  18. straightshooterjake

    straightshooterjake

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    I want to add a follow up to my previous post (#72). In that post, I mentioned that this revolver still has some value as a complete parts kit. However, I have realized that statement may be misleading. Having a "complete parts kit" is usually the consolation prize for having a destroyed receiver. In this case, it is very likely that the frame is OK, and that the revolver is repairable. Unfortunately, it may not be economically feasible to repair the revolver, but it may still be possible.

    I suspect that the barrel failed due to excessive torque during installation or due to metallurgical failure. In either of theses cases, it would be possible for the frame to have incurred damage, but not that likely. If the frame is OK, then having a new barrel installed would be a safe and satisfactory repair.

    Unfortunately, even if it is possible to repair this revolver, it might cost more than it is worth. To do a repair, it would be necessary to remove the broken stub of the barrel from the frame. This step should be possible, but it might not be trivial. Then the frame would need to be professionally inspected for cracks and for damage to the barrel threads. If the frame was fine, then a replacement barrel would need to be found and installed by someone with proper tooling, including frame wrenches for a Security Six.

    Overall, it does not seem that likely to get this revolver repaired, but it was incorrect for me to refer to it as a paperweight. Even though it cannot be safely operated in its current state, it is still a gun. Hopefully, Ruger will offer to replace it with a current production model, and all of this discussion will be moot.
     
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  19. straightshooterjake

    straightshooterjake

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    If the barrel broke off due to the revolver being fired with a bore obstruction, then I would expect the broken off barrel to still be obstructed. Am I missing something here?
     
  20. Noreaster

    Noreaster NES Member

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    Yes, this. Don't go there until you are mentally prepared to either drop it or have a lawyer follow up (and they don't help for free).

    OP, Hopefully you are contacting Ruger and please keep us updated with how Ruger handles this for you. There was clearly a product failure here, the fact they don't make it anymore, should not leave you empty handed. Ruger does not state a warranty at all - and this is intentional.
     
  21. mothybee

    mothybee NES Member

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    I wouldn't mention any injuries, they'll instantly think liabilities if they take blame for gun by fix or replacement. If asked just say YOU were not injured.
     
  22. mothybee

    mothybee NES Member

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    Giving the couple (if legal) a SR22 or victory22 not a bad idea either as someone stated.
     
  23. bmac10

    bmac10 NES Member

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    ah! Excellent point!!
     
  24. bmac10

    bmac10 NES Member

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    perhaps if it was an African Swallow..
     
  25. AHM

    AHM NES Member

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    It seems premature to worry about parting out the wreckage.

    If the OP's burned guest wants compensation (or revenge)
    for having a gun explode in his bare hands,
    and an accused party (OP, Ruger, Herter's) won't settle out of court,
    there's going to be a forensic examination of the revolver.

    Presumably the frame and cylinder would get a close visual exam.

    They'll look for bulges and cracks
    as signs of overpressure at the time of the accident.

    They'll also look at frame erosion on the top strap from the
    gap between the cylinder and forcing cone, just in case it
    hints that the gun had been run hard in the past.

    The RugerForum thread GP-100 cracked forcing cone
    has photos of damaged barrel stubs and frames,
    and lots of commentary on properly fitting a barrel to a frame,
    especially a barrel whose damaged forcing cone has been
    trimmed the way a reloader trims an over-length case.


    But from what we read here, the star pieces of evidence are
    the detached barrel and the stub sitting inside the frame.


    And if the frame shows no evidence of having contributed to the failure,
    the forensic examination of the stub will really, really want to avoid
    disturbing the fracture site or the stub bore. After all, this very thread
    has two wildly different explanations for the appearance of the failure site -
    either corrosion (signs of stress corrosion cracking?),
    or just soot deposited from the fireball after the barrel separated.

    I've never removed a barrel from a revolver,
    let alone a busted off stub inside the frame.

    But it wouldn't surprise me if the metallurgist
    sawed apart the frame at the yoke to remove the stub
    rather than mark it up by trying to unscrew it.

    So the frame may end up not even making a good beer tap handle.


    I can well believe that the OP's guest is well on the way to being fully healed.

    It may be difficult for the man or wife to follow through on getting
    guns for self-defense after this baptism by fire, but I'd hope that OP
    was successful in conveying that this was a very uncommon event,
    which no one (on his end) could have prevented.

    But it's a rash assumption that the guy will absolutely shrug off the kaboom
    like he was Jed Clampett bruising a shoulder
    from a hard day of smooth-bore possum shopping.
     
  26. AMV

    AMV

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    this was my reasoning on the matter, no obstruction in the bore and no bulged barrel...... no squib
     
  27. AMV

    AMV

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    If barrel popped off first their would likely be 2 obstruction left in the bore of the barrel
     
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  28. n1bsbri

    n1bsbri NES Member

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    Yes, you are missing where the OP stated that the barrel was clear of obstruction.
     
  29. Nick Fury

    Nick Fury

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    I'm trying to picture the barrel flying 20 yards without obstruction. In one picture it appears most of the crack was there prior with the final part giving way in the 7-10 o clock area. The bullet must have pulled the sheared barrel and shroud along as it exited the muzzle and travelled in a fairly straight trajectory.

    At least that is how the physics of this works in my mind...
     
  30. Dennis in MA

    Dennis in MA NES Member

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    Clearly there is but one multi-part solution.

    1. Go to Ruger Headquarters.

    2. Ask to use the bathroom.

    2a. Be sure to have had lots of Taco Bell the previous day. Like 12 Bean Burritos or something.

    3. Upper decker with half yer poo.

    4. Put other half of poo in a paper bag.

    5. Walk out. Light bag of poo on fire on their doorstep. Ring bell. Run.


    They'll have it coming and going. THEN they will call YOU to fix your revolver. No question.



    I had an old Brown Bess proof-marked by PR himself. It bulged. I did this to Revereware in Maine. Got a new gun. If it don't last 300 years, it's a POS.
     

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