ATF: Permit to Carry Satisfies Background Check

[loneranger]

Well at least in Minnesota...

Minnesota residents with permits to carry handguns may now be able to purchase guns from licensed dealers without the normally required background checks.

ATF determined that Minnesota’s requirements for getting a permit to carry satisfy the background check requirements under federal law for purchasing a firearm.

That means carry permits with expiration dates of Aug. 1, 2019, or later, now qualify as alternatives to usual the FBI instant background checks (call-in).

ATF Assistant Director Marvin Richardson notes that the change applies only to Minnesota’s permit to carry and not its permit to purchase.

http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2017/04/28/permit-to-carry-background-check/

http://www.coltforum.com/forums/lou...minates-requirement-atf-background-check.html

 

[Thinking]

I never understood the background checks for LTC holders.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

MA LTCs used to qualify in the early days of NICS, but no longer do.

One of the sticking points is that a permit may be valid for no linger than 5 years to qualify for a NICS exception.

 

[MachineHead]

MA LTCs used to qualify in the early days of NICS, but no longer do.

One of the sticking points is that a permit may be valid for no linger than 5 years to qualify for a NICS exception.

(i) A license to carry or possess firearms shall be valid, unless revoked or suspended, for a period of not more than 6 years from the date of issue and shall expire on the anniversary of the licensee's date of birth occurring not less than 5 years nor more than 6 years from the date of issue; provided, however, that, if the licensee applied for renewal before the license expired, the license shall remain valid after its expiration date for all lawful purposes until the application for renewal is approved or denied.

I'm wondering if any town in MA would be willing to do a 5 year license per applicant request.

NICS exemption: https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/27/478.102#d

 

[Rob Boudrie]

I'm wondering if any town in MA would be willing to do a 5 year license per applicant request.

The ATF publishes an "exemption list", and inclusion is based on the statutory requirement for the LTC. Have a 5 year license issued when the statute allows up to 6 will not qualify for inclusion on that list.

 

[MisterHappy]

I'm wondering if any town in MA would be willing to do a 5 year license per applicant request.

NICS exemption: https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/27/478.102#d

The State issues the license, per Mass General Laws. The local PD is just the agent. Kind of like the Post Office clerk "vetting" your paperwork on a passport application.

 

[MachineHead]

The ATF publishes an "exemption list", and inclusion is based on the statutory requirement for the LTC. Have a 5 year license issued when the statute allows up to 6 will not qualify for inclusion on that list.

https://www.sadtrombone.com/

 

[drgrant]

MA LTCs used to qualify in the early days of NICS, but no longer do.

One of the sticking points is that a permit may be valid for no linger than 5 years to qualify for a NICS exception.

I thought tge real problem was AG concurrence with BATFE, which would never happen here- which is why it didn't under the 4yr license.

 

[Spanz]

i like this. but wonder about things slipping thru. like you have an LTC. But they notice you just came back from Iran where you did some sort of "training", and are out on bail for possession of explosive materials found in your car. Just because they did not confiscate your LTC, are you still "good to go"?

 

[drgrant]

i like this. but wonder about things slipping thru. like you have an LTC. But they notice you just came back from Iran where you did some sort of "training", and are out on bail for possession of explosive materials found in your car. Just because they did not confiscate your LTC, are you still "good to go"?

Not sure what you're getting at, that it might be porous? NiCS is inherently porous anyways, anyone who doesn't care about felonies can defeat NICS anyways, the whole system is based on the assumption that the ID someone supplies is legit, etc.

 

[MisterHappy]

i like this. but wonder about things slipping thru. like you have an LTC. But they notice you just came back from Iran where you did some sort of "training", and are out on bail for possession of explosive materials found in your car. Just because they did not confiscate your LTC, are you still "good to go"?

If you've not been convicted of a crime, why should your rights be restricted?

If you're such a danger, why are you out on bail?

 

[RImike]

Those in RI with a town issued permit (11-47-11) are exempt from the wait as well.

 

[Kevin_NH]

NICS check exemption covers 25 US states

The ATF's "Permanent Brady Permit Chart" hasn't been updated in nearly 3 years.

With the addition of Minnesota, half of US states have a NICS check exemption for CHL holders (not counting California)

 

[Mr. Brownstone]

I wonder if this applies to non resident permits. The ATF list doesnt differentiate.

ETA: the list says Utah qualifies. However, doubtful that a MA FFL would skip the NICS check, even if allowed.

 

[FatBastard]

...

 

[AntiHippie]

If you've not been convicted of a crime, why should your rights be restricted?

If you're such a danger, why are you out on bail?

I agree with this.


I also agree that the activist bleeding heart judges that make this argument a hard sell should be held personally liable as criminal accomplices.

 

[Kevin_NH]

I wonder if this applies to non resident permits. The ATF list doesnt differentiate. ETA: the list says Utah qualifies. However, doubtful that a MA FFL would skip the NICS check, even if allowed.

The exception is written as "was issued not more than 5 years earlier by the State in which the transfer is to take place", so a Utah permit only works in Utah.

 

[drgrant]

I wonder if this applies to non resident permits. The ATF list doesnt differentiate.

ETA: the list says Utah qualifies. However, doubtful that a MA FFL would skip the NICS check, even if allowed.

 

[Rob Boudrie]

However, doubtful that a MA FFL would skip the NICS check, even if allowed.

Unlike the MA AG, the ATF provides written guidelines and will also provide written answers to specific questions from licensees.

I doubt any MA FFL would have trouble skipping the NICS check if they had a formal document from the BATFE stating it is not required.

 

[drgrant]

I also agree that the activist bleeding heart judges that make this argument a hard sell should be held personally liable as criminal accomplices.

The truly hard sell is getting people to believe in the importance of liberty and to put it ahead of any perceived notion of "safety".

Even if most judges were hard-line tomorrow, most "emotionally weak americans" wouldn't go for getting rid of garbage like prohibited person or lautenberg.

Out of all the things that are great about our country, it's probably the single biggest thing I'm most ashamed of. This country is soft when it comes to that
stuff. Really soft.

-Mike

 

[timbo]

The truly hard sell is getting people to believe in the importance of liberty and to put it ahead of any perceived notion of "safety".

Even if most judges were hard-line tomorrow, most "emotionally weak americans" wouldn't go for getting rid of garbage like prohibited person or lautenberg.

Out of all the things that are great about our country, it's probably the single biggest thing I'm most ashamed of. This country is soft when it comes to that
stuff. Really soft.

-Mike

^^^^^ Exactly this ^^^^^