ATF, LAPD seize massive collection of weapons at Holmby Hills home update post 120

[Behind Enemy Lines]

If it turns out to be nothing.

They've gone too far to allow that, they'll fabricate it if needed.

 

[namedpipes]

Cruel world. Those will all probably be destroyed or taken home under the table and sold to criminals.

Wouldn't it be nice if instead they were lotteried off randomly to citizens? Or raffled for charity.

Or even returned to the owner with an apology...

 

[Zappa]

There's some speculation that the guy was an FFL that went out of business/closed shop, and that
was his inventory.

Makes sense given the sheer volume, condition and quality of the firearms.

Sounds plausible.
The two 1927A1's look brand new, they still have the hang tags on the triggerguard.

 

[KBCraig]

Looks like you're fairly close in your assessment. The LA Times is reporting that "The ATF said in a statement that its agents searched the home after discovering an individual illegally selling firearms “outside the scope of the federal firearm license that the individual possesses.”

At face value, that sounds like some 03 CRFFL crossed that fuzzy line of "too many" sales, which isn't defined in law.

Note that they said the individual does possess an FFL.

That could also tie into "manufacturing", but I would think we'd see a lot of "ghost gun 80% fully semi-automatic silencers" if that was the case.

But, it's California. FFLs must abide by all state laws, so if "the individual" violated CA laws, he also violated the terms of his FFL.

 

[KBCraig]

"Lots of guns" = enough of an excuse for ATF to be involved.

"Opportunity for front-page national news" = enough of an excuse for ATF to be involved.

Remember that they intentionally manufactured the assault on Waco in an attempt to get more funding from Congress.

 

[Reptile]

Can we all agree on this...

It's more than a cache.

It's more than a medley.

Possibly more than an ensemble.

 

[KBCraig]

"The man was arrested on suspicion of unlawful transportation, and of giving, lending or selling an assault weapon, according to the LAPD."

So... California version of an improper storage violation.

 

[TLB]

"The man was arrested on suspicion of unlawful transportation, and of giving, lending or selling an assault weapon, according to the LAPD."

So... California version of an improper storage violation.

Yep, nothing that should be illegal.

 

[308rifleman]

The FFL thing does make sense now.
If it turns out to be nothing , you have to wonder how much the guy lost in devaluation after they took them out of boxes to beat the piss out of them or how much of that inventory is going to take a walk out of the evidence room if it even makes it there.

I recall a story from the Clinton ATF days where they supposedly got a tip that a collector might have something illegal.
They waited till he went to work , knocked the door off the hinges and blowtorched his safe.
The neighbor was franticly trying to contact the guy at work to tell him his house was being ripped apart.
By the time he got the message and got home he found a note saying that a search was conducted and nothing illegal was found.
The door was on the floor and his guns were strewn all over the house and the place was trashed.
I remember there was even a picture of a high end revolver in the dog's water bowl.
They didn't even leave anyone to secure the place.
The guy raised holy hell and the ATF's response was "Ya ? GFY , what are you going to do about it ?"
Ah yes the Clinton years , scary as shit to be an FFL in those days.

John Lawmaster. My wife's family knows him. Lived in southern Louisiana for a while before moving to Oklahoma. He had an argument with some dude. The dude called ATF and said that Lawmaster was in possession of M16 auto sears that he manufactured himself and never registered. That is the weird part. Lawmaster was old school. He disliked the M16 and everything about it. He wouldn't take one as a gift! His guns were what we here at NES would call FUDD. guns, but I think he owned an M1. Not sure if Garand or Carbine, though.

 

[Mountain]

what pisses me off is that they discard the packing boxes (in the white truck) and just dump the guns willy nilly on the ground like a pile of shit.

Right or wrong, it's someone's property and those scumbags have no respect or care. Those are not shitty trunk guns, some nice finishes there. Dumping them in the pile is just hurtful. Hopefully the heros can go home without breaking a fingernail, tonight.

Guns = Guilty Until Proven Guilty

 

[Rat187]

sloppy presentation.... ;{>

 

[rep308]

Some nice revolvers in that pile, what a shame

 

[namedpipes]

John Lawmaster. My wife's family knows him. Lived in southern Louisiana for a while before moving to Oklahoma. He had an argument with some dude. The dude called ATF and said that Lawmaster was in possession of M16 auto sears that he manufactured himself and never registered. That is the weird part. Lawmaster was old school. He disliked the M16 and everything about it. He wouldn't take one as a gift! His guns were what we here at NES would call FUDD. guns, but I think he owned an M1. Not sure if Garand or Carbine, though.

So, slander, false accusation, lying to federal agent. Hopefully the "dude" served time...

 

[Bmcl322]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FdizL4on-Rc

 

[308rifleman]

So, slander, false accusation, lying to federal agent. Hopefully the "dude" served time...

The general feeling among the members of my wife's family that knew Lawmaster was that he was the victim of an attempted "sting" operation that went wrong. The argument started at a gun show. Lawmaster met one of his dealers at the show and wanted to do a trade. Lawmaster had one rifle and one shotgun to trade. This dude appears out of nowhere and offers Lawmaster cash on the spot, no paperwork. Lawmastet refused and said that the sale is going through his FFL, buyer pays transfer fee. Dude got mad and started ranting that he is Choctaw and that Native Americans are exempt from federal gun laws. Lawmaster told the dude to get lost. As Lawmaster left the show, he noticed several men and one woman milling about in the parking lot and taking photos. This dude was talking with them. The raid on Lawmaster's house took place a few weeks later.

 

[xtry51]

ATF guys entrapping people? Say it ain't so...

 

[fshalor]

Moonbats neighbors confirmed by article:

Neighbors were appalled to hear about the discovery and arrest.

"I would never, ever think anybody would be wanting to pack so much in this neighborhood. It scares the wits out of you," said Rabbi Chaim Mentz. "What does my next door neighbor have? What does your next door neighbor have?"

The real question is: when has that next door neighbor harmed anyone physically or financially with malice. Where is the victim?

 

[Dadstoys]

They've gone too far to allow that, they'll fabricate it if needed.

You are spot on there.
A friend who was military LE went to a multi agency training seminar and some of those clowns were there and openly bragged about crap like that.
They made an impression, just not the one they thought.

 

[mikeyp]

Someone's out on bail

Man arrested after LAPD seizes massive gun collection at Holmby Hills mansion | abc7.com

 

[beaker]

It is unclear how Saenz and Beck are connected...

I think i know how he connects to her.

You can see the "premium" blanket clearly with the best rifles and they are already tagging them by rank.

 

[bmac10]

You falsely assume that popo gives a shit about your private property

sorry - should have put sarcasm emoticon on it.

 

[bmac10]

It is unclear how Saenz and Beck are connected...

I think i know how he connects to her.

You can see the "premium" blanket clearly with the best rifles and they are already tagging them by rank.

Hah! good one!

 

[meh]

If this turns out to be BS then I’m sure they’ve scratched and dented the f*** out of those guns. I look at the pictures and cringe at how they’re being treated.

Yeah. There's some footage where a cop is tossing an empty rifle box into a truck full of boxes. Looks like they took a lot of those guns out of their boxes to stack them up like that.

 

[Len-2A Training]

Yeah. There's some footage where a cop is tossing an empty rifle box into a truck full of boxes. Looks like they took a lot of those guns out of their boxes to stack them up like that.

It's a very poor photo-op if it's pictures of stacked cartons. You can be certain that all the cartons went to rubbish. When they are done inventorying the guns they'll be junk too.

 

[mikeyp]

He's been charged

A man has been charged after police found more than 1,000 guns in his Los Angeles home - CNN

(CNN)A Los Angeles man found with more than 1,000 guns in his Bel-Air home in May was charged with 64 felony counts, the Los Angeles County District Attorney's Office said Monday.

Girard Damian Saenz, 58, is charged with 23 counts of possession of an assault weapon, 17 counts of transfer of handgun with no licensed firearms dealer, 15 counts of unlawful assault weapon/.50 Browning Machine Gun rifle activity, seven counts of possession of a short-barreled rifle or shotgun, and two counts of possession of a destructive device, the office said.
State law prohibits the manufacture, distribution, transportation, importation and sale of any assault rifle or .50 BMG rifles, except in specific circumstances, according to the California Legislature.
Saenz pleaded not guilty during a Monday morning arraignment at the Los Angeles Superior Court. If convicted of the charges, he could face up to nearly 49 years in prison.


When he was arrested, authorities said there was no indication Saenz used the guns in crimes.
'A hoarder's house'
Saenz's property resembled "a hoarder's house" and it took 30 law enforcement officers more than 15 hours to clear the house and remove all the weapons, a law enforcement official familiar with the investigation told CNN.
In aerial footage from the scene, hundreds of guns are seen scattered on what appeared to be blankets in the driveway. The weapons ranged from handguns to rifles. Police were seen taking inventory.

Los Angeles police share this image of the ammunition that officers found at the house.
A law enforcement official said back in May they had not found any evidence linking Saenz to terrorism.
CNN's Cheri Mossburg and Amanda Jackson contributed to this report.

 

[PaulR]

Still want the Thompson.....
Still impressed with the guns....
But the ammo, not so much....
That picture is barely a full 2 shelves....That's like a level rate amount: Use any, buy more.....any type of news scare, need to buy more.
I'm guessing most NES'rs are not impressed with this ammo pic.

 

[commodon]

There's some speculation that the guy was an FFL that went out of business/closed shop, and that
was his inventory.

Makes sense given the sheer volume, condition and quality of the firearms.

Ayup, I read the following in regards and note the last sentence...

Girard Damien Saenz, 57, was arrested on suspicion of illegal manufacture, distribution or sale of assault weapons. Police discovered massive cache of rifles, ammunition, and other weapons at a ritzy home in Bel-Air. Saenz was released on Thursday morning after posting a $50,000 bond, according to jail records.

The LAPD and the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms served a search warrant Wednesday morning on the home at 111 N. Beverly Glen Blvd. The home is owned by Cynthia Beck, who was once a mistress of Gordon P. Getty, the fourth child of oil baron J. Paul Getty. Gordon Getty, now 85, is an opera composer and philanthropist who lives in San Francisco. In 1999, he acknowledged that he had three children with Beck, who were living in Los Angeles.

Beck bought the Bel-Air mansion for $2.6 million in 2001. It has five bedrooms, eight bathrooms and 8,229 square feet, according to L.A. County Assessor’s records. Redfin estimates it is now worth more than $7 million.

Beck and Saenz co-own several other properties in Los Angeles and San Francisco, according to property records. Saenz has had a contractor’s license since 1994, under the name Gerry Saenz and Associates.

According to the ATF, Saenz has a federal firearms license, but the agency was investigating whether he was dealing weapons outside the restrictions of the license. In an interview, ATF spokeswoman Ginger Colbrun said that Saenz had an “03” license, which allows collectors to obtain “curios and relics,” but does not permit gun sales.

Saenz has not been charged with a crime, and it is not clear whether he will be charged in state or federal court. Agents and officers are still working to catalog the vast stash of weapons.