ATF intends to reclassify and ban "armor piercing" ammo including M855

[Nation On Fire]

"Buy now while the prices are low so that they become jacked up overnight". Gotta love the paradox we create for ourselves. And nothing will change.

 

[IvIax]

People don't need to panic buy. Don't we all have some secret stashes like this?

 

[the_shootist]

People don't need to panic buy. Don't we all have some secret stashes like this?
View attachment 128338

That's nuts....is that yours???

 

[economist]

Well, I guess the upside to all of this is more ammunition in the public's hands. Assuming sensible storage there will be plenty of ammo available for a long time. Just imagine future estate sales: "Up next, 20,000 rounds of 22r, and don't go away because we have three pallets of 5.56 coming up 5,000 rounds at a time after that. And check out our 'pick-em' barrels of ARs -- $500, your choice"...

 

[bullseye]

Gunbroker asking prices are stupid, 420 round cans are selling for 300 bucks and up and people are paying for it!!!

 

[the_shootist]

Gunbroker asking prices are stupid, 420 round cans are selling for 300 bucks and up and people are paying for it!!!

Panic buying brings out the 'stupid' in many of us

 

[drgrant]

Half of those are probably shill/fakes. They "sell" things at 300 to make the ActualNipplehead(tm) think he's getting a superb deal at $250.

 

[Kevin_NH]

Care to elaborate on how Federal law allows BATFE to get rid of "non-sporting" rounds unless the rounds meet one of the two definitions (i or ii) of AP in 18 USC § 921(a)(17)](B)?

yea, they just make a new definition, whats to stop them?

So far BATFE is working within the definitions written into Federal law. I don't expect BATFE to attempt to rewrite 18 USC § 921(a)(17)](B), just to push the limits of the definitions in the law as passed by congress and signed by President Reagan.

 

[the_shootist]

Half of those are probably shill/fakes. They "sell" things at 300 to make the ActualNipplehead(tm) think he's getting a superb deal at $250.

Very true!!!

 

[Coyote33]

So far BATFE is working within the definitions written into Federal law. I don't expect BATFE to attempt to rewrite 18 USC § 921(a)(17)](B), just to push the limits of the definitions in the law as passed by congress and signed by President Reagan.

Wait, they write laws now? Last I knew, congress writes laws.

P.S. Funny thing, spell check changed laws to flaws!

 

[Toe Knee]

bureaucracy(/bjuːˈɒkrəsi/) is "a body of non-elective government officials" and/or "an administrative policy-making group".

This is bureaucracy at it's slimiest. i challenge anyone to point out a bigger murder of our rights as bureaucracy.

 

[exo]

bureaucracy(/bjuːˈɒkrəsi/) is "a body of non-elective government officials" and/or "an administrative policy-making group".

This is bureaucracy at it's slimiest. i challenge anyone to point out a bigger murder of our rights as bureaucracy.

It's odd you say it that way, because the ATF did murder people at Ruby Ridge and Waco, and got away with it.

 

[Toe Knee]

oh...and nobody panic....I have 150 rounds of this that I'm willing to trade for either 22lr or non reloaded 9mm....lol....can't blame a guy for trying.

 

[Toe Knee]

It's odd you say it that way, because the ATF did murder people at Ruby Ridge and Waco, and got away with it.

not quite what I meant but maybe I'm a genius and I didn't even know it.....(no-probably not.)

 

[DispositionMatrix]

No mentions of this trend anywhere on social media (Twitter and Instagram) that I can see.

It's been in Reddit's Twitter feed for over 18 hours.
http://www.reddit.com/r/guns/comments/2vugtw/the_atf_has_reclassified_ss109_and_m855_as_armor/
http://www.reddit.com/r/weekendgunn...al_talk_for_a_minute_my_letter_to_the_atf_in/

 

[economist]

I just looked around for amusement's sake -- and all of the M855 is gone. That didn't take long.

 

[jron]

I just looked around for amusement's sake -- and all of the M855 is gone. That didn't take long.

It was gone yesterday

 

[soloman02]

M193 is almost gone as well...

 

[xtry51]

Gunbroker asking prices are stupid, 420 round cans are selling for 300 bucks and up and people are paying for it!!!

Not high enough yet. I'm still waiting for it to go over $1 a round before I start liquidating at a staggering profit.

 

[NHCraigT]

More XM855 Listed here: http://www.ammunitiondepot.com/Federal-Lake-City-5-56mm-62-Grain-XM855-Ammo-p/xm855bk150.htm





And ....... the buying frenzy (with the standard price-gouging pattern) continues: http://www.gunbroker.com/All/BI.aspx?Keywords=xm855

 

[jron]

regular .223/5.56 is going up fast to. SHITT. right after I book a vacation. well there goes any free money I had.

 

[SKS Ray]

Heh. I went through all this when they banned 5.45x39 steel core and during the whole Russian sanctions scare. 7.62x39 is still cheap and available.

The world won't end tomorrow. Relax.

 

[Nation On Fire]

I'm done panic buying. Now's the time for me to buy mags, lowers, bcg's, hollow points, pistol ammo, 7.62 etc etc. stuff that no one cares about right now but will be freaking out over next time around.

 

[Harpua]

I'll wait to buy xm855 until after this doesn't come to fruition and people are unloading their stashes so they can afford that shiny new toy.

 

[Varmint]

Four Seasons had AE XM193 for $150 for 500 a couple weeks ago, they had a pallet of the stuff - shoulda bought more than 1, grrr.

 

[soloman02]

So far BATFE is working within the definitions written into Federal law. I don't expect BATFE to attempt to rewrite 18 USC § 921(a)(17)](B), just to push the limits of the definitions in the law as passed by congress and signed by President Reagan.

Except they are not working within those definitions. They have gone outside them. Even if the jacket is greater than 25% of the weight of the round, the round is not intended for use in a handgun. Thus it still wouldn't meet the definition of the law.


My letter to the ATF:

To ATF Director B. Todd Jones,

I am writing to you to express my great displeasure that you have decided to ignore current law and arbitrarily and capriciously ban the 5.56mm ammunition commonly known as M855.

18 USC § 921(a)(17) states:

(B) The term “armor piercing ammunition” means—
(i) a projectile or projectile core which may be used in a handgun and which is constructed entirely (excluding the presence of traces of other substances) from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass, bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium; or
(ii) a full jacketed projectile larger than .22 caliber designed and intended for use in a handgun and whose jacket has a weight of more than 25 percent of the total weight of the projectile.


M855 contains a steel penetrator with a lead core. Thus this bullet does not meet section (i) of the law since the core is not made up entirely of one of the listed metals. Further, M855 still does not meet section (ii) for two reasons: The jacket is not over 25% of the total weight of the projectile, and even if it were the projectile is NOT intended for use in a handgun. The intent for the projectile was for use in the M249 SAW and in the civilian market to be used in a semi-automatic rifle, just like every other variation of the 5.56mm caliber.

So what this means is that this proposal is in violation of the law. Only congress has the legal authority to designate M855 as "armor piercing" since it requires changes to the wording of this statute to do so.

I would also like to point out that in the SCOTUS decision handed down in 2008, Heller, there is a "common use" exemption. Well, M855 is one of the most commonly produced and used variants of the 5.56mm caliber and thus meets that requirement.

And lastly, under the second amendment of the US Constitution, which states in part "shall not be infringed," we the people have a right to buy any type of ammunition we want to use. If that ammunition were to happen to be used against bureaucratic tyrants who willfully and knowingly violate the law, well, too bad for them. Maybe they should follow the law congress wrote.

Have a nice day,

 

[The Russian 1021]

Lets get on the offensive people, and petition this shit.

Petition for m855
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/stop-batfe-banning-xm855-ammunition/XrvVh1cj

Petition for 7N6
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/revoke-batfe-ban-7n6-ammunition/cLwKtXGv

And spam all the forums you know with these links, becuase if everyone does thier part we can end this once and for all. We need to show the ATF and Obama Admin that we dont want this shit.

 

[Mass-diver]

Except they are not working within those definitions. They have gone outside them. Even if the jacket is greater than 25% of the weight of the round, the round is not intended for use in a handgun. Thus it still wouldn't meet the definition of the law.


My letter to the ATF:

It's blowback for all the people rocking sig braces.

 

[Toe Knee]

.................

 

[Tracer1951]

That's nuts....is that yours???

Those are empty ammo cans...you cam tell by the yellow tape...
the yellow tape is used by inspectors to verify the can have been inspected and they are empty...